Coa Rules In Redden-Clark Case

[freemannabis]

in the vilest and most treacherous of all battles ... for Our TRUE FREEDOM from paramilitary oppressors and tyrannical warmongers.

 

http://coa.courts.mi.gov/resources/asp/ViewDocket.asp?casenumber=295809&yr=0&inqtype=public

 

here's a link to the latest decision as related to in an earlier post:

 

http://coa.courts.mi.gov/documents/opinions/final/coa/20100914_c295809_45_295809c.opn.pdf

 

And, here's the latest "news":

 

http://www.detnews.com/article/20100915/METRO02/9150422/Judge-urges-Michigan-lawmakers-to-fix-medical-marijuana-law

 

Thank YOU, Bob and Torey, for "Carrying the Flag" of our emblem of Universal Healing - for ALL of US!

 

And, please, remember: we're ALL with you!

 

ALL The Way to The Supreme Court - if need be!

 

That is ... if "We The People" of Michigan / America don't already succeed in our communal, compassionate efforts to FREE The CURE before then!

 

Now, I've got some heavy reviewing and reflecting to do!

 

(Before I can be all the more properly responsive!)

 

Be FREE!

 

CANNABIS CURES - Without Fears.

 

FREE The CURE!

[freemannabis]

in the vilest and most treacherous of all battles ... for Our TRUE FREEDOM from paramilitary oppressors and tyrannical warmongers.

 

http://coa.courts.mi.gov/resources/asp/ViewDocket.asp?casenumber=295809&yr=0&inqtype=public

 

here's a link to the latest decision as related to in an earlier post:

 

http://coa.courts.mi.gov/documents/opinions/final/coa/20100914_c295809_45_295809c.opn.pdf

 

And, here's the latest "news":

 

http://www.detnews.com/article/20100915/METRO02/9150422/Judge-urges-Michigan-lawmakers-to-fix-medical-marijuana-law

 

Thank YOU, Bob and Torey, for "Carrying the Flag" of our emblem of Universal Healing - for ALL of US!

 

And, please, remember: we're ALL with you!

 

ALL The Way to The Supreme Court - if need be!

 

That is ... if "We The People" of Michigan / America don't already succeed in our communal, compassionate efforts to FREE The CURE before then!

 

Now, I've got some heavy reviewing and reflecting to do!

 

(Before I can be all the more properly responsive!)

 

Be FREE!

 

CANNABIS CURES - Without Fears.

 

FREE The CURE!

 

Umm ...not to sound picky, but ... when somene moved my topic to this thread they left the header off of my message.

 

What's up with that?!

 

Can that be remedied?

 

Thanks!

 

FREE The Cure!

[peanutbutter]

Bob Redden on planetgreentrees right now with attorney Michael K.

[+RevThad]

Joe,

 

I completely agree that the concurring opinion is a disgusting piece of writing. Thank God it is not the binding ruling, as it is still technically the minority view of the court. It is almost a complete opposite reading of the majority opinion, and the only reason it is in concurrence is because of the remand.

 

With all due respect, I wonder how the Honorable Justice P.J. O'Connell can look in the mirror. The opinion put forth by this justice is draconian and shows his contempt for the people of this state. Especially when he makes claims such as:

 

Further, the MMMA does not create any sort of affirmative right under state law to use or

possess marijuana.

 

The MMMA does not codify a right to use marijuana; instead, it merely provides a procedure

through which seriously ill individuals using marijuana

 

 

and

 

while

permitting prosecution under the Public Health Code if the individual fails to meet any of the

requirements set forth by the MMMA.

 

 

 

and

 

I have no doubt that in the minds of some voters in this state, legalizing marijuana would be

good public policy. Others who approved this act were under the impression that the act’s

specific purpose was limited to permitting the use of medical marijuana by registered patients

with debilitating medical conditions.

 

 

 

After reading this "Justice's" opinion, it has become quite clear to me that this person has issues comprehending simple words. Further this judge seems to want to legislate from the bench and change the meanings of certain words such as "shall not". This judge refuses to recognize that clause in the protections of registered patients and caregivers. Too, he goes on to miss the point of the later clause:

 

(d) There shall be a presumption that a qualifying patient or primary caregiver is engaged in the medical use of marihuana in accordance with this act if the qualifying patient or primary caregiver:

 

(1) is in possession of a registry identification card; and

 

(2) is in possession of an amount of marihuana that does not exceed the amount allowed under this act. The presumption may be rebutted by evidence that conduct related to marihuana was not for the purpose of alleviating the qualifying patient's debilitating medical condition or symptoms associated with the debilitating medical condition, in accordance with this act.

Even under the most draconian readings of this clause, the presumption would be that of compliance with the law, unless proven that the patient or caregiver is violating the MMMA, they are still protected from arrest. Meaning, that there would need to be some sort of hearing prior to the arrest...

 

Then again, maybe common sense and reading comprehension are not necessary to be a Justice on the COA these days..

[TajMahal]

Amen!

 

To bad about the sorry state of our court system.

[Guest thequietone]

Umm ...not to sound picky, but ... when somene moved my topic to this thread they left the header off of my message.

 

What's up with that?!

 

Can that be remedied?

 

Thanks!

 

FREE The Cure!

 

When threads are merged they will be listed under the one header that was posted first I believe. We had several threads on this topic and decided it would be better to keep them all on one thread.

[+Jennifer8]

so now what we go to jail because of the Doctor

You made a very clear point.

[DenturesLost]

 

 

The concurring opinion is a nightmare.

 

The concurring opinion doesn't matter. It's the concurring opinion. The vote matters but what the opinion reads has no bearing on the law.

[bobandtorey]

well the way i see things is they COA is going to let the PA have another shot at it this is going to start all over again

 

but we will still win as the COA said we can use the AD that is the best news i got from it

[Danielshemp]

The saga continues. I know this isn't the decision you were hoping for, Bob. I wish it was over for you. The process will take a while, but I believe the MMMA will prevail. Is there a link for your defense fund?

[+Jennifer8]

I agree, a LOT of people are in your corner.

 

I can't imagine if either of you have even had a good nights sleep. I know this is very strenuous, but also remember, it's not over yet.

[bobandtorey]

The saga continues. I know this isn't the decision you were hoping for, Bob. I wish it was over for you. The process will take a while, but I believe the MMMA will prevail. Is there a link for your defense fund?

 

 

No i was hoping the MMMA would help us set something up the money would go to the Lawyers

[bobandtorey]

I agree, a LOT of people are in your corner.

 

I can't imagine if either of you have even had a good nights sleep. I know this is very strenuous, but also remember, it's not over yet.

 

 

It's not over i think that every body will have to go back to court again the Doctor will be their again i guess

 

and will say the same thing the PA wants are Med records but she will not get them with out a fight

 

we have nothing to hid it's just the point

[bobandtorey]

http://www.dailytribune.com/articles/2010/09/16/news/srv0000009407114.txt#blogcomments

DETROIT — A Michigan appeals court judge sounded an alarm Wednesday over the state's medical-marijuana law, issuing an extraordinary 30-page opinion that called the law a complex maze and urged state officials to set clear rules.

 

Judge Peter O'Connell was part of a three-judge panel that affirmed a decision by a lower court to reinstate drug charges against two people in Oakland County who were caught with marijuana plants last year. A doctor had said they would benefit from medical marijuana, but they didn't get a state card until it became available a month later.

 

O'Connell went a step further in the ruling, issuing a separate concurring opinion that referred to a Harry Potter book and quoted poet Robert Frost and William Shakespeare. He warned that marijuana users "who proceed without due caution" could "lose both their property and their liberty" if they run afoul of the state's fledgling law, approved by voters in 2008.

 

He said prosecutors, defense lawyers and police were at times scratching their heads over how to follow it. O'Connell said Michigan's law clashed with federal law and other state laws, and lacked clear authority for doctors, people who want to use marijuana and businesses that want to dispense it.

 

"Our legislative and administrative officials must make a choice: They can either clarify the law with legislative refinements and a comprehensive set of administrative rules, or they can do nothing," the judge wrote. "In this situation, no decision is, in fact, a decision to do nothing."

 

Voters approved the use of marijuana to ease debilitating conditions such as cancer, HIV, glaucoma and other illnesses. The law also allows people to grow marijuana for patients approved to use it.

 

The judge noted that patients or their caregivers may grow marijuana, but there isn't a provision for the legal purchase of marijuana seeds or plants.

 

"Another oddity is that the act allows a patient to possess 2.5 ounces of marijuana and 12 plants," the judge wrote. "What is the legal consequence if the plants are all harvested at the same time and they happen to produce more than 2.5 ounces?"

 

O'Connell also pointed out that 18-year-old high school students possibly could use medical marijuana, yet the law states that marijuana can't be possessed at schools.

 

The judge said reading the law was like participating in the Triwizard Tournament in J.K. Rowling's "Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire."

 

"The maze that is this statute is so complex that the final result will only be known once the Supreme Court has had an opportunity to review and remove the haze from this act," said O'Connell, a former prosecutor and trial judge who was first elected to the appeals court in 1994.

 

"The judge had a lot of things to say about medical marijuana. I don't necessarily agree with the conclusions he's reached," said Robert Mullen, the attorney for the two people caught with marijuana plants.

 

Berrien County Prosecutor Arthur Cotter said the judge's opinion was a "great service," but it would take another vote by Michigan residents or approval by 75 percent of the Legislature to make changes.

 

"There are a lot of flaws," Cotter said. "It was passed by public initiative. There wasn't any legislative debate. Some provisions are very ambiguous."

 

 

[+RevThad]

What a biased story. The fact that they focused mainly on O'Connell's opinion is an attempt to poison the well.

 

I admit that I am biased when I read the opinions of the COA, however I am intellectually honest enough to admit when there are reasonable points made that I disagree with. There were no reasonable positions raised in the concurring opinion, and I am glad that his words are not binding on us in this matter.

 

The man suggested that even patients that meet all of the criteria of the MMMA would be violating state law, and thus criminals. He suggested that folks were still violating the Michigan Health Codes, and were merely unarrestable at the whim of prosecutors and local sheriffs.

 

It is quite obvious that the Honorable P.J. O'Connell cares little for the will of the people, or the intent of the law. He has some unknown axe to grind against the people and medical marijuana. Even though he cannot see or refuses to admit the intent of the people who voted for the ballot initiative, it is very clear to see what his intent is. More prohibition.

[solabeirtan]

What a pompous arrogant opinion, though very verbose they maybe, they are as out of touch as the referals to X-generation heroes and villians betrays his mindset, depth, immaturity and lack of experience/understanding. Though they seem to be taboo and little understood concepts in this great country of ours, more so than JK Rowlings adventures is Health Care, just under Creationism and the Founding "Fathers".

 

How petty to pick on the doctor patient relationship. Apparently peoples health and peace of mind are absolutley irrelavent, it's far more important that we bow down to the letter of the Law. This shows how very little exists of the scarcest comodidity found in this country is compassion and understanding. And possibly intelligence. Apparentley nothing is sacred here anymore.

 

It is a miscarraige of justice that this matter persists, as it affects you and Torrey, Bob, it affects each one of us. Especially all the people involved in the MMMA community and at the Top of the List, especially this one(me). Not to mention the millions who voted bravely for some compassion. Congratulations on having endured the Cross for us, thus far. Best of Luck in your future bouts with the miserable wbitch of Miss Justice, may there come a day, when we can say, we'll 'Have it our Way'

 

ps. The reallity is that the First Judge made the right call. All the rest of this Sharade is OverKill. Wanton Gluttonous Wastefull use of Taxpayers Money. Cruel and unusuall punishment. Denial of Justice. Denial of due processs. Right to fair and speedy trial, Denied...

 

Peace! Thank You and Good Fight! no Good nite, thats right ....ahhhh .....

[bobandtorey]

What a pompous arrogant opinion, though very verbose they maybe, they are as out of touch as the referrals to X-generation heroes and villains betrays his mindset, depth, immaturity and lack of experience/understanding. Though they seem to be taboo and little understood concepts in this great country of ours, more so than JK Rowlings adventures is Health Care, just under Creationism and the Founding "Fathers".

 

How petty to pick on the doctor patient relationship. Apparently peoples health and peace of mind are absolutely irrelevant, it's far more important that we bow down to the letter of the Law. This shows how very little exists of the scarcest commodity found in this country is compassion and understanding. And possibly intelligence. Apparently nothing is sacred here anymore.

 

It is a miscarriage of justice that this matter persists, as it affects you and Torrey, Bob, it affects each one of us. Especially all the people involved in the MMMA community and at the Top of the List, especially this one(me). Not to mention the millions who voted bravely for some compassion. Congratulations on having endured the Cross for us, thus far. Best of Luck in your future bouts with the miserable wbitch of Miss Justice, may there come a day, when we can say, we'll 'Have it our Way'

 

PS. The reality is that the First Judge made the right call. All the rest of this Charade is Overkill. Wanton Gluttonous Wasteful use of Taxpayers Money. Cruel and unusual punishment. Denial of Justice. Denial of due process. Right to fair and speedy trial, Denied...

 

Peace! Thank You and Good Fight! no Good nite, thats right ....ahhhh .....

 

so they are going after the Doc: if we did not have a Doc patient Relationship then no one has on that went to any on of the MMJ doc: they the PA is trying to stop the mmj Doc's to slow down the cards being issued

[bobandtorey]

Thanks every body for the support we will be OK It's just going to take some more time this is not over as i always have said that this is not about us It's the MMMA that it wants the Law itself

 

we are not court the Michigan Medical Marihuana Law is in court they the PA of Mich are using be and Torey to try and do their dirty work i have always said that from the start of this hole thing

 

Peace from the Front

[peanutbutter]

Thanks every body for the support we will be OK It's just going to take some more time this is not over as i always have said that this is not about us It's the MMMA that it wants the Law itself

 

we are not court the Michigan Medical Marihuana Law is in court they the PA of Mich are using be and Torey to try and do their dirty work i have always said that from the start of this hole thing

 

Peace from the Front

 

Hi Bob .. I've been thinking. You seem to have a very clear cut case about the confidentiality stuff. They wrote in their records that they took medical marijuana records from you. The very name of your doctor is supposed to be protected.

 

My main point that I've been pushing lately is that officials have violated this law in a way that is supposed to result in them going to jail.

 

The idea of rights has been making it's way into the press.

 

The question about the confidentially of patient and caregiver records has made it into the press.

 

These government officials believe they are above the direct command of the voters. Some have latched on a policy of the maximum repression they can muster, believing it is just to abuse sick and disabled Americans.

 

They refuse to obey the command of the voter. They need to go to jail.

 

The law they refuse to enforce:

 

Section 6 (h) (1)

(1) Applications and supporting information submitted by qualifying patients, including information regarding their primary caregivers and physicians, are confidential.

 

It's the INFORMATION contained in the records that is confidential. And that information includes the name of the doctor. How can a judge require even the name of the doctor, let alone drag the doctor into court.

 

But more, that protected information includes the name of the caregiver. "Bob is Joe's caregiver. Lets go to Bob's house."

 

It's not the files in Lansing that is protected. It is the information that is kept there.

 

And it is very clear that employees of the MDCH are not the only officials that can commit this crime.

 

Section 6 (h) (4) A person, including an employee or official of the department or another state agency or local unit of government, who discloses confidential information in violation of this act is guilty of a misdemeanor, punishable by imprisonment for not more than 6 months, or a fine of not more than $1, 000.00, or both. Notwithstanding this provision, department employees may notify law enforcement about falsified or fraudulent information submitted to the department.

 

I don't believe there has ever been one single time this law has been enforced.

 

We don't need any changes to our law. None at all.

 

What we need is for them to obey the law as written.

[AbsoluteRoyal]

We need 1 good judge like you on our side pb, or a PA or something to set an example and show them that consequences for breaking the law do exist for them.

[peanutbutter]

If government officials need a test case, then they should be willing to provide one.

[westmich]

Well, I am completely sickened. My heart goes out to Bob and Torey. Can we just make a donation to the MMMA and mark it for Bob and Torey?

 

Patient to patient transfer - PROSECUTABLE! Cg to other patient - PROSECUTABLE! Cg to Cg - PROSECUTABLE! Dispensary to patient - PROSECUTABLE! Only Dr recommendation - PROSECUTABLE! Paperwork over 20 days old - PROSECUTABLE! Cg to registered patient for any amount of money - PROSECUTABLE! Patient with card and within limits of the law - PROSECUTABLE!

 

I am reading two huge setbacks out of this. 1) The PA can call the doctor/patient relationship into question for anyone who went to a clinic. So, even if you have a card in hand and are within your limits, you could still be prosecuted and it would be up to a judge or jury to decide if your relationship was "bona fide". 2) Section 4 says a registration card. Not paperwork older than 20 days. Not a doctor's recommendation. You need an actual, physical card for these protections. Section 5 goes on to say that the state has to issue the card within 20 days or the paperwork is good, but I didn't see any mention of this in the ruling. Basically, the state is not complying with section 5 which makes patient not compliant with section 4 by default.

[bobandtorey]

Hi Bob .. I've been thinking. You seem to have a very clear cut case about the confidentiality stuff. They wrote in their records that they took medical marijuana records from you. The very name of your doctor is supposed to be protected.

 

My main point that I've been pushing lately is that officials have violated this law in a way that is supposed to result in them going to jail.

 

The idea of rights has been making it's way into the press.

 

The question about the confidentially of patient and caregiver records has made it into the press.

 

These government officials believe they are above the direct command of the voters. Some have latched on a policy of the maximum repression they can muster, believing it is just to abuse sick and disabled Americans.

 

They refuse to obey the command of the voter. They need to go to jail.

 

The law they refuse to enforce:

 

Section 6 (h) (1)

(1) Applications and supporting information submitted by qualifying patients, including information regarding their primary caregivers and physicians, are confidential.

 

It's the INFORMATION contained in the records that is confidential. And that information includes the name of the doctor. How can a judge require even the name of the doctor, let alone drag the doctor into court.

 

But more, that protected information includes the name of the caregiver. "Bob is Joe's caregiver. Lets go to Bob's house."

 

It's not the files in Lansing that is protected. It is the information that is kept there.

 

And it is very clear that employees of the MDCH are not the only officials that can commit this crime.

 

Section 6 (h) (4) A person, including an employee or official of the department or another state agency or local unit of government, who discloses confidential information in violation of this act is guilty of a misdemeanor, punishable by imprisonment for not more than 6 months, or a fine of not more than $1, 000.00, or both. Notwithstanding this provision, department employees may notify law enforcement about falsified or fraudulent information submitted to the department.

 

I don't believe there has ever been one single time this law has been enforced.

 

We don't need any changes to our law. None at all.

 

What we need is for them to obey the law as written.

Hi! PB am going to be talking to are Laywer soon and am going to share some of these post with him

[mrniceguy8252]

what the flower was the purpose of this law. It has not stopped the cops from raiding us, or harassing us. Our government is going to fall apart soon if they dont watch how they drag us through the mud.

[mrniceguy8252]

bob and torey, I pray for the best. You two have been through hell and back. This is so in fair. Your not bad people at all in fact I stand and salute you two for standing up front. God bless you both