Doctors Requiring Patients To Sign Contracts Issued By The Federal Government

[+wolfgang]

so last week hubby had a doc's appointment, patients who receive narc's have to sign a form issued by the federal government that states the pt cannot get their meds only from one pharmacy no biggie,but and here is the kicker other substances cannot be in the pt's system other than what his family doctor has prescribed,if there is the federal govt now knows this and the doctor may release the pt from his care,wtf is this has anyone else had to do this yet????

also by signing this the govt can ask for random tinkle tests at any given time,we havent heard nything back from the doc,but it hasnt been a week yet,so we'll see if he drops him.

[Kingdiamond]

The downtown campus of henry ford hospitals pain clinic tried pulling this bulchitt on me i stood up to them and threatened to sue they backed off their demand of drug tests before i recieved my spinal injections.

[bobandtorey]

so last week hubby had a doc's appointment, patients who receive narc's have to sign a form issued by the federal government that states the pt cannot get their meds only from one pharmacy no biggie,but and here is the kicker other substances cannot be in the pt's system other than what his family doctor has prescribed,if there is the federal govt now knows this and the doctor may release the pt from his care,wtf is this has anyone else had to do this yet????

also by signing this the govt can ask for random tinkle tests at any given time,we haven't heard nothing back from the doc,but it hasn't been a week yet,so we'll see if he drops him.

 

OK i understand i have heard of this some Doc wont even give you Meds if they know you are on MMJ and some (most pain clinic) drug test just to make sure you are talking said Meds

it's not right thats for sure but if you can go to another Doc i would

[Leon]

if people dont stand up and speakout against this it will only get worse.

[+wolfgang]

bump

[+wolfgang]

OK i understand i have heard of this some Doc wont even give you Meds if they know you are on MMJ and some (most pain clinic) drug test just to make sure you are talking said Meds

it's not right thats for sure but if you can go to another Doc i would

I knew the doc's could do that,but to have the fed's REQUIRING doctors to MAKE pt's sign it is insane!!

[mizerman]

If my doctor ever made me do that, I would walk out of the office.

[Budz-4-U]

Lots of doctors out there.

 

I am sure, if you named a city, people on here would PM you names of doctors, in your city, that are better than this.

 

Stand up and fight, or leave, and let it hurt his wallet.

 

Peace.

[trix]

The downtown campus of henry ford hospitals pain clinic tried pulling this bulchitt on me i stood up to them and threatened to sue they backed off their demand of drug tests before i recieved my spinal injections.

 

Yep, Henry Ford Detroit campus, did this to me as well...

 

The cancer center made me sign a contract before they prescribed me pain meds saying I could only get them filled at their pharmacy, they had me on 100mcg Fentanyl patches, 80mg Oxycoton, valium, Xanax.. the list goes on..

 

Needless to say I'm a pretty sick young guy, and the meds were making my life un livable, sooooo I got my weed card.. started smoking in hopes of reducing my pain meds.. was working then the docs dropped me for drugs MM showed up, they stopped prescribing me pain meds... at that time we discussed the benefits of my MM use and she suggested that I only smoke, also gave me a list of cancer treatment centers that would prescribe me meds, said that her hands were tied federally because drugs were present that she didn't prescribe, yet she suggests that I use it..

 

I suggest talking to that doc about MM, see if he/she will suggest it as a pain treatment, I think if I had done this before the drug test she would have been fine with it.(IMO) cause they don't have to test for cannabis in a drug test.

 

good luck

 

Trix

[Royal Smoke]

Yep, Henry Ford Detroit campus, did this to me as well...

 

The cancer center made me sign a contract before they prescribed me pain meds saying I could only get them filled at their pharmacy, they had me on 100mcg Fentanyl patches, 80mg Oxycoton, valium, Xanax.. the list goes on..

 

Needless to say I'm a pretty sick young guy, and the meds were making my life un livable, sooooo I got my weed card.. started smoking in hopes of reducing my pain meds.. was working then the docs dropped me for drugs MM showed up, they stopped prescribing me pain meds... at that time we discussed the benefits of my MM use and she suggested that I only smoke, also gave me a list of cancer treatment centers that would prescribe me meds, said that her hands were tied federally because drugs were present that she didn't prescribe, yet she suggests that I use it..

 

I suggest talking to that doc about MM, see if he/she will suggest it as a pain treatment, I think if I had done this before the drug test she would have been fine with it.(IMO) cause they don't have to test for cannabis in a drug test.

 

good luck

 

Trix

 

My brother's pain management doctor did this to him before. He was prescribing him some pretty heavy meds (Fentanyl patches, suckers, oxycontin,etc)

 

He told him that if he tested positive for marijuana while on the meds, he would stop treating him. I'll have to double check..it may have been before the law came into effect though.

[Croppled1]

My brother's pain management doctor did this to him before. He was prescribing him some pretty heavy meds (Fentanyl patches, suckers, oxycontin,etc)

 

He told him that if he tested positive for marijuana while on the meds, he would stop treating him. I'll have to double check..it may have been before the law came into effect though.

 

 

We need to figure out the proper way to fight this kind of treatment it is wrong . Its been happening too long and shouldn't happen now that MM is legal . I am a severe chronic pain patient of 16 years so I understand well how this occurs in our States Behavioral Medicine system hurting patients and increasing costs . There should be a bill passed guaranteeing patients rights to non abrupt discontinuation of Dependant medications . That would help people immensely and stop the inhumane dangerous practices they are following now . Basically in many areas where its not possible they play name that tune medicine . I can fix that in 5 , 3 , 2 days or just discontiue care as a punitive measure for participating in the legal MMMAct and Cannabis works to make many pain medications useable for patients . Many still need supplementation of pain meds in conjunction . Again discrimination and putting substance abuse into the equation for patients staying on stable dosing or reducing is wrong in my mind and I have always felt that way . There are no perfect answers sadly for patients . Less is better but pain must be treated unless hyperalgeisia or toxicity is beleived to be taking place and . Pain medicine can sometimes increase pain but when you detox properly and comfortabley you can figure that out but may also find you need some control back too inspite of the consequences that may repeat again in time and negatiive long term effects of most pain meds . Those with hidden conditions are always in the worst spot . Good luck I am sorry your facing this catch 22 situation .

[+wolfgang]

does anyone know why and how this law went into effect? hubby was afraid to tell his family doctor because when he told his pain doctor pretty much looked at him in disgust and said well just use that then then,really doc? dont you prescribe more than ONE med to a patient to compliment the other?I work in the hospital and pt's come in with grocery bags full of "drugs". So he kept quiet about ,I think his family doctor would have been okay because he knows hubby doesnt abuse his narcs,but thats what fear will do to ppl I suppose.So warning to all you may be asked to sign this paper or speak up now,or refuse to sign the paper.???

[+420Atheist]

I take no BS from any of my doctors anymore. I constantly remind them who they are working for. I also question every test and direct them as to what test they can and can not do. I have had doctors tell me they don't like my attitude but have yet not had one refuse to do things my way. Interesting enough in the chart notes they have never said anything about my combative attitude and normally just state that my emotional state is appropriate for the situation. If you question and take charge of every decision then that becomes the normal way of dealing with you.

[Iceman081]

so last week hubby had a doc's appointment, patients who receive narc's have to sign a form issued by the federal government that states the pt cannot get their meds only from one pharmacy no biggie,but and here is the kicker other substances cannot be in the pt's system other than what his family doctor has prescribed,if there is the federal govt now knows this and the doctor may release the pt from his care,wtf is this has anyone else had to do this yet????

also by signing this the govt can ask for random tinkle tests at any given time,we havent heard nything back from the doc,but it hasnt been a week yet,so we'll see if he drops him.

 

 

I am willing to bet this has to do with a doctors DEA license, I sure it was not a law that was voted in by politicians but more likely another strong arm tactic by the DEA. When are the american people gonna say enough is enough with this agency that is totally out of control and not even close to what the american people want and need when it comes to drugs. This is also the cause of why most doctors will not sign or prescribe MMJ, because the DEA can pull their DEA license if they feel fit to do so.

We need to stop this out of control agency before they take over the world, after all they have offices in 67 country's and the and a whole bunch across the USA.

 

D

[+mayorherb]

so last week hubby had a doc's appointment, patients who receive narc's have to sign a form issued by the federal government that states the pt cannot get their meds only from one pharmacy no biggie,but and here is the kicker other substances cannot be in the pt's system other than what his family doctor has prescribed,if there is the federal govt now knows this and the doctor may release the pt from his care,wtf is this has anyone else had to do this yet????

also by signing this the govt can ask for random tinkle tests at any given time,we havent heard nything back from the doc,but it hasnt been a week yet,so we'll see if he drops him.

I am not sre where yo live..I live in Clare County..And they been making us sign what they call a :patient narcotics agreement: which means youu agree NOT to have any thing in you OTHER than they perscribe.: Or you can not go to another dr. and gets meds. I belonged to a clinic in Gladwin (Gladwin Family Care, us 61 in gladwin) I was going there for over 7 years..My Dr.signed my ap twice. cpl months after signing my last app..I went for my apointment..I had a new dR. He kicked me ot for having MM and useing vics..My Dr. said i was agreat patient..never asked for extra meds or any thing..As a matter of fact i was allmost off the ( scripts i was on..And yes i have a complaint with MDCH over this..But yes been going on for awhile now this Contract thing.

[Croppled1]

Here is a link to a older article from Dec 2010 . Though sparse a reference at the end due to discrimination toward cannabis is included - what is stated is harsh and reflects common perception by many pain professionals . Pay special attention to the comments of Dr. Dan Berland University of Michigan Pain Clinic . There is a small unit there responsible for representing the entire State of Michigan and setting policy for treating patient pain the in State . He states " medical marijuana is a joke " . My conclusion of the U of M is it was a joke considering the facts surrounding medicinal cannabis that are known . I felt they practiced very dangerous routines against medicinal cannabis use as now influenced by the DEA , and MML and are as popular today as " McCarthyism " once was . Practices that are villainizing along with hurting patients and I am sure if you dug under the rug killing patients prematurely . Not that this doesn't occur in any case once one is relegated to having to use hard narcotics unlike when Cannabis is implemented alone not that it is always possible . Cannabis actually seemed to reduce harmful effects of narcotics allowing them to be weaned and tolerated better from my experience but one must be aware of the danger at all times . I cannot help but to feel that true pain patients can benefit immensely by using a combination not that any sane person would want not to be free of any piece of a medicinal routine if truly possible .

 

Sad to think a Doctor could represent the lead institution in pain treatment in our beloved State and make comments like this that go un-noticed and un-called on . After all Medicinal Cannabis is legal in our State per the voters because of the discrimination and abject moral influences that have stonewalled the proper implementation of it's use for so long . There is no reason I have found from real world experience why it cannot be used with other medications . They prescribe all sorts of cocktails in modern medicine and always have through time .

 

I will say one thing for Dr. Berland he intends well and recognizes Hyperalgeisa unlike many of his colleagues but he as most seem to be unable to grasp how often toxicity occurs , are immature and uneducated on cannabis benefits ,do not use opiate rotations nor promote comfortable detoxification that cannot be progressed faster then pain is also resolved if that is possible . If it's not , and even if it is in-patient care is usually needed absent a supportive family sponsored situation for any abrupt detoxification . No patient should ever be told to abruptly discontinue use of pain medications . It should be against the law to do so and pages of argumentation can be made to support that view .

 

The U of M pain clinic does not recognize that pain can be so elevated as to be just as harmful as any drug on the bodies normal function . There is a balance that must be maintained between control and pain . It is safer to error on the side of under-treatment but only to a point - a very narrow window . Patients walk on a knives edge cannabis often blunts , and it is a wonderful adjunctive supplement . I hope he reconsiders and clarifies his statements . I have talked to Dr. Berland and like me he has opinions but he doesn't have the pain . You won't ever get me to believe the demands of hours we put on our Doctors in modern times are manageable by human beings nor the pain that many people live with can exist under treated .You will also never get me to believe many pain patients do not need decent mid length periods ( months ) of respite care ,- rest , recreation therapy , and physical therapy of their choice at their own pace not class like ,long term and that detox of patients should not always be at a comfortable pace with very close steps off the agent already contained in the patients normal routine or preference - if it is a legal substance .

 

Dr Berland and his colleagues desire to always substitute in weaning suboxone , methadone or maintain all severe chronic pain patients on them without break through pain meds is seriously injuring 1/20 patients who are known to be unable to tolerate them or have uneven pain episodes. Those Doctors who create abrupt detox situations off dependent medications are many and barbaric . There simply is no other care offered at these institutions once one Doctor requires these measures either they hide under substance abuse saying your Doctor shopping . Prohibition rares it's ugly head under the catch all of abuse even when their was no escalation of dosing even weaning with pain . . ( But this is my personal complaint as a long standing severe chronic pain patient with years of experience on every one of the 4 classes of pain meds , surgery and other treatments ). Berland and his like just look at you and say your not in pain and go about their insane research trying to prove their failed hypothesis's .

Their no different just on the other extreme of Timothy Leary who would have patients turn on , tune in and drop out .

 

Sadly the pendulum has swung away from real care within our health system , respite care is rarely utilized along with proper time frames supported for patient dependent detox situations where pain is still present or in the case of addiction . Most citizens and Doctors do not understand the term dependent versus addiction . The apprehensible treatment of addicts in our Society is even worse then dependent patients as their relegated also to solve all problems alone facing similar medical issues with threats of criminal penalty and forced participation in punitive corrupt court sponsored programs for profit under impractical time frames that few would wish to be part of . If subjected to our detox system as a addict you pay your money and don't get out unless you say your cured ! If your a patient your often abruptly put in withdrawals on whims and declared cured ! Then if you go back to treating your pain as best you can trying to survive second by second through the misery your then a criminal . Using logic can we determine that all true pain patients will become criminals in Dr. Dan Berlands world ? I have not found one Doctor yet that could feel my pain or it's effects on abilities . Since the concept of managed care very few Doctors realize their role is to comfort , serve and give guidance to the public the rest is between a patient choice , conscience and their maker .

 

 

 

http://www.annarbor....g-with-fallout/

 

 

"A man is basically as faithful as his options. " Chris Rock .

[+wolfgang]

well we got a call from the docotrs office today,they wouldnt tell me what this was in concern with even though Im on his HIPPA,they just said they needed to talk to hubby,hubby is stressed because of the storm and trying to keep the girls comfortable so he doesnt want to call.I'd like to know so I can start looking for another doctor,fentayl is the only thing that maintains his pain at bay,the doctor can see he doesnt abuse his percs or soma or xanax,he hardly needs refills on those because the marijuana is a compliment to the patch. I wonder if Rick Simpsons oil has proven to help ppl in replace of the patch any testimonies to the oil??

[+wolfgang]

Here is a link to a older article from Dec 2010 . Though sparse a reference at the end due to discrimination toward cannabis is included - what is stated is harsh and reflects common perception by many pain professionals . Pay special attention to the comments of Dr. Dan Berland University of Michigan Pain Clinic . There is a small unit there responsible for representing the entire State of Michigan and setting policy for treating patient pain the in State . He states " medical marijuana is a joke " . My conclusion of the U of M is it was a joke considering the facts surrounding medicinal cannabis that are known . I felt they practiced very dangerous routines against medicinal cannabis use as now influenced by the DEA , and MML and are as popular today as " McCarthyism " once was . Practices that are villainizing along with hurting patients and I am sure if you dug under the rug killing patients prematurely . Not that this doesn't occur in any case once one is relegated to having to use hard narcotics unlike when Cannabis is implemented alone not that it is always possible . Cannabis actually seemed to reduce harmful effects of narcotics allowing them to be weaned and tolerated better from my experience but one must be aware of the danger at all times . I cannot help but to feel that true pain patients can benefit immensely by using a combination not that any sane person would want not to be free of any piece of a medicinal routine if truly possible .

 

Sad to think a Doctor could represent the lead institution in pain treatment in our beloved State and make comments like this that go un-noticed and un-called on . After all Medicinal Cannabis is legal in our State per the voters because of the discrimination and abject moral influences that have stonewalled the proper implementation of it's use for so long . There is no reason I have found from real world experience why it cannot be used with other medications . They prescribe all sorts of cocktails in modern medicine and always have through time .

 

I will say one thing for Dr. Berland he intends well and recognizes Hyperalgeisa unlike many of his colleagues but he as most seem to be unable to grasp how often toxicity occurs , are immature and uneducated on cannabis benefits ,do not use opiate rotations nor promote comfortable detoxification that cannot be progressed faster then pain is also resolved if that is possible . If it's not , and even if it is in-patient care is usually needed absent a supportive family sponsored situation for any abrupt detoxification . No patient should ever be told to abruptly discontinue use of pain medications . It should be against the law to do so and pages of argumentation can be made to support that view .

 

The U of M pain clinic does not recognize that pain can be so elevated as to be just as harmful as any drug on the bodies normal function . There is a balance that must be maintained between control and pain . It is safer to error on the side of under-treatment but only to a point - a very narrow window . Patients walk on a knives edge cannabis often blunts , and it is a wonderful adjunctive supplement . I hope he reconsiders and clarifies his statements . I have talked to Dr. Berland and like me he has opinions but he doesn't have the pain . You won't ever get me to believe the demands of hours we put on our Doctors in modern times are manageable by human beings nor the pain that many people live with can exist under treated .You will also never get me to believe many pain patients do not need decent mid length periods ( months ) of respite care ,- rest , recreation therapy , and physical therapy of their choice at their own pace not class like ,long term and that detox of patients should not always be at a comfortable pace with very close steps off the agent already contained in the patients normal routine or preference - if it is a legal substance .

 

Dr Berland and his colleagues desire to always substitute in weaning suboxone , methadone or maintain all severe chronic pain patients on them without break through pain meds is seriously injuring 1/20 patients who are known to be unable to tolerate them or have uneven pain episodes. Those Doctors who create abrupt detox situations off dependent medications are many and barbaric . There simply is no other care offered at these institutions once one Doctor requires these measures either they hide under substance abuse saying your Doctor shopping . Prohibition rares it's ugly head under the catch all of abuse even when their was no escalation of dosing even weaning with pain . . ( But this is my personal complaint as a long standing severe chronic pain patient with years of experience on every one of the 4 classes of pain meds , surgery and other treatments ). Berland and his like just look at you and say your not in pain and go about their insane research trying to prove their failed hypothesis's .

Their no different just on the other extreme of Timothy Leary who would have patients turn on , tune in and drop out .

 

Sadly the pendulum has swung away from real care within our health system , respite care is rarely utilized along with proper time frames supported for patient dependent detox situations where pain is still present or in the case of addiction . Most citizens and Doctors do not understand the term dependent versus addiction . The apprehensible treatment of addicts in our Society is even worse then dependent patients as their relegated also to solve all problems alone facing similar medical issues with threats of criminal penalty and forced participation in punitive corrupt court sponsored programs for profit under impractical time frames that few would wish to be part of . If subjected to our detox system as a addict you pay your money and don't get out unless you say your cured ! If your a patient your often abruptly put in withdrawals on whims and declared cured ! Then if you go back to treating your pain as best you can trying to survive second by second through the misery your then a criminal . Using logic can we determine that all true pain patients will become criminals in Dr. Dan Berlands world ? I have not found one Doctor yet that could feel my pain or it's effects on abilities . Since the concept of managed care very few Doctors realize their role is to comfort , serve and give guidance to the public the rest is between a patient choice , conscience and their maker .

 

 

 

http://www.annarbor....g-with-fallout/

 

 

"A man is basically as faithful as his options. " Chris Rock .

I truly appreciated your thought provoking insight and felt like my husband could have wrote that,because that is exactly how he feels. Thank you for that.

[Willy]

The VA does the same thing, i told them to shove that paper up there donkey..

[Guest thequietone]

Wolfgang where are you located? If it is anywhere close to Grand Rapids PM me and I will give you the name of a pain clinic that will work with MM patients. He is my doc and I signed a drug agreement and as long as I have my card he has no problem treating me and prescribing pain meds. .

[solabeirtan]

It shouldn't be too hard to get another Compassionate & Educated Doctor that is aware of Detoxing from synthetic opiates as well as the Pain and Suffering that can be done by Denying Drugs that cause Dependence. The DEA has no Authority or Expertise to be involved in Medicine. It is a Trajic State of Affairs when the Medical Facilities in Ann Arbor, MI, one of the first Colleges of Pharmacy in the Country can have such an uninformed and ignorant opinion of the Healing Process. Dr Dan Berland is an ignorant and uneducated Tool of the DEA .

[Big J]

I am switching doctors right now not because of mmj but because of my cell phone. The day I went in to receive the MRI results. Which they "tried top reach me" but they have 4 people with my name. Anyway my mom was really worried and she called when I happened to be sitting there waiting for him and just as he sat down she called. I picked up said call you back, thats it. He went on a 5 min rant about how dare I answer a cell in his presence there was a sign which I looked for and still can not find in the waiting room. Anyway he then tells me they found the tumor in my brain he acted like it was nothing! I had loved him as a doctor and that put me off so much I had my wife call in a favor to a doctor friend.

[trix]

I am switching doctors right now not because of mmj but because of my cell phone. The day I went in to receive the MRI results. Which they "tried top reach me" but they have 4 people with my name. Anyway my mom was really worried and she called when I happened to be sitting there waiting for him and just as he sat down she called. I picked up said call you back, thats it. He went on a 5 min rant about how dare I answer a cell in his presence there was a sign which I looked for and still can not find in the waiting room. Anyway he then tells me they found the tumor in my brain he acted like it was nothing! I had loved him as a doctor and that put me off so much I had my wife call in a favor to a doctor friend.

 

 

wtf, what a penis!!

 

Omg I'm so sorry to hear that, I know a very great doctor that works out of the Rose Cancer Center in Royal Oak, also he has a office in Troy near the Troy Beaumont hospital...he is pro cannabis, and very respected in his field..

 

If I can help in anyway please let me... PM me I will provide you with names and phone numbers..

 

I will pray for you

 

Trix

[mizerman]

Wolfgang,

 

I hope your hubby is trying to remain stress free. Seems like he and I (and a lot of us are going to go through eerily similar situations in the not too distant future).

 

Happy & Healing Thoughts being sent your way right this very instant!

 

If, or when, our doctor tries to do that to my wife and I...we will just grab our charts and bolt.

 

Medical Marijuana doesn't cure everything - but, it most certainly makes me feel better and allows me to take far less pills.

 

That in itself is a wonderful thing. Not trying to be funny here but I have regular bowel movements and I'm sure the rest of my internal organs are thanking me for the hugely decreased pain pill usage.

 

I know it's time for our yearly physicals and bloodwork

 

Stay tuned,

 

 

 

Mizerman

[+mayorherb]

so last week hubby had a doc's appointment, patients who receive narc's have to sign a form issued by the federal government that states the pt cannot get their meds only from one pharmacy no biggie,but and here is the kicker other substances cannot be in the pt's system other than what his family doctor has prescribed,if there is the federal govt now knows this and the doctor may release the pt from his care,wtf is this has anyone else had to do this yet????

also by signing this the govt can ask for random tinkle tests at any given time,we havent heard nything back from the doc,but it hasnt been a week yet,so we'll see if he drops him.

the goverment did not give them to them..the dr.s are just making them up and scareing people..i been there and been kikced out..but by law they CAN NOT.