Certification Clinics, Doctors, And Professionalism

[Guest finallyfree09]

I am hesitant to post this but i feel that the issue i and my patient had today needs to be brought out into the open.

 

After 2 yrs of talking to a good friend of mine i finally got her to go get her certification and apply for the card. She has been very nervous about it and it took a lot to finally get her to see the good in getting her card. So.... I took her to triple M clinic in cadillac.

 

now... i got my re-certification from this place and another patient's certification with no problem back in october. When i got re-certified they told me that for every person that i referred to them, they would deduct $20 from next years re-cert so, naturally, i referred my friend to them because after i refer 5 patients, i would get my next re-cert appointment for free. sounds good.

 

i dropped my friend/soon-to-be-patient off at the door and proceeded to greenway gardens for some mite medicine... little buggers. i came back and my friend was waiting for me outside the clinic. we left and thats when a few serious problems on the paperwork became quite apparent to us.

 

first and foremost... she told them straight out that she had a cg but he (me) couldn't stay cuz he had to go somewhere. they told her that they couldn't make me her cg unless i was there. they insisted that she be her own cg and wanted to know if i was "set up" and whatnot. they instructed her that if she made ME her cg then she would not be able to go to a dispensary or aquire her meds from anyone but me. she stood her ground and said "no, i have a cg." regardless of her wishes they checked the box that said SHE would possess the plants instead of me. they told her that it was better if she was her own cg and told her that as of now she is her own cg. then they made sure to hand her a business card with some caregivers association or supply somethin or other. their own cg network i would assume.

 

when she noticed this on our way home I immediately called the dr back to ask why it was necessary for me to be there plus a couple of other questions about what i had to do before we could mail the app to mdch but he would not give me the chance. he VERY RUDELY told me... "If you can read you can do it yourself." point blank. not knowing if i should say anything or if i should turn around and go back to his office, i just hung up on him and continued home.

 

we got back to her house and noticed a few mmore discrepancies. he did not check the box on the physicians certification letter indicating what qualifying condition my patient has. he just wrote her condition on the lines below. i believe that is the first type-o that will get her denied. plus... they checked the wrong box (knowingly against my patients wishes) as to who exactly will possess the plants. lots of confusion. my patient decided to call them to straighten some things out as to what we were suppoosed to do to correct the errors.

 

she was immediately met with the same rudeness that i was when i called. i listened as she tried to ask him different things. i also listened as he told her that if SHE could read then SHE could send it in. at this point my patient started getting a little short with the dr, and rightfully so. they told us to just cross out the part about the patient possessing the plants and check the primary cg box and fill out the necessary forms... she wanted to know if she would get in trouble for changing her selection. he also didn't check the box indicating her condition but by the time she was getting to that, she was so upset that SHE TOO hung up on him. we didn't notice that until after we mailed the app.

 

it took a lot of convincing for me to get my friend to get her license. i told her that the clinic i would take her to was nothing to be nervous about and that it would be ok and she shouldn't be worried about getting in trouble just for going to the dr and applying for her license. I insured her that the dr's were professional and that it would not be an unpleasant experience. i was proven wrong today and my patient walked away feeling traumatized and even more worried about getting her card than she was when she walked in.

 

so... i am here to say... Dr. Harwell, I found your services today to be quite short of professional and courteous. you stressed me AND my patient out aabout what should have been a simple process and as a result of your unprofessionalism and sheer RUDENESS that you exhibited today, I will NEVER recommend another patient to you. I will also be seeking out another dr for my re-cert next october.

 

Your rude behavior shocked me today, sir, and i sincerely hope you do something to change your demeanor before you cause another sick person as much emotional distress as you caused mine this fine tuesday morning.

 

All of this is what i experienced today people... you can make your own decisions but i have made mine.

 

GOODBYE TRIPLE M

[bobandtorey]

Thanks for the post and for letting us know not to go their

[Guest finallyfree09]

i didn't say not to go there... just what happened to me and my patient and why I will never go there again.

everybody is free to make their own decisions... just wish i had made a different one. now my patient and i have to worry whether or not she gets denied and if she does i can almost guarantee she backs out of getting her card.

[Guest finallyfree09]

any doctors here? can anyone tell me if not checking the box on the dr cert letter indicating my patients condition will cause my patient to get denied?

[bobandtorey]

any doctors here? can anyone tell me if not checking the box on the dr cert letter indicating my patients condition will cause my patient to get denied?

 

 

Am no Doctor but it might

i would go back and ask them to do it all over again for FREE and you can bet on it that i won't be going their

[Guest finallyfree09]

This is just unreal. I feel so bad for recommending this dr. My patient is in full-out defcon 1 freak out mode now. She was already paranoid and so was her husband and now its that much worse. Its too late... The paperqork was mailed off. Never again my friend.

[+EdwardGlen]

This is just unreal. I feel so bad for recommending this dr. My patient is in full-out defcon 1 freak out mode now. She was already paranoid and so was her husband and now its that much worse. Its too late... The paperqork was mailed off. Never again my friend.

 

Just remember the most important thing, you are helping someone. Assisting a friend or stranger see to a medical situation is the right thing to do.

 

And the second important thing to remember is, its not your fault the way this 'Doctor' behaved! Unfortunately courtesy and manners are not required to be a Doctor.

 

You're a good person and that can't be taken away.

 

Peace And Good Health

 

We are ALL here to help someone

[Guest finallyfree09]

Thank you edwardglen. I needed that. And that's all I'm trying to do is help. She will be my 2nd patient, and like the first, she will get her meds free of charge. To bad she can't get her $ back from the dr

[+itssortalegal10]

Hey Finally Free call me or PM me I detail a doctors vehicles that works there. Let me know who you spoke with because for real wtf....Get a hold of me with names.

 

joe

[+Annnie]

To me this seems just totally unacceptable that the paperwork wasnt filled out exactly correctly by the dr.. and the forced possesion of plants almost seems criminal to me.. This is unacceptable..

Finallyfree You are not responsible for this at all.. You are a great guy trying to help his friend.. I hope this works out ok..

[2grnthmbs]

You're not the only one who has ISSUES with this Dr.... check out these news stories. His certifications won't stand up in court. Patients BEWARE!

 

Smokescreen

Smokescreen2

 

REGARDING DR EDWARD HARWELL’s “SMOKESCREEN”

 

From the desk of Karen O'keefe MPP

 

Doctors with medical marijuana practices who don't do exams or review medical records (and are subject to exposes) have been a significant cause of backlash against medical marijuana both in states with existing laws and those considering them. The Arizona initiative only passed by about 4,000 votes and right before the vote I saw TV clips about docs on Venice Beach with signs that they'd give medical certifications and that didn't adequately evaluate patients. This is a huge talking point of the opposition and it's effective. There is not majority support for legalization and if doctors give recommendations to anyone who complains of pain and merely takes them at their word, voters will feel conned and support may quickly evaporate.

 

The issue of doctors giving recommendations in hotel rooms (or in other non-medical settings) has also caused significant backlash and a doctor in Montana was fined for failing to abide by the state's standard of care. Michigan's law requires recommendations to be made in the context of a bona fide doctor patient relationship, and patients were denied use of the affirmative defense when a court found that was not met.

 

There are several bill requests pending to narrow down — and even repeal — Montana's law and an initiative was circulated for repeal (it was drafted late and only had a couple weeks for signature gathering, otherwise it might have qualified). This is in large part due to the perception that people who are not truly ill are getting recommendations without being qualified.

 

In every state I've worked on medical marijuana bills, there's a concern about these kinds of doctors' practices. As a result: 1) it's harder to pass the laws; and 2) language is inserted restricting the doctor-patient relationship that is quite strict and that could leave behind patients whose own doctors can't or won't recommend (such as veterans who go to the VA).

 

This year a bill was introduced and passed in Colorado to restrict the bona fide patient-physican relationship and similar language will likely be considered in Montana. If people feel the law is being abused (and not used as intended) there will be backlash, and I wouldn't be surprised to see a similar proposal in Michigan.

 

I am not saying this to comment on this particular doctor. I didn't watch the clip, it is a general word of warning based on backlash I'm seeing elsewhere.

 

---------------------------------------

Karen O'Keefe makes a very important point patients should consdier when obtaining certifications .

 

"Michigan's law requires recommendations to be made in the context of a bona fide doctor patient relationship, and patients were denied use of the affirmative defense when a court found that was not met. "

[greenbuddha]

Many times doctors let their nurses or office help fill out paperwork and then they review it and then the doctor signs it if it looks in order.

 

IF the doctor is not adequately reviewing the paper he or she is signing, that is a good indication that they may NOT be taking care of other aspects of their medical practice.

 

I personally will not go to ANY professional that is 'slipshod' in their work... especially not a 'physician'.

[+itssortalegal10]

I removed Triple M clinics from my website. Although that particular behavior may not be indicative of every visit, Osceola County CC can not stand behind a clinic that sound to me as though they are pushing a particular CG service that may or may not pay them to do this type of thing. Even if that is not the case nobody treats patients and caregivers like that, especially one I know directly.

[2grnthmbs]

I removed Triple M clinics from my website. Although that particular behavior may not be indicative of every visit, Osceola County CC can not stand behind a clinic that sound to me as though they are pushing a particular CG service that may or may not pay them to do this type of thing. Even if that is not the case nobody treats patients and caregivers like that, especially one I know directly.

 

 

Glad to hear it. He's not helping patients OR the cause.

[Guest finallyfree09]

I feel horrible. Chances are, I'm going to have to run my patient back up to this dr to force him to redo the paperwork and he's going to be abusive towards the 2 of us again. What a waste of time and $. Not to mention the fact that I look like a total fool to my patient and her husband. This is one of the most frustrating AND embarrassing things that has happened to me in recent yrs.

[ozzrokk]

One time and one patient is too much for this to happen... And of course it

would happen to one that was even more scared and nervous than the rest of

us in the first place. So sorry this has happened to you and the patient.

If the doctor reads this BOOOO on YOU. If YOU can read then YOU can figure it

out....... How dare you treat sick and paying patients like this. What is

wrong with you?

These actions are dangerous and libel as someones life and freedom

depends on these procedures. And I agree she will get a denial letter.

Go back to that place WITH your patient and demand that they redo the paperwork.

Let them know that THEY do not choose your caregiver for you,YOU choose your caregiver

If they would spend as much time worrying about the most important box on the paper

(being QUALIFYING CONDITION) and less time trying to force their caregivers down peoples

throats. Then maybe they COULD have and SHOULD have been done right the first place.

Good luck and remember none is your fault and thank you for warning others.

Let your patient know not to lets scum like that ruin her path to better health.

Welcome to this community the both of you. You are in good hands now. That I

can vouche for.

 

*EDITED*

I take that back. Go back there with your patient and DEMAND her money back.

After reading some other things this doctor cannot be trusted and as said

before. His certification may be worthless to begin with. Good Luck.

[Guest finallyfree09]

i called him and he said he would fix it and he aplogized for the mistake. i din't say anything else though. I'm going to end up losing this patient now i have a feeling. thanks doc.

 

and bye he way everybody... my friend is reading this thread so lets not try to scare her worse. she has all of the medical documentation to prove that she has a qualifying condition. she DOES have one. she will not be in any kind of trouble for applying for her license. the doctor is the one that could face trouble here. she has a medical need and our law allows for that... PERIOD.

[ozzrokk]

Absolutely if she has a qualifying condition she does qualify. And please do not

let anyone distract you from bettering your life ever. Good luck to you both.

[+Annnie]

This in no way is going to reflect on her so she should sit back, enjoy some mind blowing Kush and sleep peacfully because she is now a protected MM patient and her community will support her if and when we need to.. Her caregiver is compassionate and really nice so i think she happens to be very lucky..

[drtarzanmd]

Thank - You for sharing " finallyfree09 " ...

 

I don't believe you 'll loose your Patient ....

 

People know whats in your heart by your Actions ...

Your Actions Speek Lowder then words ...

 

Just as time goes by, many of these

kind of Doctors will get WEEDED OUT ....

 

It takes time to SEE THEIR True Colors ...

 

Keep doing what is in your Heart " finallyfree09 "

 

Everything will fall in place for you ...

[+itssortalegal10]

If your friend is reading this thread she needs to know that you did nothing wrong..If she has a condition that qualifies her she needs to get legal...There are bad parts to everything, just look at Detroit for example...J/K

 

If MMJ helps her or she thinks it might then she needs to be legal for her own protection and well being. As I said I know the Harwell's and this story totally shocked me...I have not spoke with him as much as his wife but maybe he was just having a bad day that day...Still no excuse to try and scare a patient and give bad service when you are dealing with a legal/not legal situation...

 

I am however glad to hear that the situation was rectified and apologized for...

[Dr. Bob]

any doctors here? can anyone tell me if not checking the box on the dr cert letter indicating my patients condition will cause my patient to get denied?

 

The answer is YES ABSOLUTELY.

 

Dr. Bob Townsend

[Dr. Bob]

I feel horrible. Chances are, I'm going to have to run my patient back up to this dr to force him to redo the paperwork and he's going to be abusive towards the 2 of us again. What a waste of time and $. Not to mention the fact that I look like a total fool to my patient and her husband. This is one of the most frustrating AND embarrassing things that has happened to me in recent yrs.

 

I am well aware of this physician. His quote when confronted on 'smoke screen' was something to the effect of 'I'm old, what are they going to do to me?'

 

Last week I had the honor of being the featured guest on the Mayor of Cadillacs weekly radio show on Mix 96. Unprofessional medical clinics, no record and affidavit clinics were the subject of conversation. I am now in Cadillac and on March 8th (one day only) I will do a flat rate $50 cert/recert clinic to combat this type of behavior. Every patient I take away from this type of clinic and provide a safe, records based, defensible certification will protect patients and show them how the process should work. It is a matter of putting patient safety ahead of money.

 

As for your friend, bring her by with her records and I will redo her certification properly for free. Contact Matt at 989-627-5403 to make an appointment. Cadillac deserves a professional, safe clinic that is Redden compliant and I will provide that service.

 

Dr. Bob

[+itssortalegal10]

I am well aware of this physician. His quote when confronted on 'smoke screen' was something to the effect of 'I'm old, what are they going to do to me?'

 

Last week I had the honor of being the featured guest on the Mayor of Cadillacs weekly radio show on Mix 96. Unprofessional medical clinics, no record and affidavit clinics were the subject of conversation. I am now in Cadillac and on March 8th (one day only) I will do a flat rate $50 cert/recert clinic to combat this type of behavior. Every patient I take away from this type of clinic and provide a safe, records based, defensible certification will protect patients and show them how the process should work. It is a matter of putting patient safety ahead of money.

 

As for your friend, bring her by with her records and I will redo her certification properly for free. Contact Matt at 989-627-5403 to make an appointment. Cadillac deserves a professional, safe clinic that is Redden compliant and I will provide that service.

 

Dr. Bob

So this is the post you were asking if I saw on the phone, lol Yeah I saw it....

[Guest finallyfree09]

okay you guys aren't going to believe this... the 14th of march was day 20... never heard a thing from the state.

 

moving forward to today... DAY 35... MY PATIENT JUST GOT A DENIAL IN THE MAIL FOR THIS IDIOT DOC NOT FILLING OUT THE PAPERWORK CORRECTLY! 35 DAYS AFTER IT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE SENT OUT!

 

what in the blue hell is the state doing??? can they not read the G.D. law? it says 20 days. not 19, not 21, and DEFINITELY not THIRTY-FRICKIN-FIVE!!!

 

off to kill 12 newly rooted ladies.