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Tax Revenue And The Mmma - Mi Dept. Of Treasury Opinion


CherryCrush
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http://cannabispatientsunited.org/documents/department-of-treasury-revenue

 

Cannabis Patients United had requested, and now has received a written opinion from the Department of Treasury pertaining to Tax Revenue and the MMMAct. We decided this was important enough to make sure the community at whole reads it. It touches on some important points when it comes to governmental income from a Tax, well, the lack thereof.

 

Document at link or attached. Please pass along.

 

 

 

CPU_DeptTreasury.pdf

Edited by CherryCrush
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Is this just an attempt to give my rights back to the government? Taxed my donkey....I cant legally make a profit, the state and feds still want to lock me up over a stupid donkey plant and you want to offer them some tax dollars? I know not everyone paid attention in history class.....but do you really not grasp the idea of no taxation without representation?? ya that would be a swell idea, lets tell em we are making an illegal profit by offering up taxes, then they will have the money to raid us all.

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Quick as a whip there. :huh:

 

This is not about INCOME tax. Of course you file any income as "other income" on your basic 1040 tax form.

 

This is about Sales tax and Use tax and the ability of the state to impose it pertaining to legal and possibly illegal transactions in the MMMact.(Caregivers and dispensaries)

Edited by CherryCrush
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Quick as a whip there. :huh:

 

This is not about INCOME tax. Of course you file any income as "other income" on your basic 1040 tax form.

 

This is about Sales tax and Use tax and the ability of the state to impose it pertaining to legal and possibly illegal transactions in the MMMact.(Caregivers and dispensaries)

Well explain away your destruction of our freedom how ever you want.....quick as a whip, faster than any whip you could handle im sure :mellow: Sales tax....hmm.... how much sales tax exist when sales are illegal? Oh you would suggest i pay taxes out of a none profit donation only grow that sales are still called a crime? so what big corp do you represent? As I said no taxation without representation. use tax? you will pay that when they lock you up.....Really if you want to destroy your freedom do it, leave mine the hell alone.

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Well explain away your destruction of our freedom how ever you want.....quick as a whip, faster than any whip you could handle im sure :mellow: Sales tax....hmm.... how much sales tax exist when sales are illegal? Oh you would suggest i pay taxes out of a none profit donation only grow that sales are still called a crime? so what big corp do you represent? As I said no taxation without representation. use tax? you will pay that when they lock you up.....Really if you want to destroy your freedom do it, leave mine the hell alone.

 

chill man...

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The law specifically says caregiver activity will not constitute the sale of a controlled substance. And it is a service provided. I never had any question that there is no sales and use tax. Also, as of yet Michigan does not have any tax on services.

 

Now, if you make over $600 income from any single source, it should be on your income tax as "other income" which could just be labor of mowing lawns or whatever. I personally think you subtract your direct costs from what you have been paid, and anything over that you put down as other income. Each of your PT's has a different $600 limit before you declare it as income.

 

As far as giving up freedoms, there I am not. As a resident of the US and Michigan, I am willfully paying income tax on income I generate in Michigan. Just like any other job where they take out taxes before you get your check, if you are self employed you have to send in quarterly income tax, same as all of that. I pay taxes so that my government can give me things like Social Security, Medicare, Planned Parenthood, NPR, Etc. If you refuse to pay tax on income, regardless of the source of income, then you shouldn't be eligible for unemployment, SSI, SSDI, etc.

 

Restated, I don't consider it income until there is a net addition to my money, so all costs of equipment, electricity, water, everything comes out first, but not labor, then once that is done, any money left is income and should be declared.

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They can't manage the money we already gave them! They'd say they'll back off and LIE TO US AGAIN! It's a matter of TRUST and RESPECT, both of which they LOST, because they ABUSED their position and they ABUSED US! They have NO honor!!! Of course they want money, they want our blood, too! Haven't they had enough of both already??? NOOOOO I DO NOT TRUST THEM ONE BIT!!!!! darn THEM!!!!! TRAITORS!!!!!!!!! GGGRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!

Ok now I'll try to think this through in a calmer way and try to restrain myself. FIRST of all, they HAVE TO ACKNOWLEDGE, RESPECT AND IMPLEMENT OUR LAW. THEN we can talk!! The feds have to be forced to back down and everyone has to respect the state's rights. People wanna pay their taxes, though they may dislike doing so. This whole thing is so ridiculous! Over a PLANT!!! (deep sigh) The thing that burns me the most is, the money they get is being used to wage this war AGAINST US! That's SO INSANE!

 

Well, they can't have it both ways. NO ONE can have their way all the time. But they better not complain about not getting their tax money!! Throughout history people have been charged with unfair taxes. IF those funds were being used PROPERLY it would make people feel better about paying them, right?

 

The solution is not that complicated, but it requires THEM to take the first step. As long as they're unwilling to do so, we're all at a stalemate. All they have to do is have a category for these issues, but someone should make sure any percentage owed is FAIR. (big cynical laugh) IF the money already given were used properly, we'd have a great infrastructure, great transportation system, a good education system, healthcare, defense, EVERYTHING we NEED because ALL that money would go to where it's needed the MOST! It's really not that hard to figure out, it ain't rocket science, for gods sake. If I managed my money like the govt does, I'd be bankrupt! Please don't tell me it's too complicated. A nobody like me could figure it out.

 

Sb growler :growl:

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:goodjob: VERY WELL SAID!

Is this just an attempt to give my rights back to the government? Taxed my donkey....I cant legally make a profit, the state and feds still want to lock me up over a stupid donkey plant and you want to offer them some tax dollars? I know not everyone paid attention in history class.....but do you really not grasp the idea of no taxation without representation?? ya that would be a swell idea, lets tell em we are making an illegal profit by offering up taxes, then they will have the money to raid us all.

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The law specifically says caregiver activity will not constitute the sale of a controlled substance. And it is a service provided. I never had any question that there is no sales and use tax. Also, as of yet Michigan does not have any tax on services.

 

Now, if you make over $600 income from any single source, it should be on your income tax as "other income" which could just be labor of mowing lawns or whatever. I personally think you subtract your direct costs from what you have been paid, and anything over that you put down as other income. Each of your PT's has a different $600 limit before you declare it as income.

 

As far as giving up freedoms, there I am not. As a resident of the US and Michigan, I am willfully paying income tax on income I generate in Michigan. Just like any other job where they take out taxes before you get your check, if you are self employed you have to send in quarterly income tax, same as all of that. I pay taxes so that my government can give me things like Social Security, Medicare, Planned Parenthood, NPR, Etc. If you refuse to pay tax on income, regardless of the source of income, then you shouldn't be eligible for unemployment, SSI, SSDI, etc.

 

Restated, I don't consider it income until there is a net addition to my money, so all costs of equipment, electricity, water, everything comes out first, but not labor, then once that is done, any money left is income and should be declared.

 

Just so you know, Unemployment Insurance is not funded from income tax monies.

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If they could make their money off of tax rather than seized property I would be all for a tax.

 

I'm no tax lawyer but my take is you had better claim your income as other income and pay taxes or you will pay the price. Yes they don't have jurisdiction to collect sales or any business tax but your personal income is your personal income. They will not care what your personal feelings on taxation are. They will take everything you own. Just ask Willie Nelson.

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I understand taxation and representation, too bad our representation is so biased. We pay taxes whether they represent us or not. That may be the whole point here, but yeah, find a way to declare it so they'll leave you alone. IF they'd honor an agreement to leave us alone and collect something from the MM income, I just hope the tax is fair and reasonable, IF I may be so bold as to even THINK they'd could even be capable of being fair and reasonable- what a stretch!!! They giveth and taketh away in the same breath. They make rules that are unreasonable, then make more rules that are UNWRITTEN and still expect us to follow! They don't talk, they shoot first and ask no questions, they judge and condemn in the same breath as their lies and deceit, they shake hands with one and have the knife to stab with the other. It would be wonderful IF there was a SOLID GUARANTEE they'd LEAVE US ALONE but if anyone expects them to ever honor an agreement, just look at what they did to our Native Americans, they were here FIRST, they are our first citizens who were only fighting for their rights, and look how they were treated. Govt doesn't care who they hurt, they'd hurt their own flesh and blood if they felt justified to. It's so sad how such idiots get into power, but we all know how that happened, too. We know who the REAL savages are!!! GRRRR!!

 

Sb :(:angry::growl:

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The only people this tax scheme will benefit are dispensary and other sales outlets that the State Treasury says are illegal.

 

See how easy it is to determine if dispensaries are in the Act when you're not trying to change it?

 

I think we need them to abide by the Act and tell them we don't do dispensaries or other illegal distribution.

They need to understand what the Treasury already does understand: if they want taxes then they have to pass lawes allowing sales and regulation of said sales.

 

No one with a card is issued a license to sell anything; therefore paying taxes would be akin to admitting you made sales above the compensation to cover Reasonable costs associated with assisting your 5 patients.

 

We want clarification - not additional anything.

 

If they want extra anything, dispensaries, taxes, smoking clubs, plant tags for dispensary growers, etc., - far out - just leave the Act alone.

Honor the Act and stop arresting patients and caregivers who abide by the law.

Stop writing ordinances intended to regulate something the locals can not regulate as of yet in the case of dispensaries, and never in the case of patients and caregivers.

We should be in Lansing to stand up for our rights and our dignity; not to deal with the devil incarnate or the Tim Becks who think my fight is legalization.

 

I'm just fighting to stay alive and live my last time in peace with the assistance I get from MM.

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Taxation means they must regulate, to regulate they must control. No real way to tax the average grower....so they will get rid of the average grower. The only logical means to enforce taxation of medical marijuana will be to take it out of our hands. only the rich will be able to pay the tax to grow....only the rich will be trusted. and lets not forget, only the rich will determine how much you meds cost. hey we could turn this grand new freedom back over to the pharmacorps. At least i know what side i stand on....not so sure about some other posters in this thread.

 

On a side note: "do you really not grasp the idea of no taxation without representation -

we have representatives so the taxation does have representation, inadequate representation but representation none the less. " see you were so kind as to grant me the opportunity to teach you a bit about our government. Just as an example, the Nra has reps, they promote gun ownership. Now do they represent the lil old lady that wants guns banned as she feels they caused the death of her son? Now when those reps use her tax dollars to over turn a local gun ban, would you say shes being represented? Well no youd have to be a jackass to think that...... Now back in the day , in Boston they had plenty of reps, they represented the king an his interest, they wanted people to pay taxes despite the fact no one represented their interests.

 

 

Now get your google button out and show me which on of these reps has our interests in mind..... that will be the politician worthy of our tax dollars. what you consider to be "representation" would use your tax dollars to lock you up. Not my idea of representation.

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Thank you to Cherry Crush for sharing this information. :thumbsu:

 

No Problem.

 

It is simply a brush stroke on the canvas of what we understand as the Michigan Medical Marihuana Program.

 

Reasoned observation and sensible deductions is the approach to be taken.

 

Overreaction and outrage leads to improper interpretations and unreasoned responses.

 

A simple question was asked of the Treasury, a simple response was made.

 

 

I think most of us already understood the concepts addressed in the letter, but an official response is better than simple conjecture.

 

Take it for what it is, the opinion of the Treasury.

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Their conclusion is they don't have the authority to enforce the tax laws, because it is out of the realm of their jurisdiction. Further another response indicates that dispensaries are illegal under state law, or not legal.

 

Now we're getting to the meat of the states problem. They want the money. They just don't have the right to collect it currently. The question for the community becomes, if we provide an anonymous means to collect and pay taxes, would they cease and desist in their legislative activities and the judiciary in it's enforcement activities? Pile in folks. Thanks, Bb

 

who wants to test your theory BB?

 

maybe the feds have told the states if they accept TAX monies from MM community then that makes them criminally culpable thereby keeping the states on the federal teat??????????????

Edited by MORE COWBELL
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I vote no, and I'm not going to be wanting to march, to bargain away my rights so dispensaries can make a buck off of my misery.

 

You folks need to reread the ACT - we can only recover REASONABLE costs associated with assisting patients - that's not $20, $30, or $40 bucks a gram; it's more like $40 a plant. So once again - if we claim caregivers can make a profit then we are claiming the Act says we can make SALES, and if you win that bs argument in Lansing then you will have 75% willing to 'fix' it.

 

And I'll be damned if I'm going to pay a use tax for medicine I grow in my own home just because Lansing politicians want to pick my pocket.

 

They have arrested us, beaten us, fired us, stopped treating us, and now we contemplate offering them money to go away?

 

That's a hell of a way to seize ones freedom from tyrants. In fact it would make us look like drug dealers only worried about protecting our cash cow.

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Nice letter. It also mentions that since the MDCH administers the registry database, there is no way for the state or federal agency to check and compare who is a CG and filing monies on it.

 

I do agree, "other income" might still be a safe bet - a CG is still technically a self employed caregiver/gardener. If I made $1,000 this year from cutting lawns, I do believe I need to report that fund. Same for winning a lottery or Bingo raffle for $1,000 or more.

Looking at tax returns, the IRS might see assets being built with no source of reported income, and want an audit.

 

Just ask Jim from Numb3rs.

 

-DN

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I'm not comfortable with how this thread is going. I'm not trading my rights to anyone, and I don't think cpu is the marketing firm. Whoever they are, I doubt I'd recognize the name and I feel it's best not to have it revealed here. All I know is I hope WE can get OUR message out so we can counter the horrible press being put out against us. But this thread is about paying taxes, and I agree with Day Tripper on that. This govt has constantly proven itself to be UNTRUSTWORTHY. They've stepped on my toes enough times that my feet are sore. The feds have too much power, the IRS has too much power, they ALL have TOO MUCH POWER. We are NOT being properly represented, by WE, I mean EVERYONE, especially anyone who tries to make an honest living and does their best to have a decent standard quality of life. From the disabled, to teachers, parents, firefighters, etc., we ALL have something in common- WE'RE ALL BEING SCREWED by GREEDY, CRUEL, TRAITOROUS TYRANTS!!!

 

If people think we're trading our rights, they will not march. Remember WHY that rally is needed, to DEMAND OUR RIGHTS, TO DEMAND JUSTICE AND FREEDOM, TO DEMAND THEY IMPLEMENT OUR LAW, TO DEMAND THEY HONOR THE LAW, TO LET THEM KNOW WE ARE NOT CRIMINALS, NOT DANGEROUS, TO REMIND THEM THEY WORK FOR US, AND WE WILL VOTE THEM OUT! We're rallying for our right to exist in the greater community. It's not just about MM, it's about OUR RIGHT TO BE FREE. That's why I'd be marching IF I could go.

 

Now, about those taxes....

 

Sb :(

Hey wow I've been here a WHOLE YEAR!

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Guest Happy Guy

Another fine example of our law taking care of itself.

 

Score;

MMA Law; 100% success rate after many attacks from Greed Heads and the State(redundant).

 

This was another reassuring call to NO action. It ain't broke so leave it alone (expletive!). Let the feds take care of the illegal(not legal) sales(dispensaries) and sit back and enjoy your legal medication that you legally purchased, tax free, from your caregiver. Life is good in the MMA kingdom as confirmed by Mr. Campbell, Mr. White... and to the chagrin of Mr. Dillon.

 

And thanks to the messenger. :))

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