Can I Introduce A New Dispensary On The Forums?

[thanks2]

But yet we do it all the time don't we? Do we not paint law enforcement with a broad brush? Yes we do and it is because on the whole (from a broad perspective) they're all the same. Are there some decent cops? Sure.

 

I bet there were some decent Germans too but we still went to war against Germany.

 

On the whole dispensaries are the scourge of the mm movement. It's like big pharma on a smaller scale. In it for the profit. The MMA didn't anticipate dispensaries and I don't think we can say with a straight face that the general public had that intent when voting. This is about patients and their rights and the rights of their caregivers. I know a lot of people have differing opinions but as far as I'm concerned dispensaries can go to H E double toothpicks.

 

By the way, this is my first post here. I used to be a lurker but stopped coming around when the site required you to sign up in order to read the forums. I dont like the idea of anyone databasing my info. Why can't it be changed back to the old way? Anyway, after attending the rally I decided to sign up and see what people had to say about it. I won't likely be here long after I ingest what the site has to offer so if my opinion doesn't mesh with yours--oh well. The rally didn't seem pro-dispensary but I think the mmma needs to deliberately separate itself from dispensaries by taking the position that it doesn't support dispensaries and that the law wasn't put in place for that. Make no mistake, if the law is changed for the worse it will be due to the negative opinion about dispensaries.

Glad to see I inspired your first post. Welcome to the community, glad to have your input.

[Guest Happy Guy]

Have you seen enough Catholics, Republicans, obese peoples, Jews, gays, or minority peoples to form a strong preconceived opinion about that is "reality"?

 

There are literally hundreds of dispensaries in one form or another around the state, how many do you have to visit before it is safe to throw them all in one group? Even if you visited 20 places you are talking less then 10%, probably less than 5%.

 

My guess is the dispensary haters have not stepped foot in one, let alone everyone. An "expert" might have seen 5 different ones. Still by know means enough to judge all.

 

Many here that hate dispensaries also hold similar broad brush opinions on republicans, tea baggers, religious, and other large groups full of diverse opinions. Bigotry is a thought pattern and those who have it tend to have it towards many groups.

I've been in many. I thought some were good only to find that they were busting moves behind the scenes to hurt patient rights. Yes, there is proof. Another I thought was good was caught on tape saying something that would be considered as poisoning patients for money.

 

To put it very simple for you: I have seen enough lawn mowers to know they are made to cut grass. To think different is just ignorant in my opinion. It's a simple lack of experience. Ignorance can be fixed.

[thanks2]

I've been in many. I thought some were good only to find that they were busting moves behind the scenes to hurt patient rights. Yes, there is proof. Another I thought was good was caught on tape saying something that would be considered as poisoning patients for money.

 

To put it very simple for you: I have seen enough lawn mowers to know they are made to cut grass. To think different is just ignorant in my opinion. It's a simple lack of experience. Ignorance can be fixed.

The difference is all lawn mowers mow grass, 100%.

 

Bigotry assumes 100% from a small sample.

 

I have heard similar and worse stories about caregivers.

[nthlghts]

Dispensaries are not covered under the MMMA

 

They attract federal attention

 

They turn voters against us

 

They are the number one reason communities are enacting laws the regulate everyone

 

Many do import meds and attract more federal attention

 

There meds are overpriced and of poor condition (I have been to 6 by the way)

 

Every one of them claims to have organic meds, but how do they know, they don't

 

Most dispensary raids have been tied to major illegal activity, again degrading the law and opening us up to only state run Dispensaries and no growing allowed

 

Just watch how this works out, support the dispensary and your government will say fine you got em and that is all you will have. They will regulate and control and a select few will get rich. Big pharma will then get involved and cannabis will be like every other drug. So keep supporting them and see what happens, I will bet money I am right! Those bills in congress right now are all the states need to take over control, why do you think they are there to help the little guy, LOL! They are there to let the government and big business take over, and make money. Think im wrong, well then what did Chris Cristie propose, hmm, what is the model in Arizona, hmm, lets see can it happen here, oh yes and it will.

 

 

This law lets the individual grow and take care of their own meds, that is what I want, I certainly don't want to have to put out more money then I did when it was illegal.

[Catfinger]

One way or the other as we fight for more legalization, the govt. isn't just going to let this entire industry get run from CGs homes, facilities, or organized Farmers Markets behind a shroud. At some point when things get big enough you cant just pick tomatoes out of your own garden, you sometimes go to Kroger or Meijer, and yes its unacceptable that they tack on delivery and a million other peoples pay who touch your product but you still go buy it to quell that pain in your stomach when you're hungry. Your fighting the inevitable based on your desire to have the law open up.

[nthlghts]

Big pharma is basically a crimminal organazation now, yes they do good but so did the Mafia!

 

The pharmaceutical industry isn't bad per se either. They charge high prices because they spend so much on research to develop new drugs. Anyone with diabetes or hypertension will tell you that pharmaceuticals are indispensable. They have their place. Do the companies make big profits? You bet, but they also do good. However, I don't see anyone rallying around them on this site.

 

All of this can be summed up by a paraphrase from Spock. The good of the many outweighs the good of the few. In other words the few dispensaries that do good and should be kept around are outweighed by the need to eliminate the many bad dispensaries. Such is life.

[nthlghts]

Control is coming but I would prefer it be centered around a small business model, rather than state control and big business control. Big pharma and the government got nothing coming they had their chance. The little guy won this fight and needs to fight to keep it.

 

 

One way or the other as we fight for more legalization, the govt. isn't just going to let this entire industry get run from CGs homes, facilities, or organized Farmers Markets behind a shroud. At some point when things get big enough you cant just pick tomatoes out of your own garden, you sometimes go to Kroger or Meijer, and yes its unacceptable that they tack on delivery and a million other peoples pay who touch your product but you still go buy it to quell that pain in your stomach when you're hungry. Your fighting the inevitable based on your desire to have the law open up.

[thanks2]

I don't know that I would go so far as to call it bigotry. It is human nature brought on by conditioning to "profile." Pavlov's dogs salivated at the sound of a bell. That's because they were conditioned by the exposure to the bell sounding everytime they were fed. So, later, after they were conditioned they salivated at the sound of the bell regardless of whether there was food. We have evolved as humans to adapt by learning from experiences and being conditioned. When one's exposure to dispensary after dispensary is negative due to high pricing or them being run by thugs, or them being raided for selling illegal things on the side, etc., then we tend to associate all dispensaries with negativity. Is that right? Well, maybe not from a politically correct standpoint but it also isn't right that the general public should judge us as MM consumers based on things done wrong by a dispensary. But in the court of public opinion that is what will happen. Therefore, unfotunately for the good dispensaries, the bad dispensaries are giving our movement a bad name.

 

The pharmaceutical industry isn't bad per se either. They charge high prices because they spend so much on research to develop new drugs. Anyone with diabetes or hypertension will tell you that pharmaceuticals are indispensable. They have their place. Do the companies make big profits? You bet, but they also do good. However, I don't see anyone rallying around them on this site.

 

All of this can be summed up by a paraphrase from Spock. The good of the many outweighs the good of the few. In other words the few dispensaries that do good and should be kept around are outweighed by the need to eliminate the many bad dispensaries. Such is life.

I agree. Similarly, according to the police, most dispensaries get around 100 costumers a day(200+ dispensaries=lots of people). Many of those costumers have had bad experiences with a caregiver or two and hold strong opinions against caregivers. As long as they are still considered legal, it is about a person making their own decision and the ability to discuss that decision making process on the MMMA patient forums. Currently, any positive reference to dispensaries is censored on the MMMA. We have had a number of patient leave, because of strong opinions supporting dispensaries and they felt the MMMA no longer supports their needs. We do an injustice to only allow one opinion that the majority holds and not helping that huge group that frequents the dispensaries. It is about people understanding that what is good for me, is not always good for them.

[Catfinger]

"Big pharma is basically a crimminal organazation now"

 

So where else would a diabetic get thier insulin? Should they order it off the internet from some unknown source or are there caregivers that specialize in making insulin in basement rooms?

Instead of pointing at the rich and telling us how they criminally earned thier place can we please get some solutions, like how else w/o them you would get your pharmecuticals for insulin, high blood pressure, cholestorol...etc....? Oh its huge business but how else would all those meds get scrutinized, distributed, and tested w/o some sort of large business backing?

[nthlghts]

Apparently you are uninformed, so I will humor you once, keep in mind I have a list of these, but for now I will use just one, Pfizer the maker of Lipitor lost their patent, one generic company was going to release it and Pfizer bought them to prevent it. Congress fined them for anti-trust violations or rather got their take, pfizer paid and continues to market Lipitor without a generic. Where did the statins in Lipitor come from, Red Rice yeast, a 10,000 yr old Chinese remedy. When they found that Red Rice Yeast, fish oil, and niacin lowered cholesterol, they had the FDA ban the statins in RRY. That is the measure of their investment. I recomend you check this out. I have many more but I have no time to argue this!

 

Bottom line why is Pfizer banning natural substances for their gain, this knowledge was there for years. So what did they really do, re-bottle and sell what was there already. I believe in a free market and making money but this is just criminal greed.

 

 

 

"Big pharma is basically a crimminal organazation now"

 

So where else would a diabetic get thier insulin? Should they order it off the internet from some unknown source or are there caregivers that specialize in making insulin in basement rooms?

Instead of pointing at the rich and telling us how they criminally earned thier place can we please get some solutions, like how else w/o them you would get your pharmecuticals for insulin, high blood pressure, cholestorol...etc....? Oh its huge business but how else would all those meds get scrutinized, distributed, and tested w/o some sort of large business backing?

[Sinsemillaplease]

"Patients should have a choice and hiding those choices is not in benefit of the patient" Please don't use Patients as an excuse or wedge to try and get your advertising ok'd.

 

The dispensary interests could careless about patients! If they had any true compassion they would of went to Lansing and got their own law separate from the MMMA.

 

But no..they just start popping up with-out any thought to what those actions would do, well now we know. The dispensary interests have the state and the feds on the war path and its the patients who are the collateral damage.

 

Our group of patients calls every dispensary we can find a number for and asks only one question, "do you have a benevolent program for patients" not one has answered yes.

 

I voted for this law for many reasons but mostly because its patient oriented and did not have provisions for dispensaries.

 

What about the locales that have explicitly declared dispensaries/collectives legal? They did go out and get their own law... and let's not forget that they are patients too.

[whacked]

it seems to me like alot of people do not like the idea, this site is real nice and if this would change it in any way id rather not see it so I voted no. I dont beleive they are all evil. They do cost more, alot more, but if you buy your corn from the farmer it is alot less expensive than if you bought it at Krogers

[+EdwardGlen]

What about the locales that have explicitly declared dispensaries/collectives legal? They did go out and get their own law... and let's not forget that they are patients too.

 

Provide the link that shows under state law dispensaries are allowed.

[thanks2]

Provide the link that shows under state law dispensaries are allowed.

http://michiganmedicalmarijuana.org/topic/26598-judge-says-pot-dispensary-ok/page__p__243037__fromsearch__1#entry243037

 

http://www.themorningsun.com/articles/2010/12/16/news/doc4d0a3372c31d7876875695.txt

 

 

This case is not binding yet. The appeals court is predicted to uphold this opinion though. The judges selected for the appeal are good judges. If this case is a upset and overturned, no more P2P, and dispensaries and farmers markets will disappear. Or maybe not until the supreme court.

[Darkmatter]

California meds uncured meds all at triple the price and people wonder why the majority of the MMMA membership dislikes dispensaries .

 

 

 

 

Just wanted to explain my "No". That quote pretty much somes it up for me, but I have to add that this $20.00 a gram stuff comes to us from across the country (a federal offence) which puts the heat on said dispensaries , which cascades down to us patients. Not to mention I am a huge fan of the patient/caregiver relationship.

[Ten4GoodBuddys]

I think the most beneficial way this site can help patients is by allowing information not disallowing information. Having posts about peoples experiences in each dispensary is more useful to me than just constantly being told all dispensaries are bad. Internet forums are a great medium for excessive niche information like dispensary, clubs, caregivers, and whatever else is available to access medication.

 

Maybe creating a blanket thread called "Positive Dispensary Experiences" and one called "Negative dispensary experiences" and allowing them to just compile posts for a while will help people like me discern who to deal with and who not to deal with.

 

I also think it is useful information to have information on dispensaries locations, hours, prices and availability of strains, clones etc. So if each dispensary were to have a thread that they could update and only they could update and all reviews went into the + - feedback threads. It may help patients access medication in a very useful way.

 

I do not like the stance taken by this site towards "dispensaries", it does not help provide patients safe access by disallowing freedom to discuss.

[roadworkahead]

I also voted no to dispensary advertising. It's not that I am against or hate dispensaries. It is simple enough. There are now more than a dozen sites that one can go to and find ratings, patient and caregiver posts,forums, discussion groups and even test results for most if not all dispensaries in MI. For that matter one can also view other state dispensaries.

 

I enjoy this site very much as it educational, personable and informative as to what's going on around the state. I would hate to see it riddled with dispensary ads. There are plenty of other sites for advertising, IMHO this site is not one of them. I don't think this site was ever intended for dispensary ads. There certainly wouldn't be any educational purpose for patients or caregivers having them advertise.

 

Many dispensaries use facebook too. They list their strains, clones, medibles etc.

If you do decide to let them advertise charge them outrageous prices (as many patients claim the dispensaries do to them.)

Do I think dispensaries are "leading the way" and represent thousands of patients (as the "MACC" claims), absolutely not.

I support the patient/caregiver system

 

Some patients report bad caregivers.... my question is where do these bad grower caregivers end up if they can't keep personal patients?

member caregivers of dispensaries??? just asking...

okay that's my take,

 

All I care about is that ALL involved are and stay safe in the MM environment.

Have a great holiday weekend.

[cristinew]

Can we introduce you to a new federal pen jail cell ? hopefully the state will not take our law away, but with every disps comes less good public opinion

to our program,

[GanjaWarrior]

Unity, not division. Our community is not big enough to just throw away 1/3 of it. Many need or prefer dispensaries despite their inherent downfalls. Why should the slim outspoken majority push their anti-dispensaries views on the large minority of patients through force? Are not we fighting the one shoe fits all mentality?

 

 

We have done our community a disservice through censorship. We have lost many members because of this censorship. If Grandma, or Grandpa, asks where is the best dispensary in my area, they should get the help they need or wish to have.

 

Instead, they get a bunch of strong opinions by those who think they know what is best for others, or are protecting their own caregiver business, on why they are idiots for even considering using a dispensary and the thread gets locked because we are not allowed to mention the word dispensary unless we are bashing one. Then they leave this site, for good, and search for one that fills their need for information and does not treat them like a child making the decision for them by "protecting" them from both sides of the story. This policy is degrading to patients.

 

In a patient forum you should fell safe talking about any patient related issues and this is currently not the case at the MMMA.

 

 

 

But, yeah, let them pay for advertisement and let us talk good or badabout them.

 

 

Nope wrong.... If g ma needs help we should find her some help thats what we are about....we can and will do this without scurvy rat disp types. You should feel safe here...i do becasue i dont feel myself or others i bring to this site will be robbed by disp or mislead by disp employees comming on here acting like a pt trying to steal more from sick people.

 

What 1/3 would we throw away? the disp isnt a part of our community....di you see em at the rally they didnt care or know about our issues they wanted us to go by 20 dollars grams afterwords. A leach sucking your blood is a parasite not part of you, a disp is just that. A parasite.

 

 

other than a few on here...whom im sure have a connect with disp, i have never meet one pt who really like the meds or the way he was treated at the disp. They dont serve a purpose. In case you forgot the point of this law is to protect patients . DISPENSARIES ONLY MAKE VICTIMS OF THE SICK.

[Sinsemillaplease]

Seems many people here take hold of a few negative experiences and individuals and then make sweeping generalizations. That's not logical... it's emotional. Just saying...

[GanjaWarrior]

Seems many people here take hold of a few negative experiences and individuals and then make sweeping generalizations. That's not logical... it's emotional. Just saying...

 

 

Theres something illogical about what you are suggesting.....here we have hundreds of people who have bad experiences. This isnt a case for one bad apple....not even close. The only people i hear saying anything good are those who work for, or sell their meds to the disp. the prices are absurd, the meds are garbage....its a fact. I never hear people saying oh man i got a good deal great meds....unless they are talking p2p transfers.... its the logical and legal choice.

[rockinlespaul]

Dispensaries are not covered under the MMMA

 

They attract federal attention

 

They turn voters against us

 

They are the number one reason communities are enacting laws the regulate everyone

 

Many do import meds and attract more federal attention

 

There meds are overpriced and of poor condition (I have been to 6 by the way)

 

Every one of them claims to have organic meds, but how do they know, they don't

 

Most dispensary raids have been tied to major illegal activity, again degrading the law and opening us up to only state run Dispensaries and no growing allowed

 

Just watch how this works out, support the dispensary and your government will say fine you got em and that is all you will have. They will regulate and control and a select few will get rich. Big pharma will then get involved and cannabis will be like every other drug. So keep supporting them and see what happens, I will bet money I am right! Those bills in congress right now are all the states need to take over control, why do you think they are there to help the little guy, LOL! They are there to let the government and big business take over, and make money. Think im wrong, well then what did Chris Cristie propose, hmm, what is the model in Arizona, hmm, lets see can it happen here, oh yes and it will.

 

 

This law lets the individual grow and take care of their own meds, that is what I want, I certainly don't want to have to put out more money then I did when it was illegal.

 

 

btw brother....we live in the same town.

[GanjaWarrior]

I would also like to point out another flaw in the disp debate.....while they will insist so many use a disp due to poor cgs, but they dont adress they fact that most poor cg are the ones selling the meds to disp. you ask for free meds, you get a cg who will cover your cost buy selling all your meds to a disp. If we did away with the disp we would do away with a lot of the "bad" cg out there....

[Sinsemillaplease]

Theres something illogical about what you are suggesting.....here we have hundreds of people who have bad experiences. This isnt a case for one bad apple....not even close. The only people i hear saying anything good are those who work for, or sell their meds to the disp. the prices are absurd, the meds are garbage....its a fact. I never hear people saying oh man i got a good deal great meds....unless they are talking p2p transfers.... its the logical and legal choice.

 

There may be something illogical about the suggestion you have read into my actual statement but there is nothing illogical about what I actually said. I don't remember mentioning anything about one bad apple. Your whole post is riddled with generalizations based on your personal experience. Do you really believe you speak for every patient at every dispensary and every med in the state?

 

I'll play your anecdotal game though. I am one patient that appreciates the option of purchasing from a dispensary. I've been to one in Ann Arbor. Almost all the meds are grown by one person that works at the location and they are tested for cannabinoid content. The prices are not much different from what I find from illegal dealers. To me that isn't an issue because I have many options to choose from if I can't afford to pay full retail price. I also grow. They sell guaranteed clones at the same prices people here do for high quality genetics. I do not work for or sell to a dispensary and this has been my opinion since before my roommate got his dispensary job about a week ago.

 

Nope wrong.... If g ma needs help we should find her some help thats what we are about....we can and will do this without scurvy rat disp types. You should feel safe here...i do becasue i dont feel myself or others i bring to this site will be robbed by disp or mislead by disp employees comming on here acting like a pt trying to steal more from sick people.

 

What 1/3 would we throw away? the disp isnt a part of our community....di you see em at the rally they didnt care or know about our issues they wanted us to go by 20 dollars grams afterwords. A leach sucking your blood is a parasite not part of you, a disp is just that. A parasite.

 

 

other than a few on here...whom im sure have a connect with disp, i have never meet one pt who really like the meds or the way he was treated at the disp. They dont serve a purpose. In case you forgot the point of this law is to protect patients . DISPENSARIES ONLY MAKE VICTIMS OF THE SICK.

 

 

You would have to be omniscient to back up the claims you make. You're so certain that dispensaries benefit no patient. You are wrong and to find that out all you would have to do is go to one. People show up and purchase cannabis in all forms on a daily basis. Your main claim seems to be that they are paying too much. What if they don't care? What if they feel the value for their money comes in the form of customer service in a retail setting that they feel comfortable in? I've heard people say that compassion clubs and patient to patient transfers make them feel uneasy. I don't agree with them but who am I to tell them they are wrong for feeling peace of mind purchasing their meds in front of a cash register with a business license hanging from the wall. Are they wrong to appreciate GC/MS testing of everything they consume?

 

The worst part is you've got the same type of idealistic mindset of the prohibitionist crowd. Your goal of no dispensaries and scrupulous, generous caregivers for all is completely unrealistic... just like eradicating drugs is. The fact is that without dispensaries some patients would go without quality medicine. Some would be forced to buy on the street, some would be forced to buy low grade Mexican brick, some would end up buying expensive breeder packs from Amsterdam, some would choose to stick with Big Pharma and even more expensive medical bills.

 

They serve a need and they aren't all sess pools full of greedy muffin makers with crappy and/or imported meds. It doesn't sound like you care whether there are any good ones or not though... or whether they help anybody who needs it.

 

I guess I should mention my view on the poll. I think dispensaries should be allowed to add their contact information to a moderated directory list. That is all... no ads. I had to vote yes since there was no option for directory only.

[+EdwardGlen]

welp the poll is close 45% yes 55% no, maybe we should agree that we disagree. if ya like'em ya like'em... if ya dont ya dont, either way the feds have declared war on them so it's only a matter of time, i wouldnt want to be a owner or employee!

 

or registered customer. we know how well AG Scheutte stands up for the sick residents of Michigan