Michael Komorn’S Response To False Allegations And The Future Of The Mmma

[AKenewell]

WELCOME to the real MMMA

 

 

 

Yes the real and new and improved ...MMMA

[abe supercro]

I've watched you attempting to quell any talk of a showing of solidarity on the 17th and I must say that this type if reasoning is short-sighted. Guess what- Joe will be there, and in a way, representing you regardless of your personal feelings about him. A showing of our combined strength can only further demonstrate that we as a group, with a common cause, have a giant voice and will fight for our rights. By getting off our donkey, It's obvious that we have more leverage if things don't go our way.

 

Don't show people. I'm sure that Joe will be more than happy to speak and stand on your half. Thirteen people there will make all patients and caregivers look weak.

 

I noticed that in front of a crowd of many thousand yesterday in Ann Arbor, Michael Komorn had the mic and didn't bother to mention a showing of solidarity on the day legislators are voting. Is this really a personal thing regarding Joe? C'mon this is about what the CPU and MK have agreed to already behind closed doors. 

 

 

well blueberry said it was HIS protest, maybe some of us do not like blueberry, for many good reasons

[restlesslegs]

Murph I do hope you see the name on that and the edits. That is Timmahh's statements not mine.

 

[SFC]

You have been drinking the conspiracy Koolaid to long Abe. I never told no one not to go to the rally on the 17th. I have said I don't agree with the date. Yes, I do have a personal beef with Dear Leader, so what? We have already discussed all of this.

 

You're still avoiding what Krusty pointed out. And you are avoiding my comment about the possibilty of you, the cpu, being in bed (at some level) with the apparent default leader(s) of the current mmma.org. Your technique of criticizing the poster, while avoiding the content is not new and rather obvious. 

 

Why on earth are you the CPU and the MMMA.com not supportive of a showing of solidarity at the capital on April 17th? You can't steal that kind of publicity.

 

I don't give two defecates what Kruzty has to say. By asking you if you understand your own words that is avoiding? But here you go, have CPU and MK/MMMA agreed on anything officially? Is that your question? No. We have not had ANY formal discussion, in particular we have not had any formal discussion about the rally on the 17th. I can assure we will be talking with Reps on the 17th and with that I can also guarantee we will not be taking part in Dear Leaders rally, at least not in an official capacity. Was that enough content for you Abe?

[purklize]

well blueberry said it was HIS protest, maybe some of us do not like blueberry, for many good reasons

 

Translation: The rights of patients are important, but not as important as my quarrel with another mmj activist. I would rather see the MMMA gutted than admit he may have been right when suggesting the best day for the protest is the day of the vote.

 

:thumbsd:

 

The stubbornness from all sides has got to stop. All of you (who are stubbornly refusing to cooperate with others because of prior disagreements) are going to get the MMMA repealed because of your pride. The blood will be on your hands.

[cristinew]

NO blood on my hands, if he acted like a human he would have supporters, the blood is on his hands he was the leader that broke up the movement, not me,

[mike44]

I don't see a movement that has been broken up, but I do see a lot of people abandoning ship because of personal resentments.

[mike44]

we'll show old Joe, we won't support the rally and all our rights will be taken away. That'll teach him.

[kruztydj]

You have been drinking the conspiracy Koolaid to long Abe. I never told no one not to go to the rally on the 17th. I have said I don't agree with the date. Yes, I do have a personal beef with Dear Leader, so what? We have already discussed all of this.

 

 

 

I don't give two defecates what Kruzty has to say. By asking you if you understand your own words that is avoiding? But here you go, have CPU and MK/MMMA agreed on anything officially? Is that your question? No. We have not had ANY formal discussion, in particular we have not had any formal discussion about the rally on the 17th. I can assure we will be talking with Reps on the 17th and with that I can also guarantee we will not be taking part in Dear Leaders rally, at least not in an official capacity. Was that enough content for you Abe?

 

 

You are too funny and love the spin. Why would you even be in this discussion? You seem to be here to just spin the issue.. the issue is the books.

 

Not the silly crap you seem to keep bringing up that I condoned anything. I already asked ya for the screen shots of me saying something like that( which I never did) and for some reason you've yet to email me with them. Hmmmm why's that ??? cause ya don't have them DUH.

 

Enough of your sillyness and wanting to spin the issue...The issue is the books of which you where not a member here if I remember. So why are you now here try'n to spin the issue? HMMMMMM.

[purklize]

NO blood on my hands, if he acted like a human he would have supporters, the blood is on his hands he was the leader that broke up the movement, not me,

 

Don't try to spin this, you are the one refusing to protest, Joe doesn't make you do anything.

[purklize]

Two men were sailing a boat. They argued and they argued, they scuffled and they fought. But then a storm was upon them, and when one of them scrambled to prepare the boat for the danger, the other refused, unwilling to help the one who had offended him so. And so, they both sank and drowned after their boat was cracked in two, and the man had his way.

[abe supercro]

BOTH LEADERS OF THE MMMA.ORG AND CPU DO NOT WANT ANYONE TO SHOW SOLIDARITY ON THE DAY OF APRIL 17th.

They do not support a showing of support this has become abundantly clear. Joe just became a distraction and fall guy, it's not really about Bluberry's ways.

 

HELLO....

[+420Atheist]

Wow I just assumed everyone would still be attending the protest. Are we really willing to allow these bills to be passed without a fight just because of this internal power struggle?

[dr. feelgood]

lets hear from phaq or mariauana ranch, been awfull quiet lately, you guys still with us?

[wingdings]

Now I see why cpu has been under scrutiny. They are a high school clique.

[+420Atheist]

You and I attended the union protest during the budget time. You saw the outcome. Nobody wants to back down, we want to work effectively.

 

Thanks for your thoughts on this. I have always had respect for your well thought out positions on these issues. I don't believe that protest are totally ineffective however I can't say they have had much effect on the current legislature. So what are we going to do to work more effectively? I just can't set on my hands and not do something.

[Hayduke]

You are too funny and love the spin. Why would you even be in this discussion? You seem to be here to just spin the issue.. the issue is the books.

 

Not the silly crap you seem to keep bringing up that I condoned anything. I already asked ya for the screen shots of me saying something like that( which I never did) and for some reason you've yet to email me with them. Hmmmm why's that ??? cause ya don't have them DUH.

 

Enough of your sillyness and wanting to spin the issue...The issue is the books of which you where not a member here if I remember. So why are you now here try'n to spin the issue? HMMMMMM.

 

 

hey Krusty, they are posted over at MCP as you likely well know. Your emails to Malamute included the screen shots, didn't they? You are silly...lmfao...

[Hayduke]

Now I see why cpu has been under scrutiny. They are a high school clique.

 

 

closer to a law school clique. And if you ever need their services you will be mighty glad we share info with other attorneys daily....

[Hayduke]

CPU is not opposed to the protest. Not a bit. But we will be inside likely this time around (compared to Sept 7th when we actually stayed home). There is too much happening to not keep talking at this point.

 

If the bills pass, now that is a different subject. Then a protest is in order.

 

But now we are still in the game and would like our bats in the bottom of the ninth.

[Timmahh]

and I have to agree if the bill/s pass out of the HOUSE we are FKed with a Captital UC.

a protest, rally, or whatever you want to call it. Only has a chance in the House, and it is a Slim One. To let it come to that is cutting off our nose despite our face imo.

 

once any bill is out of the House, and on its way to senate, anyone that thinks they can stop them at that point is not aware how THIS Republican Government is doing busiess at the 11th hour behind closed doors, with FULL Democrat opposition.

http://video.msnbc.msn.com/the-rachel-maddow-show/46973330#46973330

 

We arnt in Kansas any more toto. time to get back to the farm imo.

[semicaregiver]

I am late to commenting on this but I would have to say it is too late to put together a successful event in 9 days.

 

First you need a overall message. All I am hearing is the message is "no". We tried that message on Sept 7, Feb 23, March 7 and March 14th. How did that work out? The message can still be "NO", but there needs to be alot of thought put into how that is delivered. I have not seen any one suggesting doing anything different.

 

Second you need time to organize groups,bus groups, car pools, speakers, and all the infrastructure that goes with it. Is that in place?

 

The date was selected in haste. If we are to go forward with a protest/rally/gathering a date should be selected that allows at least 45 days to put it all together.

[Medijuana]

Ya Know,

 

It is really funny when people make grandeous statements like "fully licensed 501c Non Profit Organization" --- and "owns" something that is owned by it's members (non-profit) or shareholders (such as with every corporation in Michigan).

 

I am aware of the rules. Filing Articles of Incorporation (Domestoic Non-Profit Corp) in Michigan is only a fill-in-the-blank- form and paying the fee. The problem is compliance and doing what your supposed to do as these are not "your" monies, they are the Corporations monies and many a man has gone down for not realizing that. I have no idea if these allegations are true or not --- but they better be disproved and disproved fast -- and it is as simple as producing bank statements (or someone suing for them).

 

It is a completely different matter than BEING a Non-Profit as that involves *(as someone noted)* having tax exempt status so people giving money can write it off on their taxes (and be upheld not shot down later). A Non-Profit rolls any "profit" back into the company -- so even the word profit is not correct --- Non-Profits have the purpose of helping (in this case) the MMJ community. That takes not only Michigan Dept. of Treasury ruling (represented by a Letter authorizing status IF the rules are followed) but also the IRS making the same type of ruling as well (represented by a Letter authorizing that status IF the rules are followed) and someone already noted the problem with that and the Feds and MJ. This is a complex area and I really doubt MMMA spent the time and money to do it -- it is a year or years long process with CPA, Attys, and Documents --- but only those who DID IT, UNLESS you have made FOIA (Freedom of Information Act requests) about this months ago, could you know and make such a statement as (below). No way you can say those statements and they hold any water. If you have the letters, post them.

 

Now I understand you may want to defend this person or that person -- what I do not get is making grand statements about matters you do not know are true as a positive statement. WHY? Again, if you have the letters, post them (scanners are pretty common) and if you do why not just say "here the documents to prove it is this or that -- and Here are the Corporate Records proving Articles and By Law, and the Minutes to establish the Votes. Corporate Housekeeping is something every corporation (that wants to maintain their status and not loose personal assets by piercing the corporate veil) does on a weekly and even daily basis. It HAS to be recorded then and there when the votes are taken at meetings (with a quorm). Again, this is complex stuff.

 

SO IF you have copies of the documents noted (from the IRS and State and Feds to prove it), GREAT, scan them and post them. End the matter.

 

If you don't have the Documents why then are you saying your opinion as fact? Statements you do not know are true or not. Owners of Corporations are the Members or Shareholders (depending if it is non-profit or regukar domestic for profit corp). So just because the Non-Profit forms were filed does not mean the rules were followed.

 

Those who run a Corporation is the CEO. Period. We all know that -- I do not know what Mr. Kormon position was voted to as the By Laws and Votes would establish that -- in a Corp. no one person can "fire" the other --- and if it only has two (2) Members with voting power then they have a really serious problem as no one can unilaterally UNDER THE LAW remove another Corporate Leader, period.

 

It is a stalemate (the worst thing you could have is a stalemate). Again, one person (even an Attorney) cannot unilaterally remove a CEO *(or we would see that all the time, it just is not possible, that is the whole point of a Corporation as it is a Group of People). With a stalemate it will require a Judge to make a ruling on it (and of course that would require PROOF the person is right). Also the person seeking that relief would need to have "clean hands" to seek relief from a Court of Law (can't do bad and then ask a Court to help you) --- they sorta frown on that and dismiss the case.

 

Clean hands Means exactly that -- that your conduct was proper -- and they did nothing wrong (in the eyes of the Law). Taking monies (seems like the Treasurer or CFO does the money issues, but that is paying bills) by a person, the CFO or Financial Officer -- one thing is clear, a CFO cannot remove a CEO. Seems to me some of the prior posted statements about "owning" MMMA is wrong as a matter of Law -- a Corporate owner is the Shareholders or it's Members -- no one else has any power in a Corporation and usually the person with the most power in a Corporation is the CEO as He or She is responsible for all of the Corp. A CFO is not very powerful and does the Finances generally.

 

So in the end, I doubt anyone thought they were lining someone's pockets when they worked, donated, or sold t-shirts -- the money taking is really serious allegations and they are not going to go away based on denial -- it takes proof, as not only is it wrong, its fraud, and criminal to take corporate account monies and put them elsewhere.....you can be charged criminally in State or Federal Court if you stole money (and not to mention the tax issues for years from the IRS). If the mail, or emails on the net, or phone was used it's also wire or postal fraud.

 

The money for a "Non-Profit" should be in the non-profit, which has a special account or accounts -- if its not there, that is a REAL PROBLEM. the least is noted about, others are taxes would be due and that may implicate more issues of any "non-profit" status is lost or would be revoked.... one cannot just take the money for personal use. That's stealing. A "non-profit" returns all funds back to the Corp. to continue the mission and paying outragous pay is absurd too as that is not non-profit, its lining your pockets. Other serious issues exist but I am not going to list evey one --

 

So, the bottom line is making assertions about is being fully "licensed" (when no such license exists) is if it is not true from your own personal knowledge (not a guess, you know because you saw the documents or have copies of them) and you do not have this proof, it is really, really is silly -- someone will just say "Prove it" (and if you don't you look like a liar and your credibility is gone).

 

"Here's the Proof" and posting it is the proper way to address these issues not saying more words -- talk is cheap. Everyone has an opinion (and they all stink) and proof is all that matters --- if ya have the proof, post the actual scanned document --- if ya don't do not say that you do !!

 

M

 

 

 

Audit all the books & the truth will come out !! If legal action is required So be it !! Think of what this has already done to the MMJ community !! Who can we trust ??

[CaveatLector]

Ya Know,

 

It is really funny when people make grandeous statements like "fully licensed 501c Non Profit Organization" --- and "owns" something that is owned by it's members (non-profit) or shareholders (such as with every corporation in Michigan).

 

I am aware of the rules. Filing Articles of Incorporation (Domestoic Non-Profit Corp) in Michigan is only a fill-in-the-blank- form and paying the fee. The problem is compliance and doing what your supposed to do as these are not "your" monies, they are the Corporations monies and many a man has gone down for not realizing that. I have no idea if these allegations are true or not --- but they better be disproved and disproved fast -- and it is as simple as producing bank statements (or someone suing for them).

 

 

Murph,

I truncated your post just to save space.

Great post. I can see you have a grasp on corporate law and most of what you say is spot on. I'm surprised no one has commented on your post yet. The proof is in the pudding and in this case the pudding is the bylaws. Maybe someone can post the bylaws. With the shitfit cain is throwing I would guess that he has gone to authorities over this. If that is the case someone will be proven to be wrong in a big way. It would be nice to hash it out now rather than wait months for authorities to figure it out because this is a huge distraction. Whoever is right knows they are and I would suggest that they should post the bylaws to quell this distraction.

[purklize]

We tried that message on Sept 7, Feb 23, March 7 and March 14th. How did that work out?

 

The first was followed by them putting off the vote over 8 months. We don't know the results yet of the others, as we don't know how it'll influence their voting until they vote.

 

Staying at home because you might irritate the legislators is groveling, I don't like it one bit. It's begging for freedom. How's that look when you're in jail? Please Mr. Guard give me a bagel? I feel like that's our role right now. Rights are asserted, not begged for.

 

and I have to agree if the bill/s pass out of the HOUSE we are FKed with a Captital UC.

a protest, rally, or whatever you want to call it. Only has a chance in the House, and it is a Slim One. To let it come to that is cutting off our nose despite our face imo.

 

once any bill is out of the House, and on its way to senate, anyone that thinks they can stop them at that point is not aware how THIS Republican Government is doing busiess at the 11th hour behind closed doors, with FULL Democrat opposition.

http://video.msnbc.m...973330#46973330

 

We arnt in Kansas any more toto. time to get back to the farm imo.

 

That's exactly the problem with the CPU's current plan of action.

 

Once it passes the House it is OVER! They will just ram it through. The Senate will think, huh, we could tweak this and get it blocked, or we could just railroad it as is and get 90% of the damage we want. Almost 600 bills have been passed into law, this legislature is a "mill" of another kind.

[+Malamute]

The first was followed by them putting off the vote over 8 months. We don't know the results yet of the others, as we don't know how it'll influence their voting until they vote.

 

Staying at home because you might irritate the legislators is groveling, I don't like it one bit. It's begging for freedom. How's that look when you're in jail? Please Mr. Guard give me a bagel? I feel like that's our role right now. Rights are asserted, not begged for.

 

 

 

That's exactly the problem with the CPU's current plan of action.

 

Once it passes the House it is OVER! They will just ram it through. The Senate will think, huh, we could tweak this and get it blocked, or we could just railroad it as is and get 90% of the damage we want. Almost 600 bills have been passed into law, this legislature is a "mill" of another kind.

 

 

First off, CPU has absolutely zero problem with any rally done by anybody for whatever reason they feel they need to. Whether CPU is officially involved in said form of political activism does not mean members of CPU will not attend or have not attended protests in the past. I can actually say CPU members have spoke for example at the September 7th rally. Just because members are not required to express their membership to CPU publicly, does not mean they aren't all around you fighting the good fight and doing the good work. CPU does not claim to represent anyone but ourselves. We are patients, caregivers, physicians, Attorneys and professionals in various fields of expertise. We believe EVERYONE should contact their Representatives and let them know their own individual perspectives. We encourage everyone to redress their government because it is a First Ammendment Right guaranteed by the Constitution and we would NEVER imagine to try to curb that right for ANYONE, including ourselves. Nor would i expect others to try to curb our Rights to redress our government. Redressing your government is done in many forms and i take no offense in disagreement with our message, but i will never allow anyone to take away CPU's right to do exactly what we do.

 

I will not attack your rally, but i may offer suggestions i think may help. I expect the same courtesy when it comes to our Advocacy. Do not attack us, but please offer suggestions you think may help.

 

And to clear up a fallacy that lingers obviously from the delusions of grandeur propagated from these sacred threads, the September 7th rally did not delay those bills in any form or fashion. To think that is to then accept a falsity as your basis for proceding. A fatal flaw to be made. That rally accomplished many things, but it actually accelerated the process. It is what it is and that is NOT a criticism of the rally. That is just a factual truth.

 

 

Now, may i ask you exactly what is CPU's plan of action? You seem to have this all figured out, yet i know it has not been laid out publicly for anyone in any specific form. So i was just wondering if you could enlighten me on that topic?

 

CPU opposes these bills as is. Simple as that. We have never wavered from our positions when advocating in Lansing on this front. We Oppose HB 4834. We oppose HB 4851. We Oppose HB 4856. There has been no stronger or successful defender of the current Act than ourselves. Even 3MA has offered language for a distribution model that would have taken 75% to pass thus intruding on the Act. CPU has never originated a bill to attempt to change the Act. When this set of "Walsh Bills" were introduced there were 8 bills. That number has dropped to 4. I do hope you don;t think that just happened magicly. Twas no tooth fairy that instigated the removal of those 4 bills. Of the 4 bills left, we have neutered as much of the language as we can so far and even up to this second we are ringing phones, setting up meetings, and contacting representatives in an attempt to further neuter the bills if possible, gain a proper affirmative defense that will actually work, completely oppose HB 4834, fix the language in 4856 and still oppose it, and generally, do whatever we can to either stop or neuter any and all of these bills. You can disagree with our approach, but it has been well thought out and passed through some of the most respected people and minds in our community. There is no magic bullet to stop these republicans. The election of 2010 was a real b!tch indeed.

 

 

Moving on, If these bills do pass the house yes it s&cks C&ck. Yeppem, dam skippy my friend. That is kinda a No $h!t comment. So what will you do to help stop these bills or neuter them to save patients? Have a rally? Coolio. Go for it. Rock it out and make it a good one. Glad to offer some pointers, but my suggestions have never been listened to before round these parts, so i suspect you all can handle it fine and dandy. CPU is taking a different approach and that is to directly speak with as many as we can from the democratic caucus to oppose HB 4834. That is obviously the most detrimental of the bills.

 

I suggest and recommend everyone should be calling, writing, emailing and meeting your representatives in person and recommending to them to please vote against HB 4834. Sure vote against the rest too, they suck as well, but i think we need to focus the democrats to stand up for themselves at least once this session of the Legislature and win one for their caucus. The Republicans are running rough shod through the Legislature and we need the democrats to sack up and vote against HB 4834.

 

That's about it for now.

 

I will still post in the other thread a longer detailed description of CPU and what we do. I have been waiting for the forum to calm down a bit and make the bridge from the past.

 

I am glad to see knowledge and openness being shared again on this forum. It is something i have missed since i left the 3MA and resigned as staff and site administrator. This is the first post i have posted as Malamute on this site in 2 years.

 

Hey howdy all you buggers. Nice to see the iron fist couldn;t keep the rabble rousers down forever.

 

:-)