Why Such Lust To Prosecute And Win Convictions?

[+washtenaut]

Is it federal funding that causes these various police agencies to so want to convict cannabis patients and caregivers? There is really no desire to teach the cannabis community so we know that they aren't really interested in getting compliance. It seems that they would much, much rather arrest and imprison patients. I think this is why we see so little direction.

 

What is at the root of these incentives? All of these police agencies can't hate cannabis patients. While I'm sure some agents have anti-drug slogan tattoos, we are doing something fundamentally wrong somewhere. Is it all related to forfeitures? What would have to happen to fix this situation??

[Kingdiamond]

Forfeiture laws fuel and fund law enforcement so if they find you are in compliance with the law meaning by law they cant steal and sell your belongings as drug proceeds they do whatever they can to change that by say weighing your plant garbage or whatever chickenchit petty rule violation they can find to give them the green light to destroy your life .

[greenbuddha]

Money and job security!

[Fat Freddy]

Recently I was watching a program on national geo. It was about the so called war on drugs. In the report a agent stated that between cash and items confiscated they bring in around 200 million in revenue. Mind you they burn the drugs! There is the incentive for the feds. At state level I would venture to say they make fairly good bank. Keep in mind some cases are plea bargained down with fines at the city level.

 

Feds give x amt of $$ to the state, the state gives x amount to the cities...

 

With some digging in the budget reports one can find out: how much was spent on the war on drugs, and how much was confiscated.

Heck if it were not for patient and caregiver busts leo might have to actually go out and fight real crime...murder, rape, car jackings and lets not forget robbery.

Lions tigers and bears oh my

[AmishRnot4ganja]

It is a pretty sick situation. Government and the private prison system need criminals in order to survive, so if there aren't enough criminals they go out and manufacture some. God help anyone who doesn't have the money to fight them. This is getting so third world and very sad.

[puffaway]

The prosecutor's offices even have special attorneys that do all the paperwork for the local police departments to file for forfeiture of your home, cars, bank accounts, etc. That way they do a 50/50 split with the department for all the cash they bring in when they auction off your life. The local departments are supposed to use the funds for drug education, more high tech equipment to monitor your life, surveillance cars etc. When they have extra money (as in TOO much) they take all their surveillance cars and give them to other plainclothes units in the department and buy themselves new cars.

But as said...its all about the money.

[+Annnie]

It is really definately about the money.. Here is a little story about what happened to me and the hubby.. The multijurisdictional task force that gained a warrant into my home with an affadaivet that was full of half truths took most of our plants and all of our medicine for 8 pts. Even tho we were completely legal and they were legally possessed. So our immunity from siezure was lost immediately. They took all the money we had in the home.. Later when our immunity from arrest was lost we had to bail out of jail. It cost 2000 each.. My mom loaned me the money.. I tried to have the bond put into her name but since she wasnt there i had tohave it put in my name for my hubby. My friend put my bond on his name.. We did that so the money would have to be returned and not used for fines and fees if we were to owe them. (anyone who knows our court story knows how wierd this is going) Well ended up the hubby took a plea.. He was punished with 700 in fines and 6 mo probation with the 7411. Ok hes done so i go and try to collect the bond.. They tell me it will be sent in two weeks.. Ok.. So then a couple of days later i get an email that tells me the prosecutor is going to recind my husbands plea if we get the bond back.. And i get a reciept that say the task force took the bond.. So they just decided that even tho the bond wasnt in my husbands name they were just going to tack that on to the punishment as well.. OR else take him to court for the full 12 yrs of felony.. Hmmm well guess what.. Im going to that courtroom first thing on monday morning and GET THAT MONEY BACK... LOL take him to court see if i care!! Ya MSC!!

[cristinew]

Its about A Felony Conviction then the feds disarm you permanently that is the number 1 goal , money is next

[trix]

Recently I was watching a program on national geo. It was about the so called war on drugs. In the report a agent stated that between cash and items confiscated they bring in around 200 million in revenue. Mind you they burn the drugs! There is the incentive for the feds. At state level I would venture to say they make fairly good bank. Keep in mind some cases are plea bargained down with fines at the city level.

 

Feds give x amt of $$ to the state, the state gives x amount to the cities...

 

With some digging in the budget reports one can find out: how much was spent on the war on drugs, and how much was confiscated.

Heck if it were not for patient and caregiver busts leo might have to actually go out and fight real crime...murder, rape, car jackings and lets not forget robbery.

Lions tigers and bears oh my

 

Here is one site you find interesting.. I'm looking for the one I use to refer to in the past.this shows info updated once a second

 

http://www.drugsense.org/cms/wodclock

 

 

It is Sun Jun 3 2012

 

 

Money Spent on the War On Drugs this Year

 

Federal

State

Total

 

 

The U.S. federal government spent over $15 billion dollars in 2010 on the War on Drugs, at a rate of about $500 per second.

 

Source: Office of National Drug Control Policy

 

State and local governments spent at least another 25 billion dollars.

 

 

Trix

[lawyercaregiver]

This is a problem that is common not just to medical marijuana. Overambitous prosecutor's make a name for themselves by hunting prey to consume. They don't want a fair fight so they go after the weak and helpless. If you are not weak then they will put you in jail in solitary confinement (i.e. TORTURE) while they deny bond, and delay the trial until the stress breaks your marriage and destroys your life. Then they sanctimoniously claim that if the person is innocent they have nothing to worry about.

 

Read "3 Felonies a Day" if you want more on this topic. Prosecutor's are using creative interpretations of federal and State law to prosecute people who never had any criminal intent and it is not limited to medical marijuana.

[+Annnie]

This is a problem that is common not just to medical marijuana. Overambitous prosecutor's make a name for themselves by hunting prey to consume. They don't want a fair fight so they go after the weak and helpless. If you are not weak then they will put you in jail in solitary confinement (i.e. TORTURE) while they deny bond, and delay the trial until the stress breaks your marriage and destroys your life. Then they sanctimoniously claim that if the person is innocent they have nothing to worry about.

 

Read "3 Felonies a Day" if you want more on this topic. Prosecutor's are using creative interpretations of federal and State law to prosecute people who never had any criminal intent and it is not limited to medical marijuana.

 

Thank you for this relavent post.. Can you post more please.. :-)

[Iceman081]

Yep and that is also why the Chief of the Grand Rapids Police Department drives around in a brand new Ford Taurus paid for by drug forfiture money, nothing like flaunting it in everyones face!!! How does a new car for the chief help stop drug lords? The police are corrupt, the prosecutors are corrupt, hell the whole darn justice system is corrupt!!! This is what the War on Drugs has done to this Country and it makes me sick to my stomach!!!

[Kingpinn]

They just plain like having you under their thumb

 

[Dr. Bob]

Yep and that is also why the Chief of the Grand Rapids Police Department drives around in a brand new Ford Taurus paid for by drug forfiture money, nothing like flaunting it in everyones face!!! How does a new car for the chief help stop drug lords? The police are corrupt, the prosecutors are corrupt, hell the whole darn justice system is corrupt!!! This is what the War on Drugs has done to this Country and it makes me sick to my stomach!!!

 

I am so sick of those signs. I'm thinking about putting one on my truck saying 'obtained from a police officer'. The former owner of my truck was a cop who traded it in to the dealership. I'll drive it around Saginaw with a big leaf and a medical cross on it.

 

Dr. Bob

[+mayorherb]

Is it federal funding that causes these various police agencies to so want to convict cannabis patients and caregivers? There is really no desire to teach the cannabis community so we know that they aren't really interested in getting compliance. It seems that they would much, much rather arrest and imprison patients. I think this is why we see so little direction.

 

What is at the root of these incentives? All of these police agencies can't hate cannabis patients. While I'm sure some agents have anti-drug slogan tattoos, we are doing something fundamentally wrong somewhere. Is it all related to forfeitures? What would have to happen to fix this situation??

We actualy have a cpl officers n Clare area..Who send us Patients (they) that need to be educated on the rules/law..I see it as a start ..The officers would rather them be EDUCATED then arresting them..Its a good start...P.S Plus our Local Sheriff agreed to come to a meeting soon..To hear our side of the story..Its a start..

[+mayorherb]

Thank you for this relavent post.. Can you post more please.. :-)

very nice...WE need to keep fighting..

[lawyercaregiver]

HI Annie: I don't always get asked to comment further- usually when I say it nothing more need to be said

The problem is that legislators enact compromise bills that can be read more than one way. This is because they make deals to pass bills and put in ambiguous language instead of clear language so they can get the bill passed. Sound familiar? Yep, it is one big issue with our favorite statute

 

The MMM Act is a a bundle of comprimises! The overall intent of the act is very, very clear but many provisions are not clear at all. I will not regale with the issues that have been litigated but their are many so far.

 

So creative prosecutors with a political agenda can stretch and distort to the point they come off looking like Mr. Magoo- gee we can't read this statute. Even as in the recent Suprem Court case (overrulling the obnoxious Judge O'Connell and his fellow losers) there is a CLEAR section 8 and a section 4 with DIFFERENT requirements they still distort and twist to reach their previously decided upon conclusion.

 

In the Book "3 Felonies A Day" the author argues over and over again that ambiguous laws and "creative prosecutors" have made a very dangerous problem in America and gives example after example to prove it. Under common law for the last 1,000 years there has a legal requirement for guilt in a criminal case. This is called "Mens Rea" or "guilty mind" (when my wife is PMS'ing I tell her that is "Menses Rea" which I guess is the bloody guilty mind but that is a whole other issue ).

 

A guilty mind means the alleged criminal HAD REASONABLE NOTICE AND KNEW WHAT HE WAS DOING VIOLATED THE LAW. The astute will note this means that locked, enclosed outdoor facilities are absolutely allowed- until a court case interprets the law to say they are not. The prosecutor can seek cease and desist orders and can even seek a Declaratory Judgement. However, under common law a proscutor would almost NEVER go after people skirting the edge of an ambiguous law. In times past this was a sure dismissal at the start. People who violate this 'law' are not criminals until and unless the word is finalized FIRST. At least that is how the criminal law is SUPPOSED to work.

 

There have long been a few exceptions to Mense Rea. Statutory rape is a "strict liability" crime which means if she looks 21 and shows you a fake idea but turns out to be a minor then you find out that "15 will get you 20" . No evil intent required because the public policy in favor of protecting young girls from older men is so great. . This has been changed recently with several federal laws being interpreted as strict liability (i.e. the Sarbennes-Oxley accountant and investor bill, RICO, and Conspiracy laws are all strict liability. So if you engage in a conspiracy that you THOUGHT was legal you can still be charged. You only have to be in a conspiracy- not know what you are doing is illegal.

 

Even though the MMMA was NEVER a strict liability bill several unscrupulous Michigan prosecutors have tried to treat it as such.

 

This is the second major problem in prosecutions. Prosecutors pick and choose their fights. The general attitude is that EVERYBODY is GUILTY of something and all they have to do is pick and choose the weakest victims. They don't have to win, they just have to torture a defendant enough so that his life is ruined already so he pleads out. The prosecutor lauds the blow he has struck for law and order and then goes looking for another victim to destroy.

[Dr. Bob]

Nice discussion. Michael has his 'low hanging fruit' analogy as well. I think it is up to all of us to try and get a little higher on the tree.

 

All goes back to the old bear hunting story. Two friends go bear hunting. One guy starts jogging a couple of weeks before the hunt. They get together for dinner the night before they leave. One guy teases the other about trying to get in shape to outrun the bear. The second guy replies, I don't have to outrun the bear, I just have to outrun YOU.

 

That is why I recommend folks start jogging when it comes to MMJ.

 

Dr. Bob

[+Annnie]

Thanks for that common womans explanation.. Lcg. Im thinking in my area they chose the wrong fruit and it may really mess up their Pie.. Peace to you kind sir..

[+mayorherb]

lC, now this is making since.. THANK YOU!!