What Type Of Access Do Patients Want?

[OG Fire Beaster]

GregS

 

Nothing I wrote was meant to be an attack on you or anyone else specifically. It is about the mentality that there is no common ground, and if someone does not proscribe to my exact view then we are somehow on opposite sides.

 

There are a lot of leaders that participate on these boards and if we can create more unity on the issues that are before us now, and that will inevitably come, we will be able to accomplish much more.

 

Believe it or not some patients are, were, and would like to become dispensary operators while persevering the rights of other patients that they care about.

[GregS]

GregS

 

Nothing I wrote was meant to be an attack on you or anyone else specifically. It is about the mentality that there is no common ground, and if someone does not proscribe to my exact view then we are somehow on opposite sides.

 

There are a lot of leaders that participate on these boards and if we can create more unity on the issues that are before us now, and that will inevitably come, we will be able to accomplish much more.

 

Believe it or not some patients are, were, and would like to become dispensary operators while persevering the rights of other patients that they care about.

 

i do not usually engage in fat-headed argument, but I have made a few entertaining observations of those machinations.from time to time. That is like saying that I had crabs once. Does that count?

Edited February 19, 2013 by GregS

[Mickeydee]

I'd like to see safe and easy access to meds for all patients. Dispensaries, farmers markets, compassion clubs. Regulate them if you must. No government store or grow. Leave the cg/pt rights to grow alone unless you'd like to increase the number of patients a cg can have or increase the number of cgs a patient may have.

[GregS]

Is it a full moon tonight? Why is everyone so excessive and directed in attacks? Can't we have a discussion without doing this?

 

Whaddyawant???. It's Saturday night and we decrepit old men can't keep up. In a perfect world we would be out enjoing schit.

Edited February 19, 2013 by GregS

[OG Fire Beaster]

I'd like to see safe and easy access to meds for all patients. Dispensaries, farmers markets, compassion clubs. Regulate them if you must. No government store or grow. Leave the cg/pt rights to grow alone unless you'd like to increase the number of patients a cg can have or increase the number of cgs a patient may have.

 

Agreed.

[cristinew]

Just my Opinion ,, do not open up the act at this time,

[Northern Lab]

So I guess it is going to come down to patients and caregivers that grow and those that do not.

 

I can understand those that do not being okay with potentially having the ability to pick up a vast array of strains , medibles and topical's in one location. The trade off of course will be higher prices, some are ok with that.

 

On the other side you have growers and patients that want affordable meds of consistant quality. We are unwilling to risk our grow rights, I guess we will find out who has the juice to get their way.

 

Edit: See Zap and I didn't even attack anyone,

 

 

 

Why is this issue constantly framed by some here as dispensaries versus patients? I don't get it.

[bobandtorey]

GregS

 

Don't need to point fingers or give examples, that would be unnecessarily inflammatory. If you have not seen examples of this yourself then please ignore that part of the post. It will not alter the message.

 

Do you feel that patients should be able to decide for themselves how they get their medicine, without putting any party in danger?

 

To me is putting the cart Ahead of the horse lots of people would like to grow but the risk is to great at getting raided

 

Once you eliminate the fear of that more people will want to grow

[Restorium2]

As long as Pt's can keep their plants to grow or assign regardless of where they live.

Exactly. You can't have it both ways. That's the handwriting on the wall. If the dispensary bill passes then there is a HUGE chance that some patients will not be able to grow where they live. It's worse than a coin flip. I don't want to have the choice between moving to be able to grow, or having to go to dispensary. Where I live, the township may or may not zone out growing in a residential area. In some areas patient grows WILL BE zoned out. I wouldn't put a single patient in the position to lose the grow they love. But the dispensary advocates believe this is a fair trade, or they don't even understand what they are doing. I think they couldn't give a rip about who they flog to get their pot stores. That's what their actions show us.

[Restorium2]

Why is this issue constantly framed by some here as dispensaries versus patients? I don't get it.

Close, you almost got it;

 

It's dispensaries against patients GROWS. Reality is what framed it that way. Why else did they cut to the chase and just spell it out in the later states like Arizona? I think the truth spilled out in Arizona, they knew by then about the trade off.

[Highlander]

Close, you almost got it;

 

It's dispensaries against patients GROWS. Reality is what framed it that way. Why else did they cut to the chase and just spell it out in the later states like Arizona? I think the truth spilled out in Arizona, they knew by then about the trade off.

 

One might even characterize this situation as "big MMJ Business" vs. patient grows. I think what a lot of people miss in this sort of discussion is the difference between a person growing and a business growing.

 

Business already have about the same rights people have, and in some cases more. Take campaign contributions for example. Unlimited donations from businesses. That's crazy but that's what we have. Take the provisioning center bill. More protections given to businesses than patients. Again, crazy!

 

Now compare the most successful CG out there - that guy who makes $50,000 per year. How much leverage does he have to change the law? Very little. He could pony up a whole year's income and get his own bill written, YAY! Oh, but then who is going to lobby for him? Booo

 

Meanwhile, BIG BUSINESS not only puts $50k into writing a new bill, but many more thousands in advertising, lobbying, campaign contributions, etc.

 

How did agribusiness manage to get patents on seeds so they can prevent farmers from using this year's seed for next year's harvest? And then explain what is to stop a similar big business takeover of MMJ?

Edited February 19, 2013 by Highlander

[maxmax]

 

Exactly. You can't have it both ways. That's the handwriting on the wall. If the dispensary bill passes then there is a HUGE chance that some patients will not be able to grow where they live. It's worse than a coin flip. I don't want to have the choice between moving to be able to grow, or having to go to dispensary. Where I live, the township may or may not zone out growing in a residential area. In some areas patient grows WILL BE zoned out. I wouldn't put a single patient in the position to lose the grow they love. But the dispensary advocates believe this is a fair trade, or they don't even understand what they are doing. I think they couldn't give a rip about who they flog to get their pot stores. That's what their actions show us.

am not so sure I see no trade off here only that Patients should have safe access

and right now it's not happening you still be able to grow your own if you want to take the risk of jail time

 

Leo does not want anyone and everyone to grow they want it all in one place so that they won't spend time running around looking for grows and counting plants

[Northern Lab]

 

Close, you almost got it;

 

It's dispensaries against patients GROWS. Reality is what framed it that way. Why else did they cut to the chase and just spell it out in the later states like Arizona? I think the truth spilled out in Arizona, they knew by then about the trade off.

 

This isn't Arizona. 4271 looks nothing like AZ's law. 4271 doesn't give local governments the authority to ban private cg/pt grows.

 

Trying to claim otherwise is simply fear mongering. Cain-esque you could say...

[Highlander]

am not so sure I see no trade off here only that Patients should have safe access

and right now it's not happening you still be able to grow your own if you want to take the risk of jail time

 

Leo does not want anyone and everyone to grow they want it all in one place so that they won't spend time running around looking for grows and counting plants

 

Yup. So our lawmakers could pass whatever new bill they want to all for dispensaries, etc. It could be rock-solid in support of home grows.

 

Fast forward two years. The guy down the street who owns the dispensary is making $80,000/month. The home grower down the street is still paying his light bill two weeks late every month.

 

Big dispensary guy drops $50,000 to have a new bill written up, to eliminate home grows. It has instant support of LEO agencies all over the state. How are we patients going to stop that?

[Restorium2]

This isn't Arizona. 4271 looks nothing like AZ's law. 4271 doesn't give local governments the authority to ban private cg/pt grows.

 

Trying to claim otherwise is simply fear mongering. Cain-esque you could say...

Now you are out of line in a conversation that is in line. Totally jackwagon as you like to say(wackily).

 

Everyone should know by now that we don't get to see the wording that they vote on. If you don't then slap yourself up side the head for me.

[Highlander]

Now you are out of line in a conversation that is in line. Totally jackwagon as you like to say(wackily).

 

Everyone should know by now that we don't get to see the wording that they vote on. If you don't then slap yourself up side the head for me.

 

It would also be silly to think that noone would try to amend the bill later it passes and becomes law. Give big business a couple years to build their war chest and they will be back for more regulation to squash home grows.

 

A business has 1 purpose. To make profit. Tell the business world "oh, come on, take it easy on MMJ and make your money elsewhere" won't work.

 

The only way to preserve patient grow rights long term is to not allow unlimited money-making off growing MMJ.

Edited February 19, 2013 by Highlander

[Northern Lab]

 

Now you are out of line in a conversation that is in line. Totally jackwagon as you like to say(wackily).

 

Everyone should know by now that we don't get to see the wording that they vote on. If you don't then slap yourself up side the head for me.

 

Just because you may not see a final draft doesn't mean that it's going to threaten grow rights

[Restorium2]

I've been reading what the highest dispensary advocates and lobbyists are saying to each other. They are saying that they don't know how the wording will turn out. But they have nothing to lose. They are just watching and waiting to see who their runaway train will run over.

[maxmax]

 

 

One might even characterize this situation as "big MMJ Business" vs. patient grows. I think what a lot of people miss in this sort of discussion is the difference between a person growing and a business growing.

 

Business already have about the same rights people have, and in some cases more. Take campaign contributions for example. Unlimited donations from businesses. That's crazy but that's what we have. Take the provisioning center bill. More protections given to businesses than patients. Again, crazy!

 

Now compare the most successful CG out there - that guy who makes $50,000 per year. How much leverage does he have to change the law? Very little. He could pony up a whole year's income and get his own bill written, YAY! Oh, but then who is going to lobby for him? Booo

 

Meanwhile, BIG BUSINESS not only puts $50k into writing a new bill, but many more thousands in advertising, lobbying, campaign contributions, etc.

 

How did agribusiness manage to get patents on seeds so they can prevent farmers from using this year's seed for next year's harvest? And then explain what is to stop a similar big business takeover of MMJ?

and that is where we are BIG business and take overs And it will come from out-of-state $

They have been at it from the Beginning that's is what they do move from state to State with the same plan because it has works they have a jump on us here they have been at it this longer then the people here have been

 

let's all work together and get Patients their Medicine In a safe way and when That takes place the caregivers will follow

[Restorium2]

Just because you may not see a final draft doesn't mean that it's going to threaten grow rights

WILL NOT. No one but the legisture will see the final wording. From what I'm reading the dispensary folks think there's a darn good chance that grows will be zoned out in certain areas. They say it's worth it. Ask the patient that has a grow in that 'certain area' if it's worth it.

[maxmax]

 

 

Just because you may not see a final draft doesn't mean that it's going to threaten grow rights

that's a good point last time in lansing things happened while we where sleeping and most Politicians were sleeping also

[cristinew]

Look at Arizona Massachusetts New Jersey....

[Northern Lab]

 

WILL NOT. No one but the legisture will see the final wording. From what I'm reading the dispensary folks think there's a darn good chance that grows will be zoned out in certain areas. They say it's worth it. Ask the patient that has a grow in that 'certain area' if it's worth it.

 

So how are you privy to these conversations?

[Restorium2]

So how are you privy to these conversations?

I've provided enough quotes to prove credibility, that's all that matters. I even had all 16 co sponsors. I have several sources. Last night it was by phone. You get the idea. Darn good thing. Must be that way for a reason. Thanks to the powers that be.

[Northern Lab]

Lol. In other words, it's because you say so.

 

Sorry, you're going to need to provide more proof than that.