Michigan Admits Major Error, Dissolves New Marijuana Conditions Panel

[pic book]

We fought this rule for the panel in 2009.  We thought the makeup of the panel didn't make sense.  But they wrote it and adopted it and , as usual, didn't follow their own guidelines.  It would not surprise me that utter incompetence is why Celeste Clarkson(police officer) was removed as head of the program with LARA.  I have always felt she was the wrench in the works. Along with other.

Considering Celeste:  sometimes the cream, I mean not cream but crap, rises to the top.

Edited May 14, 2013 by pic book

[pic book]

On a good day Celeste Clarkson talks to folks other people can't see.

But you know that is not a qualifying condition for anything but political appointment.

Edited May 14, 2013 by pic book

[ozzrokk]

All of the conversation in this thread was interesting and relevant- until the comment made above by SFC.

 

I did read something interesting- Hayduke, you wrote that you rec'd the letter I wrote about, too. It was dated two weeks ago; you must have had this for quite a few days now. Why didn't YOU tell the community about this travesty? Anybody else feel like this letter should have been brought out into the open immediately, not hidden away in dark corners?

 

 

Exactly why I asked if I was in the twilight zone and maybe had missed something........

 

Edited to add ...... SFC you cannot honestly believe that is what Schuettes attitude is really about...... Can you?     BS hated marijuana way before Joe did that.

Edited May 14, 2013 by ozzrokk

[jamieuke]

Exactly why I asked if I was in the twilight zone and maybe had missed something........

 

Edited to add ...... SFC you cannot honestly believe that is what Schuettes attitude is really about...... Can you? BS hated marijuana way before Joe did that.

In fairness to Hayduke, it would have been informative and nice if he had put the word out earlier, but he had no obligation to do so. He and CPU do not traditionally share pertinent information with the community at large, and it is their choice to operate in a way that they feel is most effective to their cause.

 

I agree about the statement made by SFC- The AG, and many others in opposition, were poised to cause issues well before the MMMA was even on the ballot. I don't remember the specific instance in which Joe was protesting Schuette at a campaign fundraiser, but he was not the only one, and it was definitely not the underlying cause of Schuette's aggression toward the Act.

[GregS]

Thoughtful and careful consideration of the facts is much better than going off at half kok. Especially in legal and government venues it is typically best to digest the issue before bringing it up for general review. I do not see any time sensitivity that would cause harm in not getting word out immediately. The letter is, at best, sketchy and there is apparently more going on under the radar. Jamie is right that HD has no obligation to expose the letter to this community. The guy works hard at this, is smart and circumspect, has patient interests at the center of his involvement, and is beyond reproach. Now that we have it can we expect you to take some real and effective action to somehow correct the circumstance Rick? How would having seen this letter a few days sooner helped in that?

 

Kraazy Joe might not deserve the above criticism, but he has done much to embarrass the movement, and deserves harsh criticism for those things. As for the schithead AG, this is entirely within his unashamed and unfounded criticism against any use of cannabis.

 

i intend to approach this in the press, and in any other way that comes to mind, along with the thievery of our three and a half million bucks.

Edited May 14, 2013 by GregS

[SFC]

Rick you are so funny. Schuette would have still been an enemy but that event made it personal. I guess you guys forget how politics work. 

 

 I cannot speak for HD but I know that after the letter there was a lot of confusion and phone calls trying to get info on getting on the new conditions panel. Whipping everyone into a frenzy before we know what is going to happen accomplishes nothing. We will leave that to the likes of Rick, Jojo and Jaimie. 

[jamieuke]

The fact that you claim to really believe that Joe Cain created Schuette's personal vendetta against cannabis reform, is beyond laughable.

 

Apparently, politics works by pointing fingers at each other instead of the actual opposition.

[Northern Lab]

Wow, this thread is definitely micro to the macro of what ails our cannabis activist community.

 

If it were up to me, I'd excommunicate you self appointed 'leaders' and start over. Clearly egos and personalities rule right now, and it isn't helpful.

[Dr. Bob]

JoJo may not have been the source of his aggression, but I don't see you disagreeing with his giving it a face.  Personally I am glad he is back to posting music videos, and I am glad that there are cooler heads engaging in the political process to counter the anti's.  It is always easier to turn a fence sitter into an enemy than a friend, and we have some good people from the community building friendships in Lansing.

 

As far as releasing personal letters to the web, I tend to agree with SFC and others.  I would assume that attempts were made to sort out the confusion and move forward to the benefit of the community, and whipping the reactionary elements of the community into a frenzy with limited information would not have been helpful toward anything other than generating forum posts.

 

Dr. Bob

[greenbuddha]

Bill Schuette, like all politicians, has learned to use government inefficiency to his own advantage.

 

And until we, the voters, find a way to make them accountable, this BS will continue forever.

 

Count on it.  

[Dr. Bob]

Bill Schuette, like all politicians, has learned to use government inefficiency to his own advantage.

 

And until we, the voters, find a way to make them accoutable, this BS will continue forever.

 

Count on it.  

Well said.  I think they knew full well about the rules when they made the panel.  If they got the result they wanted (no new conditions), this 'problem' never would have seen the light of day.  They just held it as an ace in the hole in case new conditions were approved or the panel proved it would make its own decisions based on evidence.  I don't know who will be on the next one, I don't know what will happen with the conditions that were already approved, and more importantly I don't know if the voters that support these folks will approve of their tactics.  I think it should be an issue in the next election, and then it is up to the people to hold them accountable.

 

Dr. Bob

[+Malamute]

The protest being spoken of was actually done by Ann Arbor Medical Marijuana Patient Collective, chuck ream, and I believe ol peanutbutter there?

 

Screaming in Schuettes face like the day before the election when we knew we had already lost.  This DID cause a lot of personal animosity beyond the usual hate we received from Schuette.  This was basicly a get together for his closest supporters and families.

 

When I say screaming in his face, I really mean screaming in his face too. Spittle involved.  There was video as well.  Protest fine. Actual actions, not so much.  This event and its actions did cause Schuette to seek revenge.  Not that he wasn't going to mess with us anyhow,... but this event gave him a special reason to and it has been said to be so.

 

*shrug*

 

 When it comes to politics, you simply apply credit where credit is due for actions that were taken.  I can call you an arsehole and still keep my full focus on Schuette being an arsehole. 

 

 I know Jamieuke knows how much work was done to defeat Schuette and how much money we put behind Leyton to make it so.

 

 This particular event was done in bad taste and had the exact opposite effect being sought.  But hey, it is their right to do it, and it is my right to say it was damaging.

 

 But that is all besides the point actually.

 

 And Rick,... care to reveal your source for this letter you released? Or are ya afraid that person will not be invited back to be on the panel if it is shown? 

 

 Was there a reason this was not released until May 12th by chance?  Maybe because it hadn't been announced whether and how they would deal with the PTSD and Parkinsons petition until the 12th?

 

 Did the key people with interest in the topic know it had happened? Panel members and people that actually submitted petitions?

 

 Always in accusatory and conspiratorial mode aye Rick?

 

 Why not just ask the people you got your copy of the letter from why they didn't release it until they did? And why they are unwilling to let people know who it is? 

[greenbuddha]

Well said.  I think they knew full well about the rules when they made the panel.  If they got the result they wanted (no new conditions), this 'problem' never would have seen the light of day.  They just held it as an ace in the hole in case new conditions were approved or the panel proved it would make its own decisions based on evidence.  I don't know who will be on the next one, I don't know what will happen with the conditions that were already approved, and more importantly I don't know if the voters that support these folks will approve of their tactics.  I think it should be an issue in the next election, and then it is up to the people to hold them accountable.

 

Dr. Bob

And I hope that at least some of the energy that we are putting into our posts here, will be put toward contacting our reps in BOTH Lansing AND Washington. We have to at least try it!

[SFC]

Jamie, you were there that day, right?  It was stupid and it did hurt us. BS hasn't forgotten, you can take that to the bank.  How is 4271 coming along Jamie?

[+Malamute]

. Why didn't YOU tell the community about this travesty?..... brought out into the open immediately, not hidden away in dark corners?

 

 Hmmm, why didn't YOU tell the community about the unannounced committee hearing for HB 4271 and the plan to only allow the dispensaries pre picked and rehearsed "patients" to testify and not allow the "community" to know or testify at all?

 

Talk about dark of night my friend. I KNOW Jamie knew, and I can only assume you knew?

 

 Will you announce it next time?

[t-pain]

so why did the legislature do an entire bill about seating a panel if this is what LARA was going to do?

 

are the legislators angry at this move ? lara just spat in their faces.

talk to your reps. see what they say...

 

but yeah i was guessing the panel wouldnt approve anything. oregon has similar trouble with its panel being appointed by its anti-marijuana governor.

[t-pain]

so

bill scheutte put the MMMA under LARA

LARA's legal council is ... Bill Schuette

to avoid a lawsuit, and force LARA to seat the panel, the legislature enacted bill 4834.

the lara director seated this panel, with pro and con cannabis doctors and heyduke.

now lara destroys the panel.

 

i think what will happen:

governor tricky rick will appoint a new LARA head

the new LARA head will appoint a new panel of anti-marijuana crusaders

no more new conditions will be approved.

 

remember, the quickest way to ensure everyone has access to this medication, without it being politicized is to fully legalize and allow home grows for everyone.

 

otherwise you get crusaders doing stuff like this. throwing a wrench in every possible turn.

[CaveatLector]

so

bill scheutte put the MMMA under LARA

No, he doesn't have the power to do that.  It is an executive dept and under the control of the Gov.

[GregS]

Wow, this thread is definitely micro to the macro of what ails our cannabis activist community.

 

If it were up to me, I'd excommunicate you self appointed 'leaders' and start over. Clearly egos and personalities rule right now, and it isn't helpful.

What the hell are you talking about? We are taking the matter in and wondering aloud what happened and how best to deal with it. Yeah. There are some egos involved. It is to be expected any time large groups consider an issue and especially in the early talkihg phase. We were blindsided. Excessive noise will be taken care of. Notice that no time was wasted pointing out less than polite and arguably inaccurate remarks. Meanwhile it is up to each of us individually and all of us communally to sort the schit from the shinola. There is no news in that.

 

What are our options for the future? We will, in the end, comply with the formation of a new panel and pay closer attention to the details this time around. Our campaign to boost Schithead to the unemployment rolls will continue, and activism to unseat any and all republitards at the polls will take on more urgency..

Edited May 14, 2013 by GregS

[greenbuddha]

I'm sure that no one posting here, or even reading these posts is blind to the fact that when it comes right down to it, the combination of issues the MMJ community is facing are 'politically based'.

 

And until 'Lansing' swings over to a more MMJ receptive attitude, which will of course be determined by future elections, we can expect this type of political manipulation to continue. 

 

We have to become more organized in our political pursuits in the next elections, because here in Michigan, and across the nation, we are at a critical turning point in the acceptance or rejection of MMJ / cannabis.

 

We can bicker among ourselves, and it can be productive by defining points of action that need attention, if done wisely. If not, we will just spin ourselves in circles while our political opponents take advantage of the mayhem.

 

Let's not let them win.  There are far too many things at stake.  Our health and personal freedoms to mention just a few.

 

MTCW.

[GregS]

Let's not forget that LARA has generated several million extra dollars, much of which is to go to law enforcement if the legislature has its way. They had more than enough resources to do this thing right. There is no excuse.

 

I am finding nothing about the issue in the media and will contact media outlets to bring them in. Anyone else doing the same is more than welcome. Maybe we can put Schitte's face on it for everyone to see.

[ozzrokk]

It will be truly sad if those that worked so hard to get the 2 conditions approved have to start over again. And I am sure that will be the case. My personal opinion is that this WAS  as said before their ace in the hole. I could be wrong and have been many times it just all seems to convenient to me. As I said before perhaps they do not like what the panel actually did.

[Hayduke]

Oz, it is my opinion they just made a mistake.  Whether higher up's than the career people at LARA made a decision that they did not like the votes on PTSD and Parkinson's, no one I know would be privy to that information.  Personally I prefer to not think too conspiratorial about this.  However, you concerns may well have merit, I just do not know.

 

I can tell you this:  I do not think the Panel or the career LARA people anything but upstanding and honest.  This is not to say everyone agrees with each other across the board, but I personally see no conspiracy, and I got along well with everyone related to the Panel.

 

But because of this error, PTSD and Parkinson's are in fact dead in the water for now.  The new Panel, when back in session, will have to begin again.  So really the ball is back in the State's court as they must now assemble a new panel.

[peanutbutter]

BS hated marijuana way before Joe did that.

 

 

Umm .. I think it's more like "Oh Bill, if you want to continue running the money show for the family, you had better kill mmj in Michigan."

 

Bill CAN be replaced.

[ozzrokk]

Umm .. I think it's more like "Oh Bill, if you want to continue running the money show for the family, you had better kill mmj in Michigan."

 

Bill CAN be replaced.

 

 

And hopefully he will be.