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Wanting To Know How To Talk To Doctors I See About Mmj


cat66
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I am considering moving here permanently and have taken up residence for a while with my mother in Macomb County. One f the reasons I came here was so I could focus on a couple of my health issues.

 

I am a certified patient of MMJ in Colorado with a long-standing patient/doctor relationship with my psychiatrist there who also manages my chronic pain issues. Having treated many people for opioid addiction, he seemed open to filling out the form for me rather than see me take more opiates for chronic pain.

 

As a result of MMJ, I take less Tramadol than I used and it is the only thing that seems to help a severe TMJ injury I got as a result of a car wreck and some other injuries. I have chronic headaches as well that it helps. As for the depression, not much has helped that over time. I actually stopped using MJ to see if it had anything to do with this continually worsening depression that seems to get worse every spring for a few months or so. I gave it 8 months totally sober and I was nearly catatonic, unable to get off the couch to wash dishes some days and was probably going to end up with a heart attack if I took one more Imitrex for a migraine (as it said take no more than two a week or something like that.) I felt like I was ready to have some major psychotic breakdown and when I have looked back over my life, the times I ended up hin the hospital with the worse problems was when I was not using MMJ at all. So it's definitely helped but not enough for the severe depression headaches I get at times.

 

My point is is that I am going to get an overall checkup by an Internal medicine doctor and I am also considering going to Henry Ford Clinic to see a neuropsychiatrist in particular. I've been on so many meds for so many years and nothing works anymore. The MMJ makes it just a bit more bearable for me and helps my chronic pain issues from a few different injuries.

 

The challenge is that I am afraid to talk openly and honestly with new doctors about my MMJ use. I am on SSDI as well and can only work part-time and I worry that my use will get in some records and some Republican will cut off my benefits. I don't want to be judged or treated different for using MMJ and I'm worried some doctor is going to say something that sounds totally ignorant and stupid and it's going to totally upset me for days....(I know, I need to get a thicker skin....)

 

Meanwhile my mother says I should totally ask this new doctor to sign whatever forms I need to be legal here as it helps me.

 

While my own psychiatrist in Colorado certain has no huge issues with MMJ (and neither did another one who recommended I try it years ago,) I'm afraid I'm going to be barred from certain treatment that I might need if I fess up to being a patient from CO.

 

My depression has been so bad over the past four years that I'm finally considering ECT treatments to try and get things in remission. I have bipolar disorder and cannot tolerate most of the meds so they can never increase my dose and certain classes of them are out.  I practice Ashtanga yoga but that doesn't even help enough during part of the year.

 

So just wondering if anyone can share some experiences and advice on how to talk to a new couple of doctors about this - let alone ask them to sign for me if I stay here to live or if you have any recommendations for either an Internal medicine doctor and/or a psychiatrist in SE michigan who is not a hater.

 

Thank you,

Cat

 

 

 

 

 

 

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I can say from personal experience, that Henry Ford hospital refused me from treatment due to the fact I use MMJ.. This is coming from being a long time PT there being treated in the Hematology/Oncology department, they said its against federal law and they would lose their license if they allowed me to use mmj knowingly due to the fact it is a schedule 1 substance that was not prescribed by them.

They also knew that I used and were ok with it, But were unable to see me as a Pt, or prescribe any form of medications.

 

My point is is that I am going to get an overall checkup by an Internal medicine doctor and I am also considering going to Henry Ford Clinic to see a neuropsychiatrist in particular. I've been on so many meds for so many years and nothing works anymore.

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Henry Ford Hospital on 19 mile is the WORST place ever. Don't tell ANY of your Drs. In Michigan they WILL refuse to treat you, and will not give you pain medication. They are covering their own asses.Crittenton Hospital in Rochester is better,I know this from TOO MUCH experience.DO NOT tell any Dr you are a MMJ pt. They have a Wayne State Clinic there. I had to get a new PCP Dr. I picked the black Dr. dude with the dreads from Nigeria. But I sure as heck am NOT telling him. After a hospital stay in January 2013,i found out first hand what the changes are like in our "new" socialist govt. If you smoke,don't tell. If you drink,don't tell,If you are on antidepressants,even worse. This is gonna be really bad for us with pre-existing diseases. Oh and if you need a new Hemo-Oncology Dr,I have a great one. If I can help you,just ask.      J

Edited by jointedone
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I know this from TOO MUCH experience.DO NOT tell any Dr you are a MMJ pt.

I smiled for real, Man sounds like your at the end of the rope with Dr's like I am.... DON'T TELL a DR. ANYTHING at all about bud.. :bow: .

 

Horrible outcome if your in pain and rely on medications, they will cut you off on the spot, EVERWHERE! that sheet stays in your medical records /Dr. Comments/ it follows me likes a case of the herp.

 

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I think most are saying to get a cannabis specific doctor to sign your certification (once you become a resident of Michigan). 

 

Be sure the cannabis Doc does NOT send anything to your primary care Doctor and don't submit the cannabis Doctor's bill to your insurance company, if you can help it. 

 

You want to try to compartmentalize and keep separate the cannabis records from those that would generally be considered to be your 'medical records'.

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Thank you so much. This is what my instinct has been, but I figured since it is legal here maybe I could talk about it to most docs around here. I wasn't going to say anything to this new doc I see today though my mother thinks I should. I will now tell her I'm keeping my mouth shut about it and not to nag me just so I can save money getting a doc recommendation from someone else. This all makes me appreciate my doctor back in CO all the more. The fact that I've had two shrinks suggest I use it or go along with my wanting to use it enough to certify it for me, tells me it's not the psychiatric horror show that most medical professionals would think it is.

 

Back in CO, I never talked about it to any other regular doctors I saw at hospitals either. And I certainly don't want it affecting my ability to get the one pharmaceutical pain medication I really need if I decide to move here. That would be rough.

 

Thanks for the reality check! Really appreciate it.

 

I'll get a separate doctor for this and keep it comparmentalized.

Edited by cat66
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I smiled for real, Man sounds like your at the end of the rope with Dr's like I am.... DON'T TELL a DR. ANYTHING at all about bud.. :bow: .

 

Horrible outcome if your in pain and rely on medications, they will cut you off on the spot, EVERWHERE! that sheet stays in your medical records /Dr. Comments/ it follows me likes a case of the herp.

 

I had to get my record fixed somewhere once because one place I went for help for my depression in Ohio put me down as being opiate overdependent only because one doctor started me off on Methadone as the first long-term pain med so all the doctors after that assumed I had been abusing opioids. That took a while to clear up but I had to have someone write an offical redaction and put that in my chart. It pays to read your medical records for sure! Sorry that happened to you and yes, if you get in one of those big hospital systems, your chart is accessible ever after no matter who else you see there and is exposed to many opinions and comments. you are right!

Edited by cat66
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Henry Ford Hospital on 19 mile is the WORST place ever. Don't tell ANY of your Drs. In Michigan they WILL refuse to treat you, and will not give you pain medication. They are covering their own asses.Crittenton Hospital in Rochester is better,I know this from TOO MUCH experience.DO NOT tell any Dr you are a MMJ pt. They have a Wayne State Clinic there. I had to get a new PCP Dr. I picked the black Dr. dude with the dreads from Nigeria. But I sure as heck am NOT telling him. After a hospital stay in January 2013,i found out first hand what the changes are like in our "new" socialist govt. If you smoke,don't tell. If you drink,don't tell,If you are on antidepressants,even worse. This is gonna be really bad for us with pre-existing diseases. Oh and if you need a new Hemo-Oncology Dr,I have a great one. If I can help you,just ask.      J

Yes, I have had the full experience with chronic pain being treated differently because I have suffered from depression and been on AD's for years. I've been treated like I'm mostly psychosomatic at times and that has been hard to take. But luckily, my use of cannabis has cut down on me having to deal with pain management specialists looking at me with bias because of my mental health diagnosis.

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Well it drives me crazy talking about it and not showing what I mean, this is real life stuff, and I'm not just being a negative nanny..this happens and has made my life hell since the day I got my card, here are two separate examples, I could post the other 4 Dr's but you get the point from these one's..

If your family has a issue with you telling your Dr. show them my records.. It has ruined me, no joke.. I haven't seen a Dr. in 4 months or so.. and my illness is never going away I was born with pain and a shorter life span than most. Good luck and my advise it keep a drug clean kit in your car or use one before each appointment..

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it goes on and on, I really did give up and have been clean from opiates for several months now, all due to this subject. I hate when Dr's refuse me cause They act like I'm Dr shopping (that has been said in the past) Well if I wasn't refused EVERYWHERE due to MM I wouldn't have to go DR to DR seeking relief.. to late now..

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Wow. That really sucks. I hope that you have had some relief with MM alone and have figured out you don't need these Dr.s anyway. Do you feel better off the opiates?

 

Do you recommend a specific drug clean kit brand? I've never used any before and it sounds like a good idea in case I need more extensive treatment.

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So are you guys saying I could get pee tested WITHOUT even saying anything to them about MMJ? I mean afterall, someone has to pay for that and I can't see them billing Medicare as there has to be a good reason and these places are into saving money more than anything.

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In my experience if you are seen in a pain clinic, you more than likely signed a contract binding you from the use of anything that isn't prescribed by that Dr.

Note Dr.'s don't prescribe MM they simply give you a OK that it may help, You are breaking a contract by using MM, and they can drop you anytime they want if your getting scripts.

Now on the other hand if your seen by a PCP, they may or may not make you sign a contract, But they def can test you and have used said test to drop me/you. Not sure if that legal for them to do but it has happened their excuse could be anything as to why they dropped you doesn't have to be you failed for weed.. I can say that the weed has never not once helped me at ANY Dr. appointment. NOT one ever...

The drug clean kits can be bought at gas station or any pipe shop.. I've used ready clean in the past and has never failed me (Take 1 hour before a urine test).. Also I have used the fake penis as well, little pouch with a hand warmer and wala.. I have never had a Dr. watch me pee, always been sent to a closed bathroom to drop..

Probation is a different story they stand with one hand on your shoulder, and you have one hand on the wall the other holding the cup..

Yes I feel GREAT without the pills and patches, I could still use the Valium, they help with just about everything from spasms to sleep to anxiety.. I have found most Dr's would rather get you doped up on xanax personally they make me black out  even at the lowest dose.. I don't take any form of prescription meds, and have been cigarette free for 34 days :)

Without the Marijuana I can promise it would have been much much much harder to get through...so in a way, it was a blessing all these Dr's have been **********'s cause it made me get clean and realize that I don't have to be solely dependent on pills and Dr appointments to make it thru the day.

Good luck..

Trix
:bong2:

 

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At least the one doctor in the first document stated that it was controlling symptoms without a qualifier as to opinion!

 

Don't let it fool you, he dropped me as well.. Its all good and dandy but it still doesn't matter Marijuana is illegal until that changes I see no change in how they operate.

 

They have said those words to me before dropping me.. OR Stop using MM, and come back.. eat me, mr aszwipe in a white coat. I'm better off without the pills.

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One thing if your in pain management, a clean urine kit won't do

you any good. PM places also check for what's supposed your be in your system

if those drugs aren't found & only clean urine that will also get you dropped

faster than dress on prom night!

Mums the word when talking to Any doctor, especially the doctors in a hospital group.

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Just a word of advice for patients on pain meds and marijuana.  Solve a problem for your doc.  Show them that the marijuana is significantly reducing your need for narcotic medications.

 

If, as a doctor, having been taught marijuana is useless as a medicine, I find you have needed the same amount of narcotic pain meds now as before you got your card, it confirms that cannabis isn't doing anything for your pain and it is easy for me to assume you are using it recreationally.  I can see the rational for viewing that as a violation of your pain contract.

 

On the other hand, if you consistently are coming in and asking for less and less pain medication, because you don't need it as much anymore, I'm going to ask you what is different.  That is the time to tell me about your card.  When I can see it is making a major difference for you and I don't have to give as many narcotics.  I don't want to give you narcotics, your card solved a problem for me.  I am more open to that now.  I can see letting you slide and seeing if the same results occur in my other patients.

 

To be honest, I didn't think anything of cannabis until I started seeing my patients come off pain meds with it.  It impressed me.  The rest is history.

 

Dr. Bob

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Just a word of advice for patients on pain meds and marijuana.  Solve a problem for your doc.  Show them that the marijuana is significantly reducing your need for narcotic medications.

 

If, as a doctor, having been taught marijuana is useless as a medicine, I find you have needed the same amount of narcotic pain meds now as before you got your card, it confirms that cannabis isn't doing anything for your pain and it is easy for me to assume you are using it recreationally.  I can see the rational for viewing that as a violation of your pain contract.

 

On the other hand, if you consistently are coming in and asking for less and less pain medication, because you don't need it as much anymore, I'm going to ask you what is different.  That is the time to tell me about your card.  When I can see it is making a major difference for you and I don't have to give as many narcotics.  I don't want to give you narcotics, your card solved a problem for me.  I am more open to that now.  I can see letting you slide and seeing if the same results occur in my other patients.

 

To be honest, I didn't think anything of cannabis until I started seeing my patients come off pain meds with it.  It impressed me.  The rest is history.

 

Dr. Bob

 

So, I have a question for you being as your a Dr...You might not be able to answer that's cool, but I'm curious of how you feel.

 

Would you prefer your Pt's lie to you when asked if you use Marijuana, or would you advise to conceal the fact that you use Marijuana when seeing your average PC Dr., or PCP? (not so much now, but before you were a believer)

 

I understand now you can see the truths, of what MM can do.. but not all Dr's have figured this out yet.

 

I know that by me saying don't tell your Dr. anything that may rub some the wrong way but all my despise comes from factual reactions and the concesquences that have came from NOT concealing and NOT lying.

 

Also, being a physcian how would someone like myself go about getting all these MM comments removed from my records, it has made me go w/o a Dr. for months.. I'm on SSI what if they request my records and see Im using MM and they stop my payments cause of use of a schedule one drug... this scares me to death.. And my brother in law Cannot use for fear of being turned down for his transplant. Any drugs and he is not getting his transplant cause Marijuana is the devil and if you use your life isn't worth saving compared to the guy doped up on opiates..

 

Thank you for any answer you can give..

 

EDIT: If you read from my Dr. comments up there, it says no pain meds prescibed before being seen, and marijuana was used exclusively and worked well..

 

Then why did they put me back on norco, lorcet, Fentanyl? even though I told them no pain meds, MM works for everything?? Telling them in my case hasn't helped AT ALL.

 

To go a step further, they then say in my comments that, I'm seeking narcotics??? really I didn't even want the things they prescibe me then use it against me.

 

 

Trix

:bong2:

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I would prefer my patients NOT lie to me.  It is not my place, as a physician, to let my personal biases (and I have them, you do too), to come between me and the best outcome possible for my patient.  I need to know if you are on crack, not because I approve, but because it influences how I get your blood pressure controlled and I am going to keep an closer eye on your heart despite your young age.  Your drinking habits, sexual orientation and habits, domestic violence, etc, these are all things that come into play and cause me to either look for things that could complicate your health, to counsel you, and in general give you the best care possible, and whether I approve or not matters not.

 

I got in to medical marijuana because my patients felt comfortable answering my questions about the reason they no longer needed the pain medication they once did.  It was a good outcome for my patients.  Whether I approve or disapprove of marijuana use is not important, nor is it a factor in my decisions and strategies in your healthcare.

 

Dr. Bob

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As a side note, while reviewing medical records, I once saw an entry where a primary care physician 'punished' a patient that tested positive for cannabis by withdrawing short acting narcotics.  Punished them.  

 

Bad patient.  You did something I don't like so I am taking away your bike for the weekend.

 

Really....  

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I would prefer my patients NOT lie to me.  It is not my place, as a physician, to let my personal biases (and I have them, you do too), to come between me and the best outcome possible for my patient.  I need to know if you are on crack, not because I approve, but because it influences how I get your blood pressure controlled and I am going to keep an closer eye on your heart despite your young age.  Your drinking habits, sexual orientation and habits, domestic violence, etc, these are all things that come into play and cause me to either look for things that could complicate your health, to counsel you, and in general give you the best care possible, and whether I approve or not matters not.

 

I got in to medical marijuana because my patients felt comfortable answering my questions about the reason they no longer needed the pain medication they once did.  It was a good outcome for my patients.  Whether I approve or disapprove of marijuana use is not important, nor is it a factor in my decisions and strategies in your healthcare.

 

Dr. Bob

 

I truly wish all Dr's were straight shooters, and didn't stereotype or Judge.. No lie, this has changed my outlook and attitude towards every doc I see.. I have never ever ever lied ever to a Dr. the moment I tell the truth they use it against me.. EVERYTIME.. so I'm forced to conceal the truth.. and I'm treated like a dope fien when these doc are the ones forcing me on pills, then cut yuh off at the neck.

 

I was taught tell the truth or you could die, due to my health issues.. even the most embarrassing things I couldn't not say what is wrong or I could bleed internally and die. Now I don't have to even worry about that cause I can't find a Dr. to even treat my preexisting condition, so I'll just bleed out at home.. No worries!

 

Thank you for helping Pt's that need help when no one else will give it to them.. +1, also for the response..

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