Your Thoughts On The Local Weed Economy

[greenleaf]

Really, headies, or the main colas should be selling for $300 an oz.  Mids $200-$250  (pinecones to popcorn) Schwag $150-100 or less (popcorn buds and shake)

 

Street wise, headies either didn't sell, because the dealer or grower kept them, or sold between $450 and $700 an oz.

 

So technically, the $25 a gram no breaks stuff should be headies, but it's mids.  It's all mids, from what I've bought and seen.  Mids sold for headies prices in a legit weed economy.  And mids sold for heady prices in an illegal economy.

 

I think in a legit medical economy, $300 an ounce should be pure connoisseur stone and flavor, with resin glands intact, a nice cure of 30 days or more, a name brand and the best of selection.  This weed economy just isn't there yet.  Eventually it will be, as people become better growers and better selectors.  And those people offer their wares.

 

I also think poorly done hydro should bump the prices to mids.  Any imperfection really bumps it to mids or lower.  Pesticides bump it all to schwag, most of the time.  At least for me.

 

I can't complain.  Just observations.  Hope the diatribe didn't put you to sleep.

[motorcitymeds]

Really, headies, or the main colas should be selling for $300 an oz.  Mids $200-$250  (pinecones to popcorn) Schwag $150-100 or less (popcorn buds and shake)

 

Street wise, headies either didn't sell, because the dealer or grower kept them, or sold between $450 and $700 an oz.

 

So technically, the $25 a gram no breaks stuff should be headies, but it's mids.  It's all mids, from what I've bought and seen.  Mids sold for headies prices in a legit weed economy.  And mids sold for heady prices in an illegal economy.

 

I think in a legit medical economy, $300 an ounce should be pure connoisseur stone and flavor, with resin glands intact, a nice cure of 30 days or more, a name brand and the best of selection.  This weed economy just isn't there yet.  Eventually it will be, as people become better growers and better selectors.  And those people offer their wares.

 

I also think poorly done hydro should bump the prices to mids.  Any imperfection really bumps it to mids or lower.  Pesticides bump it all to schwag, most of the time.  At least for me.

 

I can't complain.  Just observations.  Hope the diatribe didn't put you to sleep.

Pretty much concur sir..!!

[Celliach]

Top quality sells for $250/ounce in the UP.

[michiganmedclones]

225 is 3600 for a full pound. you should be able to get that in a square meter in your room no problem every eight weeks. 9' x 9' room filled up gives you 9 square meters. We'll say you use 6 for plants the rest for air flow and proper spacing and work room. 3600*6 = $21,600 or $10k a month, $120,000 a year. If you are doing your "caregiving" as your business I don't think you should get too greedy on the pricing but if you have patients that pay it then have at it. I'm not flaming anyone you can charge whatever you want but let's all be honest with each other, there aren't ten growers in MI. People have top notch genetics and we've been doing it for a while now even us who waited to be carded to pop our first bean like I. I know there are cgs around here selling for 150 an oz and still making money, no they are not name brand boutique hand trimmed but it's high potency meds, not the prettiest but good for bho or rso makers etc. Don't want anyone to get their feelings hurt, it's the beauty of america you can charge whatever you want but the more you make the faster they're going to come knocking, just something to keep in mind. Do you share of charity, whatever way you decide to doesn't have to be money or meds, donating time getting your good karma built up will certainly keep you in a positive light

Edited September 3, 2013 by michiganmedclones

[michiganmedclones]

I'll add to my response there are some meds I've produced where I do feel they're worth more but I'm only with 4 patients and I don't change the prices on them, if there were more available patients with different incomes I'd fully admit I'd raise the prices on the boutiqe magazine worthy buds that we gets once in a while not every day run of the mill high quality something that really stands above the rest in one way or another. I guess my rambling is getting to the pricing is so subjective to quality, patient income, salesmanship, how much time you personally invest on a daily basis, how far you travel, that it's impossible to set an exact price table that should be the "norm" IMO 

[pic book]

i think the time has come that all growers should find a person who does not benefit from smoking but only gets relief from concentrates.  We should give the greens (trim and stems) to that person for free.  They can process them into the forms that help them with the med prob.

I give my greens to a former patient whose employer closed up.  He has not been able to find another job, so now lives with his parents.   He cannot buy gas, let alone a recommendation and a card. Most of the bones in his jaw were broken.   Without tincture he cannot open his mouth and talk...

[cristinew]

 

Top quality sells for $250/ounce in the UP.

or less  its that time of year

[solabeirtan]

225 is 3600 for a full pound. you should be able to get that in a square meter in your room no problem every eight weeks. 9' x 9' room filled up gives you 9 square meters. We'll say you use 6 for plants the rest for air flow and proper spacing and work room. 3600*6 = $21,600 or $10k a month, $120,000 a year. If you are doing your "caregiving" as your business I don't think you should get too greedy on the pricing but if you have patients that pay it then have at it. I'm not flaming anyone you can charge whatever you want but let's all be honest with each other, there aren't ten growers in MI. People have top notch genetics and we've been doing it for a while now even us who waited to be carded to pop our first bean like I. I know there are cgs around here selling for 150 an oz and still making money, no they are not name brand boutique hand trimmed but it's high potency meds, not the prettiest but good for bho or rso makers etc. Don't want anyone to get their feelings hurt, it's the beauty of america you can charge whatever you want but the more you make the faster they're going to come knocking, just something to keep in mind. Do you share of charity, whatever way you decide to doesn't have to be money or meds, donating time getting your good karma built up will certainly keep you in a positive light

 

Kinda optimistic? More realistically, they will spend more like an  avg 8 wks in flower, avg 4 wks for veg. Thats 4 cycles/ yr, imo your pushing it out. Then your growing only half the crop your entitled to? As a patient? Ok whatever.  

 

My experience has been 3- 4 zs  /plant so that should net you 1.5 #s / cycle 6 lbs / yr @ 3600 is only 21,600. Not includiing consumables nutes $1,000; elec 3,000; bulbs, pumps, dirt $500 gross = $17,000 plus your own herb @ cost + the joy of growing.... 

 

...remember that's only halfagro    ... 

[Celliach]

or less  its that time of year

 

That outdoor crap from the UP is NOT top quality.  I know, I live in the UP.  I have yet to smoke some outdoor grown from here that can stand up to good medicine.  In fact, there was a guy growing huge amounts of plants in the woods not far from town .He's been doing it since the mid-70s.  He told me he put in over 700 plants this year.  He's going to make oil out of all of because he visited a dispensary downstate and they told him it was the only way they would buy his product.  He put the large amount in because he thinks he can make oil and sell it to every dispensary in Michigan.  Last year, according to his son, they had about 75 lbs. and they were having a hard time getting rid of it.   Since MMJ became legal there isn't a call for his outdoor grown crap anymore.

[shishka]

or less  its that time of year

TOP quality, not outdoor.

 

Good dispensaries down state don't even touch outdoor.

 

Care for some bug pooop in your bud? I don't think so.

[pic book]

Demand determines price and there is masssive demand, both for rec use and med use, both for flowers of quality and for schwag priced right.  for concentrates, demand is up after the coa. 

 

what there isn't in the case of flowers, is much paranoia; in concentrates there is a growing chill statewide and a price rise into the stratosphere:  $100 per gram vial, sold only five vials at a time, and higher at a disp, and it is the sellers and not the consumers, who are spooked.

[solabeirtan]

Demand determines price and there is masssive demand, both for rec use and med use, both for flowers of quality and for schwag priced right.  for concentrates, demand is up after the coa. 

 

what there isn't in the case of flowers, is much paranoia; in concentrates there is a growing chill statewide and a price rise into the stratosphere:  $100 per gram vial, sold only five vials at a time, and higher at a disp, and it is the sellers and not the consumers, who are spooked.

 

Good point and what a great place for a plug for the Carruthers Fund ? How about a $5+/gr contribution for a little peace of mind? Feel it ...   

[Wings123]

90% or better of the meds ive come across in the last few years are prentedo boo boo slightly more potent than regos...even most of the stuff that looks good has something wrong with it. Michigan is full of amature hour growers and straight up morons, bug sprays, mold, mites, mildew, white fly poop that they think is a giant crystal, not flushing, 100 degree rooms, trim machines, ph problems...almost everything out there is  victim of one of theese issues.

Speaking as a patient I think michigan should be on par wiith cali, colorado, oregon etc top shelf fire nuggets at $250 everything else less. That is speaking as a patient I know some caregivers will disagree but at the end of the day this law is about helping patients, and i believe right now there are more caregivers benefiting from this than patients. Patients could still buy a little weed for way too much with or without the law.

The problem here is everything that is real medical quality gets put up on a pedistal and overpriced/overhyped...it should be the standard for medical marijuana to be exceptional ...

 

[pic book]

Wings:  how long did that take in CA?  CO?   WA?   Did it ever happen in Alaska? 

How about in the '80s, in the first MI Med MMMJ program?  Was it ever reached here?  If so was was going rate?

After inflation, what would that be in today's $?  Keep in mind gas was under a buck and the fact of drought pushing corn up a spike to $3 a bushel, gave farmers hard-ons.  Corn today is $8.

Edited September 3, 2013 by pic book

[Wings123]

Pic, i hear you we have some years before we are there...but at the same time rent and electric are way higher in those states as well. No matter how we each feel about it....this current law we have is designed to help people with medical problems...second to that iscreating an income for caregivers. More affordable access to patients should be more important than a caregiver making top $. I dont disagree at all w 300 for great meds the problem is too many people think they have great meds when they just have some weed for sale.

I find as a patient that our local weed exonomy is extremly slanted to the benefit of caregiver rather that patients.... There are way more caregivers that are happy w the money they are making than there are patients who are happy with the price quality and effects if the mmj they are able to obtain from those cg's. I have no problem w a cg making a great living i just think most are getting more out of it than the patients they are helping.

[motorcitymeds]

Pic, i hear you we have some years before we are there...but at the same time rent and electric are way higher in those states as well. No matter how we each feel about it....this current law we have is designed to help people with medical problems...second to that iscreating an income for caregivers. More affordable access to patients should be more important than a caregiver making top $. I dont disagree at all w 300 for great meds the problem is too many people think they have great meds when they just have some weed for sale.

I find as a patient that our local weed exonomy is extremly slanted to the benefit of caregiver rather that patients.... There are way more caregivers that are happy w the money they are making than there are patients who are happy with the price quality and effects if the mmj they are able to obtain from those cg's. I have no problem w a cg making a great living i just think most are getting more out of it than the patients they are helping.

If the Patient is not happy with Quality they always can switch.  The price is and always be dictated by the Quality, consistency, and the amount of work performed by the Cg to procure the product.  Yes people need to acquire medicine but pharmceutical companies  are given federal and private subsidies to offer generics or low priced medicine.  I do not see anybody offering any CG's a subsidy.  Or do I see the price to acquire Elite genetics being offered by any private seed banks.  well OK,, I take that back Doc Green thumb is a guy that gives away some freebies so that people will jock his gear to gain more customers.  But at the end of the day nobody is giving any subsidy or insurance kick back to ANY CG's.

 

This is why Elite Tripple AAA medicine always has a higher cost to produce, acquire and to  rigorously process to get High Quality Organic cannabis is always going to be more.  Sure anybody can buy some Happy Frog and Ionic nutes but that medicine IS NOT going to be nearly the same as the guy that goes the extra step to get meds that are Exclusive.Connoisseur grade. 

 

I don't even know why I bother going over this topic is is so beaten down in the past 5 years but some seem content with meds are only worth 150-200 an oz.  And I just have to laugh at that. 

 

This not only has re-occuring costs to produce but the grower takes on huge risk of jail or a lengthy court case to bring medicine to the market,  Yeah , yeah if you follow the rules your not going to get fuxed with ....riiight.  That is BS..if a neighbor calls the cops...LEO will get a warrant break the law and destroy your life even if your following the law they will find a reasonbring charges to extend their overtime and get a person in the system for as long as possible.  This is just the reality.

 

 

Soo... ....if people want 200 a zip meds...it is out there.  Not doggin it...but if the person needs a stronger or higher grade or Organics it simply is going to cost more.  Same things with a Name brand Vicodin versus generic vicodone.  Both will do about the same thing but one may have cleaner ingrediants or better quality control in the lab or factory.  same things going on in this industry.

 

It just is what it is.....until Insurance covers Med MJ there is always going to be this debate.  It's jus tlike why do all the muslim countries fight and hate the jews...because they have been throwing stones at each other since as long as we could record it.  It just is going to always exist.

Edited September 4, 2013 by motorcitymeds

[Robman]

If the Patient is not happy with Quality they always can switch.  The price is and always be dictated by the Quality, consistency, and the amount of work performed by the Cg to procure the product.  Yes people need to acquire medicine but pharmceutical companies  are given federal and private subsidies to offer generics or low priced medicine.  I do not see anybody offering any CG's a subsidy.  Or do I see the price to acquire Elite genetics being offered by any private seed banks.  well OK,, I take that back Doc Green thumb is a guy that gives away some freebies so that people will jock his gear to gain more customers.  But at the end of the day nobody is giving any subsidy or insurance kick back to ANY CG's.

 

This is why Elite Tripple AAA medicine always has a higher cost to produce, acquire and to  rigorously process to get High Quality Organic cannabis is always going to be more.  Sure anybody can buy some Happy Frog and Ionic nutes but that medicine IS NOT going to be nearly the same as the guy that goes the extra step to get meds that are Exclusive.Connoisseur grade. 

 

I don't even know why I bother going over this topic is is so beaten down in the past 5 years but some seem content with meds are only worth 150-200 an oz.  And I just have to laugh at that. 

 

This not only has re-occuring costs to produce but the grower takes on huge risk of jail or a lengthy court case to bring medicine to the market,  Yeah , yeah if you follow the rules your not going to get fuxed with ....riiight.  That is BS..if a neighbor calls the cops...LEO will get a warrant break the law and destroy your life even if your following the law they will find a reasonbring charges to extend their overtime and get a person in the system for as long as possible.  This is just the reality.

 

 

Soo... ....if people want 200 a zip meds...it is out there.  Not doggin it...but if the person needs a stronger or higher grade or Organics it simply is going to cost more.  Same things with a Name brand Vicodin versus generic vicodone.  Both will do about the same thing but one may have cleaner ingrediants or better quality control in the lab or factory.  same things going on in this industry.

 

It just is what it is.....until Insurance covers Med MJ there is always going to be this debate.  It's jus tlike why do all the muslim countries fight and hate the jews...because they have been throwing stones at each other since as long as we could record it.  It just is going to always exist.

[peacefulfield]

If you grow it right they will come....

[Wild Bill]

 

I find as a patient that our local weed exonomy is extremly slanted to the benefit of caregiver rather that patients....

 

Part of the problem is the yahoos who think they are going to strike it rich dealin' weed.  I've run across a few who never took the time to familiarize themselves with the law and think that they now have a license to sell.

 

"My registered patients make my grow legal and now I can sell my "overages" to dispensaries and other patients." Then they realize that dispensaries are illegal, they can't legally sell to anyone they are not connected to by the registry and that everyone else in the state can grow their own too.

 

Now they are stuck with $7000 worth of crap that the man at the grow store told them they would need and no way to get their money back, much less strike it rich. High prices help to recoup their investments and let them pretend to be big time operators in the "medical marihuana" business.

 

If you haven't already made a million selling cannabis then chances are you're not going to.

[Highlander]

Some yahoos think that because a dispensary can get $20/gram, that they can too.  So they whack down four plants and end up with 10oz. and hope to get $5,600 for it.....but they don't stop to realize that in order to get $20/gram you are selling maybe 3 grams at a time....so that's about 90 sales to get there.  This is where the math falls apart.  You can't sell to five patients and get $20/gram.  So you'd need to own a dispensary or sell a ton on craigslist and budtrader.  Knock yourself out.

 

I can completely understand motorcitymed's position that top quality is worth what he says it is.  Maybe he grows such awesome cannabis...and kudos to him if he does.  

 

Some people can get $240/oz and do get it.  Some people could get $240/oz. but settle for $160...because to them, caregiving isn't a career - it is a hobby designed to cover costs and help others.  They don't need to get $240/oz...they could get it...but they choose not to.

 

I have never looked at caregiving as "what can I do to keep my prices high/how much can I make off this caregiving stuff????"

 

I have looked at "How can I recoup my costs, maybe make a little, and keep my patients happy/flush with meds????"

 

Then again, for people who think it takes 50/hours of work per week to supply 5 patients....maybe they need to get $240+ per oz.

 

But some growers have a job in the real world, and they don't need $240+ per oz. to make it make sense, and growing isn't a full-time job/career/business for them.

 

Solution:  Shop around.  Compare quality and price.

 

Maybe Motorcity meds does have the best meds in the state.  I dunno.  I haven't and never will try them.  But I see plenty of patients with positive results who pay a lot less.

[Wild Bill]

Some yahoos think that because a dispensary can get $20/gram, that they can too.  So they whack down four plants and end up with 10oz. and hope to get $5,600 for it.....but they don't stop to realize that in order to get $20/gram you are selling maybe 3 grams at a time....so that's about 90 sales to get there.  This is where the math falls apart.  You can't sell to five patients and get $20/gram.  So you'd need to own a dispensary or sell a ton on craigslist and budtrader.  Knock yourself out.

 

Sounds like they would do better with Amway.

[+washtenaut]

Highlander, well said!

[LongHairBri]

I hear complaints and comments how caregivers are inflating prices or overcharging patients, and I agree to a small extent. but, I really think you've got some other "suspects" to consider. Namely, dispensary owners, warehouse growers and out of state importers.

 

with the constant availability of low cost, illegally grown or imported meds, the prices drop lower and lower. if your growing with 30,000 watts in some huge warehouse and harvesting every couple months, or importing out of state outdoor by the 55gal. barrel, there's incentive to get what you can, as quick as you can before your next harvest/shipment. Quality is secondary in this situation. it's all about turn-over time and profit. 

 

the pricing war this situation has created is then capitalized on by the dispensary owners. the savings sure aren't being passed down to the patient/customer.

instead, those profits are fed back in to the next shady supply deal as an incentive to lower wholesale prices even more. why do the meds suck at our dispensaries? because the growers who follow the law, who care about the product they produce and who don't treat a patient like a pay day, won't/can't sell a pound for $2,000 and expect break even. meanwhile, a dispensary owner selling meds for $25g won't pay the producer of those meds 1/2 the retail they charge. like everything else in this world, money is king....

 

a grower took 4 months, time, money and care to produce the meds. seems to me that's WAY more work, and nearly the same risk, as being a dispensary. yet, the growers efforts aren't deemed worthy of half the selling price?? realistically, with expenses, the grower share should be 75% and 25% to the house. if this model was implemented, the prices at dispensaries would be closer to $10/12g for CHRONIC. this low quality schwag that's sold now would be as cheap as brick on the street.