3 Comments Judge Sentences Medical Marijuana Dispensary Owner, Says Law Is 'one Of The Worst' David Overholt In A Photo Taken Earlier This Year, Wit

[1oldlady]

GRAND RAPIDS, MI -- Even as he sentenced a Grand Rapids medical marijuana dispensary owner to probation, a Kent County judge called the state medical marijuana law "one of the worst statutes that was ever written and put into place."

 

David Overholt earlier pleaded no contest to delivery or manufacture of marijuana and on Thursday, Nov. 7, he was sentenced to two years of probation, a $1,000 fine and 150 hours of community service.

 

Kent County prosecutors charged Overholt after police in March raided his business, the Mid-Michigan Compassion Club on Leonard Street NW. Prosecutors and police were acting on a February ruling from the state Supreme Court that essentially banned all dispensaries statewide.

 

Circuit Court Judge Mark Trusock said he was not going to order any jail time for Overholt, per an earlier agreement with prosecutors contingent upon him closing the dispensary by Oct. 31. The dispensary was closed.

 

Trusock used the sentencing as an opportunity to offer his own opinion about the state's medical marijuana law, passed by voters in 2008.

 

"I think the medical marijuana statute has become a nightmare for some good honest people," he said. "It just has to be one of the worst statutes that was ever written and put into place."

 

"There are courts all over that don't know how to handle it because it was such a poorly written law," Trusock said.

 

Trusock said he believed that Overholt was "trying to do the best you could under the circumstances."

 

"I realize you were trying to comply here, but you were not, according to the law," he said. "We certainly need some clarification from the state Court of Appeals or the state Supreme Court.

 

Overholt in September was prepared to take the case to trial, but at the last minute decided to enter a plea because the judge ruled that he could not use his status as a licensed medical marijuana caregiver as a defense.

 

Trusock sentenced him Thursday based on a "conditional" plea, meaning that Overholt may be able to still fight the charge if the state Court of Appeals rules he should be allowed to use his Medical Marijuana Act registration as a defense.

 

Before his sentencing, Overholt indicated he still believes he was following the law.

 

"I agree the law has many gray areas, but it was created by the people, for the people," he said.

 

http://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2013/11/kent_county_judge_sentences_me.html#incart_river_default

[bobandtorey]

Another important case was People vs. Robert Redden and Torey Clark, both of whom had received doctor approval for but not yet received patient cards when police raided their Madison Heights home in March 2009 and confiscated 21 plants. They were charged with felonies.

At their preliminary examination, 43rd District Court Judge Robert Turner threw out the case and called it “one of the worst pieces of legislation I have ever seen in my life.”

But the circuit court reinstated the charges and was upheld in September 2010 by the appeals court, which said Redden, who suffered from “pain,” and Clark, who suffered from “nausea,” didn’t meet the criteria for “debilitating medical conditions required by the MMMA.” Redden said he had a degenerative hip condition and Clark was recovering from ovarian cancer surgery.

 

 

The State and the Courts keep saying it's a poorly written Law i Disagree it's a great Law  imo  thats why the Courts keep fighting so hard to stop it

The pair currently faces criminal charges in Oakland Circuit Court in Pontiac.

[trichcycler]

thank you for that article. I'm guessing that when we choose to not follow this Act as written then we are no longer covered by it, hence leading to the common judgments disallowing a medical marijuana defense to be presented?  so be it. makes sense, and is well known. lets not break the law any longer, unless asserting our duty to break an unjust law, and taking it to the top.

[trichcycler]

Honestly though, the reason they did not receive their cards yet is because they did not mail the applications, yet, before they planted a marijuana garden, before the state authorized them, checked their backgrounds, and approved them.

I feel ya, and you have my support, but the whole truth is necessary to negate the ensuing arguments here I think. We have to take the totality of the situation, and the above fact is very incriminating. Theres a chance your applications would not have been approved, for a number of reasons maybe. I would acquit you if given the opportunity, for the record. I'm not picking on you or your case, just trying to keep it real.

love

.  both of whom had received doctor approval for but not yet received patient cards when police raided their Madison Heights home in March 2009 and confiscated 21 plants. They were charged with felonies.

[bobandtorey]

Thank you also and i think you would be the one that i can ask this because i have been asking for almost 5 years now and it could help me move on 

1. what  is the part of the Law did we break  in your opinion  ?

 

i do understand that we all know more about the Law then we did back in 2008 so it should be easy for people to say things like you should have waited for a card

and

 

i don't believe that part still today that it would have maid any difference

Edited November 8, 2013 by bobandtorey

[trichcycler]

I don't claim to know much, but can opine, respectively I think.

I don't think then, or know, that you would need to "wait" for a card.

but to the point, the application should have been mailed before you germinated a seed.

 

Completing paperwork will not result in any permissions in most circumstances, even with intent, unless submitted and accepted. The state has no way to know if you have disqualifications present in your application processes. Competing paperwork for a ccw, or drivers license, building permit, medical, or anything else I can think of would not be sufficient as intent, until accepted. 

I wish you would have had a return receipt/cert mail/cashed check, which would help to prove intent. A medical condition in our state, no matter the severity, is not enough to permit people to grow marijuana unfortunately, otherwise Felons would simply complete the forms, get the rec, and not send them in?

 

I am sorry if this has been hashed here already, I know the revisit is a bummer. I also think that many have the same questions and concerns, but afraid to voice them. If these posts help one person from being in court for a marijuana charge, then I hope you concur, it was worth it.

 

peace out

[trichcycler]

if you haven't figured out who complained to the police, inspiring their dumpster diving in the first place, beware, they are still close to you, and up to no good

[Chauncy Gardner]

There was a case in another state where an individual didn't even have a doctor recommendation, but he was obviously qualified to receive a recommendation (stage 3 cancer or something). He was acquitted. So, in some instances a recommendation isn't even needed if the judge or jury thinks the person deserves the right to use. It is all a roll of the dice at this point.

[trichcycler]

1. jury?  please link?

[Chauncy Gardner]

I don't claim to know much, but can opine, respectively I think.

I don't think then, or know, that you would need to "wait" for a card.

but to the point, the application should have been mailed before you germinated a seed.

 

Completing paperwork will not result in any permissions in most circumstances, even with intent, unless submitted and accepted. The state has no way to know if you have disqualifications present in your application processes. Competing paperwork for a ccw, or drivers license, building permit, medical, or anything else I can think of would not be sufficient as intent, until accepted. 

I wish you would have had a return receipt/cert mail/cashed check, which would help to prove intent. A medical condition in our state, no matter the severity, is not enough to permit people to grow marijuana unfortunately, otherwise Felons would simply complete the forms, get the rec, and not send them in?

 

I am sorry if this has been hashed here already, I know the revisit is a bummer. I also think that many have the same questions and concerns, but afraid to voice them. If these posts help one person from being in court for a marijuana charge, then I hope you concur, it was worth it.

 

peace out

Umm, I think you have made some incorrect assumptions. Felons can get medical cards, but they can't be caregivers. The law clearly states that paperwork is equivalent to a card if the card or a denial has not been received within 20 days.

[trichcycler]

I should have defined felons, as the ones specifically disallowed from participating in our program.

 

Please show me the law clearly stating an application completion is sufficient if no card is issued,  when it has not been submitted in the first place can be used to protect from arrest?  I don't think so

Edited November 8, 2013 by grassmatch

[bobandtorey]

Umm, I think you have made some incorrect assumptions. Felons can get medical cards, but they can't be caregivers. The law clearly states that paperwork is equivalent to a card if the card or a denial has not been received within 20 days.

We did wait the 21 days 

[1oldlady]

From my experience..... I did not break the law and even if it was written perfectly I still did not break the law. In short this is how it was for me.... Setting home minding my own business 20 bayonet guys show up raided my home charged me with three felonies then ! get tossed into the system for two and a half years to find out they illegally raided my home and then I am free.

 

I don't care how the law is written they will charge you if you follow it or not.

[1oldlady]

If you have a card and get a felony charge you will still keep your card and will be able to grow 12 plants for yourself. If you are a care giver and get a felony charge you will still be able to grow 12 plants for yourself as stated however the state will send you a letter stating that you are no longer a caregiver for your patients and the patients also receive the letter stating they lost their caregiver.

[trichcycler]

you say you mailed your application 21 days before you planted seeds?  did you have a mail receipt, dated money order/check for the transaction, dated 21 days prior?

How many days after the 21st did they wait to raid you?

We did wait the 21 days 

[trichcycler]

"our caregiver program"

I should have defined felons, as the ones specifically disallowed from participating in our program.

 

Please show me the law clearly stating an application completion is sufficient if no card is issued,  when it has not been submitted in the first place can be used to protect form arrest?  I don't think so

[trichcycler]

the devil is most likely in the details?     I've seen those guys in action, and sorry you had to be part of that brutal assault, by 20 something militant kids.

 

what were the charges against you? or maybe share those pertinent details?  

From my experience..... I did not break the law and even if it was written perfectly I still did not break the law. In short this is how it was for me.... Setting home minding my own business 20 bayonet guys show up raided my home charged me with three felonies then ! get tossed into the system for two and a half years to find out they illegally raided my home and then I am free.

I don't care how the law is written they will charge you if you follow it or not.

[phaquetoo]

We did wait the 21 days 

bob It has been so long I forget all of the details, so the posting above about your raid was wrong?  you did have a dr, certification and it was mailed in, check cashed and after the 21 days?

 

If not

 

That is what the a.d is for, you had a dr, certification so you did qualify according to your dr.

 

if you mailed in your app and check cashed and waited the 21 days you had the section 4, according to the law as written, and there were no cases thru the coa or sc at that time either, correct me if im wrong.

 

Peace

Jim

[trichcycler]

right, but they did not wait 21 days AFTER mailing their application, which was not submitted until after plants were inches tall.

Or, perhaps if the state had the opportunity to review the applications, if submitted, and denied it due to another incomplete or otherwise unacceptable reason, such as the doc eisenbud's rec, which they did later anyway.

 

I don't want to turn this into a rip on these good folks, or start another trial, but the truth needs to be clear and concise so this crap stops. Some in the thread still believe the apps were submitted, but they were waiting for the cards, and that is not the case. the plants were planted before the app was submitted.

http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(4dgr2z55lleu3w55wues2555))/mileg.aspx?page=getObject&objectName=mcl-333-26429

 

333.26429 Failure of department to adopt rules or issue valid registry identification card.

 

 

9. Enforcement of this Act.

Sec. 9. (a) If the department fails to adopt rules to implement this act within 120 days of the effective date of this act, a qualifying patient may commence an action in the circuit court for the county of Ingham to compel the department to perform the actions mandated pursuant to the provisions of this act.

(b) If the department fails to issue a valid registry identification card in response to a valid application or renewal submitted pursuant to this act within 20 days of its submission, the registry identification card shall be deemed granted, and a copy of the registry identification application or renewal shall be deemed a valid registry identification card.

© If at any time after the 140 days following the effective date of this act the department is not accepting applications, including if it has not created rules allowing qualifying patients to submit applications, a notarized statement by a qualifying patient containing the information required in an application, pursuant to section 6(a)(3)-(6) together with a written certification, shall be deemed a valid registry identification card.

[phaquetoo]

http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(4dgr2z55lleu3w55wues2555))/mileg.aspx?page=getObject&objectName=mcl-333-26429

 

333.26429 Failure of department to adopt rules or issue valid registry identification card.

 

 

9. Enforcement of this Act.

Sec. 9. (a) If the department fails to adopt rules to implement this act within 120 days of the effective date of this act, a qualifying patient may commence an action in the circuit court for the county of Ingham to compel the department to perform the actions mandated pursuant to the provisions of this act.

(b) If the department fails to issue a valid registry identification card in response to a valid application or renewal submitted pursuant to this act within 20 days of its submission, the registry identification card shall be deemed granted, and a copy of the registry identification application or renewal shall be deemed a valid registry identification card.

© If at any time after the 140 days following the effective date of this act the department is not accepting applications, including if it has not created rules allowing qualifying patients to submit applications, a notarized statement by a qualifying patient containing the information required in an application, pursuant to section 6(a)(3)-(6) together with a written certification, shall be deemed a valid registry identification card.

Thanks zap!

 

Im to lazy to copy and paiste stuff lol!

 

Peace

[phaquetoo]

right, but they did not wait 21 days AFTER mailing their application, which was not submitted until after plants were inches tall.

Or, perhaps if the state had the opportunity to review the applications, if submitted, and denied it due to another incomplete or otherwise unacceptable reason, such as the doc eisenbud's rec, which they did later anyway.

 

I don't want to turn this into a rip on these good folks, or start another trial, but the truth needs to be clear and concise so this crap stops. Some in the thread still believe the apps were submitted, but they were waiting for the cards, and that is not the case. the plants were planted before the app was submitted.

bob has already been thru it all, lets wait and see what he has to say, there are a few questions for him in here and he will answer them honestly!  Bob is a good guy, and I know if my freedom was on the line as long as his was, I would be one bitter mfer!

 

Peace

 

 

edit= I think back at the time when this happened, and I had the rec from my dr. I would prob start germinating seeds, Im not sure I didnt become a c.g or pt grower when I first got in, but with how the law was written I would have thought well if I dont get nothing in 21 days after I send in my certs I can alway yank em, after all if they had just popped and were only an inch or 2 high it would be pretty easy to just pullem and wait for the plastic, but we were told our paper work was as good as a card if we didnt recieve a denial after do days of check cashed,   that may not apply here, but how many folks you think had full blown rooms going before they even considered registering or before it was even voted on!

Edited November 8, 2013 by phaquetoo

[bobandtorey]

bob It has been so long I forget all of the details, so the posting above about your raid was wrong?  you did have a dr, certification and it was mailed in, check cashed and after the 21 days? Yes we had the Rec. the Raid happen March 30 2009 and then we went to court and the Judge dismissed the case and if the  judge wouldn't have dismissed the case then i would today agreed we where wrong 

We received our Rec. March 4 2009 and received our cards 4/ 20 /09 

 

If not

 

That is what the a.d is for, you had a dr, certification so you did qualify according to your dr. Yes

 

if you mailed in your app and check cashed and waited the 21 days you had the section 4, according to the law as written, and there were no cases thru the coa or sc at that time either, correct me if im wrong.

 

Peace

Jim

[bobandtorey]

From my experience..... I did not break the law and even if it was written perfectly I still did not break the law. In short this is how it was for me.... Setting home minding my own business 20 bayonet guys show up raided my home charged me with three felonies then ! get tossed into the system for two and a half years to find out they illegally raided my home and then I am free.

 

I don't care how the law is written they will charge you if you follow it or not.

Great for you but after the 2/1/2 years who won?

i am sorry you had to be one of the people that the courts tried to railroad 

When did you case get dismissed?

[trichcycler]

http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(4dgr2z55lleu3w55wues2555))/mileg.aspx?page=getObject&objectName=mcl-333-26429

 

333.26429 Failure of department to adopt rules or issue valid registry identification card.

actually, ..

 

(b) If the department fails to issue a valid registry identification card in response to a valid application or renewal submitted pursuant to this act

found that in your quote of the Act.

The dept did not indeed fail to issue a card, as no valid application had ever been submitted.

[trichcycler]

edit= I think back at the time when this happened, and I had the rec from my dr. I would prob start germinating seeds, Im not sure I didnt become a c.g or pt grower when I first got in, but with how the law was written I would have thought well if I dont get nothing in 21 days after I send in my certs I can alway yank em, after all if they had just popped and were only an inch or 2 high it would be pretty easy to just pullem and wait for the plastic, but we were told our paper work was as good as a card if we didnt recieve a denial after do days of check cashed,   that may not apply here, but how many folks you think had full blown rooms going before they even considered registering or before it was even voted on!

 

unfortunately the courts don't judge on the curve of lawlessness. I'm in no way judging these folks, and these points are not morally deduced opinions, but an attempt to build onto a factual base, to avoid any fantasy posting on the matter.

 Planting mj the day you mail your application is risky, and we all knew, and still know the risks involved. The legality is not hinged on the size of a plant, or an intention of culling it if denied. Paperwork was, and still is valid in court, but will NOT protect us from arrest. Lots of our community grew illegally I suspect, and for moral support that might matter, but remains illegal, with no protections form the law, for now.