Where In The Law Does It Say....

[MrRoot]

I heard via the grapevine that if you wish to be a patient OR a caregiver, that you are not allowed to own/ posses a firearm, period.

I have dual residency (2 states), and in one i have a concealed carry, and all my guns (all hunting/ rifles/ shotguns, except 1 pistol) are 100% legal in my other state. (Also being an avid hunter here in MI, with current registrations/ licenses)

 

I have looked through the links I found on michigan gov site, and did a ctrl+F search for firearms, but have found nothing.

 

Is this just a smoke screen, or is it in ink somewhere?  

 

http://www.michigan.gov/lara/0,4601,7-154-35299_63294_63303_51869_52138---,00.html

http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(raszyf45dvw0mh450ai5pdim))/mileg.aspx?page=getObject&objectName=mcl-Initiated-Law-1-of-2008

http://www.michigan.gov/documents/msp/MSP_Legal_Update_No._103_423389_7.pdf

[Celliach]

It's in a memo from the ATF.

 

http://www.atf.gov/files/press/releases/2011/09/092611-atf-open-letter-to-all-ffls-marijuana-for-medicinal-purposes.pdf

[trichcycler]

and decades before that memo it was decided that possession, cultivation, intent to deliver etc a schedule 1 substance is a felony, therefore........

You do not even have to be on the same property as the weapon you may "possess". Possession has many faces, and a safe deposit box is still possession, as well as a vacation home, friends house, etc.   scary stuff man, don't let anyone find them, or know where they exist, ammo too !

there are some full auto less than lethal non rifled type guns that are not firearms. They're capable of hitting a target at 50 yards, and better with more cash. Some even are shot shells, and big calibers.....ahhh, air.... not the same I know, but legal for home protection, small game maybe.

 

be safe

 

Possession of a Firearm during Commission of a Felony

The offense of Felony Firearm means that a person is accused of carrying or possessing a firearm when committing or attempting to commit a felony. It is a separate and additional felony charge and conviction. For example, pointing a gun at a person who is placed in fear of being shot is called a felonious assault. That is a felony. A second felony of felony firearm is being committed by being in possession of the gun.

Also, if a person is carrying a gun on them while selling marijuana to another is responsible for felony firearm. When the police raid a home and find evidence that the home owner is unlawfully possession controlled substances with the intent to deliver them, a felony, and there is a firearm located inside the home, felony firearm is often also charged. Operating While Intoxicated Third Offense qualifies as an underlying felony. Another common accompanying felony is the Felon being in Possession of a Firearm offense.

The penalty for being convicted of felony firearm, 1st offense, is two years in prison MANDATORY. A 2nd offense is five years in prison and a 3rd offense is ten years. There is no probation or parole. If that is not harsh enough, these sentences MUST be served consecutively to any other jail or prison sentence. Therefore if a person is convicted of the felonious assault (FA) and felony firearm (FF) and is sentenced to one year in jail for the FA they must serve the one year first then serve the two years for the FF after or consecutive to the first sentence.

The harsh nature of the felony firearm penalty points out the legislature’s intent to discourage the use of firearms while engaged in felonious acts. The use of firearms exponentially increases the risk of serious injury or death to all persons involved.

Effective defenses to a felony firearm charge include establishing there is no proof of knowledge of the existence or location of the firearm. The prosecution must also prove that the firearm was accessible to the defendant at the time of the felonious activity. The actual existence of felonious activity is also a defense. Self defense is also a valid defense. The law does not apply to a police officer who is authorized to carry a firearm while during the official performance of their duties.

It does not matter if the firearm was not operable or unloaded. Nor is there a requirement that the firearm is owned by the person whom was in possession of it.

[Dr. Bob]

It is clearly an outdated rule being enforced as leverage to get people to plea out.  When facing a mandatory 2 year felony for having a firearm while growing or possessing for example, it makes that offer of a guilty plea and some probation more attractive.

 

Dr. Bob

[MrRoot]

So lets get somewhat hypothetical, somewhat realistic...

 

If i were a care giver, and i adhered to the weight and plant restrictions, i did not charge any money for my services (ie family member), i am not selling a product, i do not use the product, and i maintain normal safe storage practices(unloaded in a locked safe, away from the areas with materials), the ownership/ possession of a firearm would or would not be considered legal? 

 

In the above letter from ATF  (thank you for that link) its not crystal clear about growing.

It states... "any person USING or ADDICTED"...

 

But I wouldnt be a user, nor an addict.

 

This may be a soap box issue, but that means that anyone that is a patient or CG is not allowed to own the tools/ equipment to hunt or defend their home (2nd amendment yada yada)?

Or you couldn't have your grandfathers granfather's firearm above the mantle?

 

In no means do i want to stir up a hornets nest here, but I am looking for some info.

[trichcycler]

as long as cannabis remains a schedule 1, this will be in effect I think

[trichcycler]

you are delivering a controlled substance in federal eyes, no matter of the addict, or use.

but, if nobody knows, than nobody knows....you might want to check your vehicle before you leave, make sure its in working order, double check your wallet, permits, expiration dates, stink socks, visitors, etc....nobody will care, if nobody will know....

 

by accepting the rec from a physician you are surrendering your right to own and bare arms, nobody takes it away from you, till you are caught.

similar to bearing arms in church, or a football game, movie theatre, etc.

Edited November 18, 2013 by grassmatch

[pic book]

you are looking for somone here to damp your fears

won't happen...

it takes luck--how much do you have?

?

[bobandtorey]

you are looking for somone here to damp your fears

won't happen...

it takes luck--how much do you have?

 

?

I agree and even it someone could no one is going to give up theirs Guns until they have to or forced too

[trichcycler]

this might be relevant, eventually. constructive possession vs actual possession, in home, law

[MrRoot]

Thank you for that link, Zapa.  If that would pertain to our topic, that would be great!  hopefully, no one will ever have to be in that position, where they need to find out.

 

It does ease my mind quite a bit, though.

 

Thank you!

[trix]

I heard via the grapevine that if you wish to be a patient OR a caregiver, that you are not allowed to own/ posses a firearm, period.

 

I have dual residency (2 states), and in one i have a concealed carry, and all my guns (all hunting/ rifles/ shotguns, except 1 pistol) are 100% legal in my other state. (Also being an avid hunter here in MI, with current registrations/ licenses)

 

I have looked through the links I found on michigan gov site, and did a ctrl+F search for firearms, but have found nothing.

 

Is this just a smoke screen, or is it in ink somewhere?  

 

http://www.michigan.gov/lara/0,4601,7-154-35299_63294_63303_51869_52138---,00.html

http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(raszyf45dvw0mh450ai5pdim))/mileg.aspx?page=getObject&objectName=mcl-Initiated-Law-1-of-2008

http://www.michigan.gov/documents/msp/MSP_Legal_Update_No._103_423389_7.pdf

I faced the dreaded Felony Firearm charge in 2010.. Thanks to Michael Komorn, I'm not in prison based on the 2 yr min. mandatory charge it carries.

 

All I can say is if your growing/(Manufacturing Marijuana) <--- Felony) don't keep your firearms in the same location as your plants.

 

Its a felony firearm if you are in the commission of a felony, growing pot is a felony. If your not growing pot you cant get charged with the felony firearm charge cause you aren't committing the felony of cultivation. Stay under your weight limits you should be fine to posses you weapon. 

 

Don't take my word, I suggest you seek the direction of a lawyer Michael Komorn should be able to give you solid legal advise.

 

Keep a fat stash of cash around to retain yourself a lawyer "just in case" cause court isn't cheap!

 

Good luck,

 

Trix

 

 

 

 

[trichcycler]

trix,

 

Is it your opinion that the legal concern is focused on firearms in or near the garden, or near the finished product?

Were your firearms returned to you ?

[beourbud]

It appears  leo has no appetite for law abiding cardholders.  firearm owners and non alike.

 

criminals manufacturing and distributing in the vicinity of a weapon....LOOK OUT!

 

 

In the voice of the Most Interesting Man in the World....."Stay Legal My Friends"

Edited November 19, 2013 by beourbud

[trix]

trix,

 

Is it your opinion that the legal concern is focused on firearms in or near the garden, or near the finished product?

Were your firearms returned to you ?

I would say all three, that's cause the cops are going to due the arresting, the courts will decide what will stick.

 

From my experience it was the plants still in the pot growing that defined manufacturing marijuana, with those words your now committing a felony which brings upon the min. mand. 2 yr Felony Firearm.

 

Now I'm not sure how the Judge whomever will be facing will decided whats usable and what not, but possessing marijuana and a firearm isn't considered a felony. Manufacturing Marijuana and possessing a firearm is a felony.. So IMO and I'm far from a lawyer, as long as you stay under your limits and don't cross the line of the written law you should fend well. (retain a established lawyer)

 

And to answer your question yes, after Michael Komorn had my case dismissed the judge ordered all my equipment, plants (dead) and registered handgun back to me. Thank you Michael!

 

Edit to add: I'm not advising anyone to have firearms around marijuana at all.. I'm just staing my opinion on how my past experience played out, and what I understood the law to say while I was going thru the system.

 

[MrRoot]

.40 sigma i know it well.

 

glad everything worked out for you.

 

If i pursue the CG route, ill have to speak to a lawyer, because as discussed, i am a hunter and have ccl, so obviously i have a few.

 

Thanks for keeping this thread relevant, and not a flame!