Caregiver And Guns

[suneday11]

What is the theory on why you can say no to the question? Sorry if I missed it.

 

Not trying to push you on this, zap. It's just a really complex issue with state, fed, mj.

Edited January 20, 2016 by suneday11

[suneday11]

Patients should stop using marijuana before they purchase a firearm. Caregivers have no concerns with the form. The program provides the benefit of confidentiality for many very good reasons, this is among them. Possession of a card is not evidence of marijuana use, either.

very proper lol. Thanks. That's sounds much better to me than using the morning you go purchase one.

[trichcycler]

its all right here: http://michiganmedicalmarijuana.org/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_id=3889, thanks zap , for the link. sums up all of what I was trying to get across. regardless of what is defendable, the feds, and even the state have spoken on the subject. Some of us could never afford attorney fees to defend ourselves after lying on a federal form to buy a gun while we grow/use/sell cannabis, which is illegal according to those enforcing those laws.

[trichcycler]

this is the appropriate place for that letter for sure. it reiterates what I was tying to say. NO guns while growing, using, or selling cannabis in the registry or out of the registry for that matter. The state says it, the feds said it, and I repeated it. you said its defendable and not "stand up". who cares , if a patient cant afford the defense? as in the majority of cannabis cases.

 

"NO new gun purchases while using cannabis in the program" = state believes what the feds believed in their letter.

[beourbud]

Mi legal lies is all about purposefully confusing people.

 

More Legal lies and symantic gymnastics.

 

Abrogate....Free the Weed

Edited January 24, 2016 by beourbud

[trichcycler]

first paragraph says MSP agrees with the ATF on marijuana and gun purchasing/possession. Both  quote fed laws that prohibit gun possession/purchase by a Michigan medical marijuana registrant.   is that much clear in the letter?

The department says card possessor is prohibited from possessing a firearm. 18 usc 922 g 3
"no exceptions in fed law for medical use of marijuana, even if he persons use is lawful under state law"

you say phooey  and state the opposite ?   please clarify,  I see no reason to copy/paste the first few paragraphs over and over, they say exactly what I'm trying to relay. I don't like it, would not argue for it either, but denial of this letters content makes me curious to what may be missed here, a proper patient protocol, and safety for registrants.  Normally patients are advised to follow our laws for their own safety. This would include following the laws quoted in this letter I'd hope

 

[Norby]

Don't judges decide?  I don't think the ATF and State can make those decisions.  DEA also got TSA to illegally tell them which bags to check for asset forfeiture.  Agencies like this overstep their boundaries all the time.  Judges and cops have both given back firearms to people with registry cards, mj and grows.  Some have required lawyers but I believe them to be in the wrong to take them in the first place.

Edited January 24, 2016 by Norby

[phaquetoo]

Don't judges decide?  I don't think the ATF and State can make those decisions.  DEA also got TSA to illegally tell them which bags to check for asset forfeiture.  Agencies like this overstep their boundaries all the time.  Judges and cops have both given back firearms to people with registry cards, mj and grows.  Some have required lawyers but I believe them to be in the wrong to take them in the first place.

I got my .22 rifle back,  I got popped on friday nite, they searched my camper, took my mm, my loaded gun and me to jail, I bonded out in the morning, and monday morning I was at the po po station that took my gun to get it back, I had my gun back mon morning, with the bullets in a baggie!

 

personaly I would say no im not adicted to mj,  Because im not, I was addicted to methadone and xanax though,, mj is not addicting so I would not be lying!

 

Peace

[trichcycler]

ha phaq!!!   nobody is addicted to cannabis, or water for that matter.

 

but the law says "user" too, and those pesky feds say no medical use acknowledged. addicted or not, feds say herb is illegal, if you use it, even with state approval, you are an illegal user of cannabis. 

peace 

[trichcycler]

You are missing the forest for the trees here. You seem to be able to read only the point you wish to make, and not see any others at all.

please discuss the first few paragraphs of the letter ? Specifically paragraph one and two, citing federal law concerning marijuana, medical use, and federal acceptance. On to the opinion that a card means an unlawful user of cannabis as far as the feds are concerned... One paragraph at a time, and tell me what those quoted laws mean to you.

 

thank you

peace

[Norby]

ha phaq!!!   nobody is addicted to cannabis, or water for that matter.

 

but the law says "user" too, and those pesky feds say no medical use acknowledged. addicted or not, feds say herb is illegal, if you use it, even with state approval, you are an illegal user of cannabis. 

peace 

And states have not been shown to have to uphold federal law.

[Restorium2]

And states have not been shown to have to uphold federal law.

Exactly. The U.S. Supreme Court has weighed in, and also weighed out, letting the states decide on this issue. I thought we had gotten past this and were in the 'educating the public' mode. Yet we actually have people who could be helping educate the public holding us back, rolling around in the dis information spewed by the yet to be educated. 

[Willy]

Well ya know , this is an interesting tide bit from a couple years back..

 

Lawyers, guns and money: a day inside the Genesee County gun board

 

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By Blake Thorne | bthorne1@mlive.com 
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GENESEE COUNTY, Michigan — For Kurt Weiss, it all came down to one vote.

If Genesee County Assistant Prosecutor Tim Cassady voted yes, Weiss got to keep his concealed pistol license. If it was a no, then the Flint man had a tough choice to make:

Give up his license to carry a concealed weapon or forfeit his medical marijuana card.

View full sizeRyan Garza | The Flint JournalMichigan State Police Lt. Stephen Sipes Genesee (left) and County Sheriff's Lt. Matthew Rule go over some issues they have with a CCW applicant during a gun board meeting at the Genesee County Clerks office in Flint.

Weiss, 36, was ticketed in September for failing to tell a police officer he had his gun on him. To have his license reinstated after a six-month suspension, he was called into a recent meeting of the county’s concealed weapon licensing board.

His is just one of 200 licenses that members of the Genesee County gun board had before them to review at a recent meeting.

The board is one of the busiest in the state, meeting twice per month in a clerk’s office conference room — but rarely does anyone from the public take notice.

In counties across the state, gun boards are tasked with carrying out the state law. They depend on a process of record keeping that is filled with spotty reporting and lax oversight, a Booth Michigan investigation found.

For example, boards across the state regularly neglect to file required year-end reports to the state — including Genesee County last year.

Their job is not easy.

The law thrusts a hefty workload on local boards with limited resources. Counties collect $41 of the $105 application fee.

“My personal opinion is that the county doesn’t get a fair share of that fee considering that all the record keeping is done here,” said Doreen Fulcher, elections supervisor at the clerk’s office. “In the month of March 2011, we processed almost 600 applications. And we have a staff of four.”

The county has nearly 14,000 people approved to carry concealed weapons — trailing only Macomb, Oakland and Wayne counties, the Booth investigation found.

The gun board includes a group of officials representing the sheriff, prosecutor, county clerk and state police. It meets twice a month to approve, deny, revoke or suspend licenses to carry a concealed weapon, called CCWs for short.

When board members aren’t meeting with license holders or applicants, they go through applications and renewals — pre-reviewed by the clerk’s representative — with an assembly line precision.

Unlike some counties, Genesee’s clerk, prosecutor and sheriff send representatives to the meeting rather than appearing themselves.

Genesee County Sheriff’s Capt. Chris Swanson and Michigan State Police Sgt. Jeff Bauermeister regularly look to Cassady for questions about laws and violations.

The pounding of rubber stamps on paper sets the tempo in the room like a metronome.

“I need to get new ink,” Swanson says at one point.

Deputy Clerk Cathy Cole represents the clerk’s office, which doesn’t vote but handles the bulk of paperwork and clerical duties.

Gun boards across the state tend to have their own style. For example, some make all applicants show up in person. In Genesee County, the board calls applicants in for unusual or contentious cases — like Weiss’s.

If the Genesee County board was ever a stiff, formal affair, those conventions were abandoned long ago.

“Why would a guy born in 1922 want a CCW?” Bauermeister says of one application. “Where’s he gonna go?”

Typically only a handful of current or aspiring CCW holders appear in person each month. Weiss was one of four at the April meeting.

The board denied the woman and man with convictions, but approved the man whose brother raised concerns.

“I don’t find anything (that merits a revocation),” Swanson said, before turning to question the applicant.

“Why do you want a CCW, sir?” Swanson asked.

“Self protection,” he responded.

“Can’t disagree with that,” Swanson said.

Weiss’s case would normally be a run-of-the-mill suspension for the board. Then the 

Weiss breathed a sigh of relief. He didn’t expect things to work out in his favor.

“I was a little caught off-guard by your decision,” he said. “So thank you.”

It was all in a day’s work for the county’s gun board.

 

medical marijuana issue came to light and behooved the board to take a stand.

Genesee County Sheriff’s Capt. Chris Swanson voted yes. Michigan State Police Sgt. Jeff Bauermeister voted no, based on advice from MSP’s legal council.

With their split vote, the decision on whether Weiss’s license should be reinstated was left up to Cassady.

Cassady told Weiss he’s checked with the U.S. Attorney’s office, which assures him they have no intention of prosecuting against CCW holders violating federal law by following the medical marijuana law Michigan voters passed in 2008.

“So based upon that, since you’re in compliance with state law ... it’s the position of the prosecutor to vote yes,” Cassady said.

Edited January 25, 2016 by Willy

[Willy]

could this constitute precedence? Or rather what should we take from this??

Edited January 25, 2016 by Willy

[outsideinthecold]

What I would take from this is quit using mmj before buying a gun. Feel free to start again after completing the purchase.

 

Then there is the oitc approach to concealed carrying (not recommended except for 70-yr-old combat infantry veterans). Pay your money, take the class, get the graduation certificate, and keep it in your possession if carrying but don't get the actual CCW.

 

Try to avoid unpleasantness. Apologize and hope for the best if conditions require. Otherwise, don't ask and don't tell.

 

Two people can keep a secret if one of them is dead.

Edited January 25, 2016 by outsideinthecold

[mibrains]

nothing on the CCW asks about cannabis use?

 

i posted the form on page 4 weeks ago....

 

i still have not seen that question in person asking about cannabis use.

 

i can not find the federal forms online..

 

i suppose i will have to go and buy a firearm and check it out for myself.

 

i am a combat Veteran and i get to keep my Guns always and forever.

 

if you are an American - I put my life on the line so you could keep your guns too.

 

taking our guns away from us is not an option folks.

 

My Guns = My Life

 

i do not have my Guns here right now but after rereading this thread and considering the input...i am going to go get them back today.

 

i am tired of hiding.

[Restorium2]

Exactly. Strength in numbers. The biggest problem with guns are gun free zones. If everyone can assume a grow is a gun free zone then we have a big problem. 

[phaquetoo]

nothing on the CCW asks about cannabis use?

 

i posted the form on page 4 weeks ago....

 

i still have not seen that question in person asking about cannabis use.

 

i can not find the federal forms online..

 

i suppose i will have to go and buy a firearm and check it out for myself.

 

i am a combat Veteran and i get to keep my Guns always and forever.

 

if you are an American - I put my life on the line so you could keep your guns too.

 

taking our guns away from us is not an option folks.

 

My Guns = My Life

 

i do not have my Guns here right now but after rereading this thread and considering the input...i am going to go get them back today.

 

i am tired of hiding.

always and forever dont count if you catch a fellony along the way, correct or incorrect?

 

Peace

[t-pain]

in fbi affidavits they mention medical marijuana and guns.

 

http://media.clickondetroit.com/document_dev/2016/02/05/SKM_C554e16020515520_2078266_ver1.0.pdf

[TomStone]

I really hope that gun laws don't change too much in the US because I really love hunting and I don't want anyone to take that away from me. I own a few guns and I plan on having more and I only use them when I'm hunting My model is  ATN X-SIGHT 4K PRO 3-14X  and it is really good. I haven't paid too much for it and it really does a great job as a night vision scope. It is also good while using it at daytime and it's HD sensors really give you full HD resolution system. You can check out this hunting scope on ATN website, they sell a lot of different ones and they are all great quality.

Edited May 30, 2020 by TomStone

[Restorium2]

13 hours ago, TomStone said:

I really don't understand the people that are against guns.

I noticed the election bots are back. Just lookin' to start an argument.