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Wait Times For A New Patient.


Willy
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Guys i know that there is a wait period on a patient getting their first card.. but what about a cg change for an existing patient changing CG's  ,, I heard there is no wait time for that. But have also heard there is.. what is your take on it . there was a post about carrying your change forms, selling to a patient then chucking the change forms as a safe way to transfer.. ?? so what do you guys think is how lara  interprets the change requirements as in time ...

Edited by Willy
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Im not sure willy, but when I did a change of adress it took like 3 months or more, that was at the beginning of this yr!  I changed my adress on jan 4th,

 

I called them and they told me they do renewells and new certs first and than all others after!

 

I hope they are getting faster for you!

 

Peace

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 I heard there is no wait time for that.

 

 

You have to consider the possibility that the paperwork isn't approved ever. Unless you know them very personally you don't know about their actual status. In other words, they could be BSing you totally about their actual status to get some meds from you before the paperwork gets denied for whatever reason. In that position, you would be very vulnerable legally. You would have no legal ground to stand on if a transfer was challenged.

Edited by Restorium2
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 I heard there is no wait time for that.

 

 

You have to consider the possibility that the paperwork isn't approved ever. Unless you know them very personally you don't know about their actual status. In other words, they could be BSing you totally about their actual status to get some meds from you before the paperwork gets denied for whatever reason. In that position, you would be very vulnerable legally. You would have no legal ground to stand on if a transfer was challenged.

I hear ya resto, thats what i thought as well... then again its risky with an established patient.. lol if they get into hot water you know you will be also :( 

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The Bylsma and Overholt appeals ruling made it very clear.  You DO NOT have to be linked by LARA.  No need to send paperwork in at all, so no need to have a wait.  LARA can't determine if the Doctor has approved a patient, so once a Dr says they need Cannabis for their issues, and it is a state approved condition, they don't even have to submit that to LARA.  Our law says we have a section 8 defense with just a Dr letter saying he thinks it is a good idea.  So, you are no longer in a section 4, but rather a section 8.

 

If you are a CG, and are not assisting more than 5 people, you fit the appeals court opinion.  You have already had a Background check and have been approved to dispense to qualifying patients, the only question is which 5 patients.  So they need to get you on helping more than 5 patients during a certain time period...

 

Now, the problem is, they say you can assist no more than 5 PT's, but give no time frame.  5 PT's per year?  5 per month?  5 per hour?  5 at the same time?  Once a PT has meds from you, are you still working as their primary CG if you never took over their plants?  Or are you relieved of your Primary CG status since you aren't linked through LARA and you aren't caring for plants for that PT and they desire to take it back over themselves or go to a new CG? 

 

I prefer the last question, but it really comes down to what would a judge or jury say, since it is a court defense, not an immediate pass.

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The Bylsma and Overholt appeals ruling made it very clear. You DO NOT have to be linked by LARA. No need to send paperwork in at all, so no need to have a wait. LARA can't determine if the Doctor has approved a patient, so once a Dr says they need Cannabis for their issues, and it is a state approved condition, they don't even have to submit that to LARA. Our law says we have a section 8 defense with just a Dr letter saying he thinks it is a good idea. So, you are no longer in a section 4, but rather a section 8.

 

If you are a CG, and are not assisting more than 5 people, you fit the appeals court opinion. You have already had a Background check and have been approved to dispense to qualifying patients, the only question is which 5 patients. So they need to get you on helping more than 5 patients during a certain time period...

 

Now, the problem is, they say you can assist no more than 5 PT's, but give no time frame. 5 PT's per year? 5 per month? 5 per hour? 5 at the same time? Once a PT has meds from you, are you still working as their primary CG if you never took over their plants? Or are you relieved of your Primary CG status since you aren't linked through LARA and you aren't caring for plants for that PT and they desire to take it back over themselves or go to a new CG?

 

I prefer the last question, but it really comes down to what would a judge or jury say, since it is a court defense, not an immediate pass.

You're High....lol Edited by beourbud
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You're High....lol

Actually not yet today...

 

Have you read the Bylsma/Overholt decision?  It was pretty clear when they said you did not need to send it into the state.  And I have sat down with a lawyer and discussed this exact decision, this is what he has told me, based on Overholt, and all of the rest...

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Actually not yet today...

 

Have you read the Bylsma/Overholt decision?  It was pretty clear when they said you did not need to send it into the state.  And I have sat down with a lawyer and discussed this exact decision, this is what he has told me, based on Overholt, and all of the rest...

I hope you also discussed his fee for helping you because you didn't guard yourself from arrest by registering with the State.

 

I'm hearing some numbers upwards of $10,000 now for an affirmative defense because you didn't register. 

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The main reason someone would send the paperwork in to the State is to check if everyone is eligible. Like the doctor is in good standing. The medical condition is properly stated. There are no felonies on the caregiver records. All pre approved because the cops assume no one is really eligible. Without pre approval by the State you have to prove all of it in court. 

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I hope you also discussed his fee for helping you because you didn't guard yourself from arrest by registering with the State.

 

I'm hearing some numbers upwards of $10,000 now for an affirmative defense because you didn't register. 

Willy didn't ask how to get a Section 4 pass, and cops don't accept section 4 anyway a lot of the time.  Yes we did discuss his fees for section 8, and if you touch Medical Marijuana, or Marijuana at all, you are subject to search and arrest, all we can do is mitigate and minimize your risk.

The main reason someone would send the paperwork in to the State is to check if everyone is eligible. Like the doctor is in good standing. The medical condition is properly stated. There are no felonies on the caregiver records. All pre approved because the cops assume no one is really eligible. Without pre approval by the State you have to prove all of it in court. 

Like I said, if you are already a CG, then you already have had a Background Check, you have no felonies, etc. 

 

Willy asked the question about not registering, so it is obvious the OP wanted to know about section 8, not section 4, so you are already in a Judge/Jury question, from his original post. 

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The main reason someone would send the paperwork in to the State is to check if everyone is eligible. Like the doctor is in good standing. The medical condition is properly stated. There are no felonies on the caregiver records. All pre approved because the cops assume no one is really eligible. Without pre approval by the State you have to prove all of it in court. 

And as I stated, the Court of Appeals stated very specifically that you do not have to send it in.  That's what I stated.  Not that it won't cost you $10k, just that they said you don't have to, which is how it is stated in our law. 

 

Just like the whole keeping it in your trunk, our law states that it supersedes ANY other law, and our law says nothing about trunks, and says we are Immune from prosecution for transportation.  Yet people are arrested for transporting outside of a locked container in their trunk, even though the law says if you are carded you don't have to.

 

This same lawyer told me to transport it in a locked box in my trunk.  He isn't an idiot, he agrees that legally I am correct, I can have it on my front seat, but it isn't worth $10k to prove it, and it all comes down to a jury.

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Willy didn't ask how to get a Section 4 pass, and cops don't accept section 4 anyway a lot of the time.  Yes we did discuss his fees for section 8, and if you touch Medical Marijuana, or Marijuana at all, you are subject to search and arrest, all we can do is mitigate and minimize your risk.

Like I said, if you are already a CG, then you already have had a Background Check, you have no felonies, etc. 

 

Willy asked the question about not registering, so it is obvious the OP wanted to know about section 8, not section 4, so you are already in a Judge/Jury question, from his original post. 

Sure he did if you think a little bit about it. He asked about wait times. That means section 4.

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Willy didn't ask how to get a Section 4 pass, and cops don't accept section 4 anyway a lot of the time.  Yes we did discuss his fees for section 8, and if you touch Medical Marijuana, or Marijuana at all, you are subject to search and arrest, all we can do is mitigate and minimize your risk.

Like I said, if you are already a CG, then you already have had a Background Check, you have no felonies, etc. 

 

Willy asked the question about not registering, so it is obvious the OP wanted to know about section 8, not section 4, so you are already in a Judge/Jury question, from his original post. 

I passed the felony check for a few years and then I didn't. Things are not always as cut and dried as you are making them out to be. That's why we register, to avoid a lot of BS.

The cops around here respect a card if it's used properly. It definitely has it's uses. 

 

You are being arbitrary when there's no need to be. It's great to hear about section 8 wins. Got any to tell us about? Your advice is sound in the right circumstances just like mine is. 

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Sure he did if you think a little bit about it. He asked about wait times. That means section 4.

He asked our take on if you needed to wait or not.  Obviously you say yes.  And it is pretty obvious I am saying, it is not cut and dry depending on the cop who sees it, but according to the Court of Appeals, getting a change form, not sending it in, and then chucking it is OK with them.  I am stating what the CoA said in a recent ruling, deciphered by an actual attorney, but he definitely said it is best to be carded etc if any law enforcement witnesses it and not chuck the form when you are done.

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A LARA supervisor  told me directly that we are not suppose to start working with new patients until cards are in hand the 21 day rule does not apply to the change forms.

Lara doesn't know law, they will tell you that as well.  Following their advice may work sometimes like this, but as the CoA said, we don't have to send it into LARA.

 

UNLESS of course you are talking section 4, then it is card in hand only, waits do not apply, but that is exactly the same as a new patient.  No card means you are on a section 8...

Edited by CedarSpringsCG
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The only true way to be safe is wait for the plastic .

word! Just had a renewal lapse because of some hoopla. Easy enough for me to turn of a light and hold a few in veg (I always thin the herd by 13 when a renewal comes up). I feel bad for the gal caught in the red tape, but no comprises here. Stay safe folks and if not, don't plead!

 

Wet

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Actually not yet today...

 

Have you read the Bylsma/Overholt decision? It was pretty clear when they said you did not need to send it into the state. And I have sat down with a lawyer and discussed this exact decision, this is what he has told me, based on Overholt, and all of the rest...

Most of the dispensaries that have been busted were on retainer and under advise of counsil.

 

The thing is ,lawyers write the laws to benefit lawyers. You pay them for advice up front and then you pay them more when you get busted.

History shows the advice usually leads to a plea bargain and your loss.

 

Now if you got the judge on retainer , your golden.

Edited by beourbud
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I hope you also discussed his fee for helping you because you didn't guard yourself from arrest by registering with the State.

 

I'm hearing some numbers upwards of $10,000 now for an affirmative defense because you didn't register. 

That wouldnt be an issue if he was servicing 5 pts an hr!

 

:bong2:

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The only true way to be safe is wait for the plastic .

But we are never truly safe from harrassment from leo!

 

They dont give a phaq, they arrest us any how, we have to get arraingned and deal with the b.s in court any how eh?

 

Been there done that one 3 simple possesions and 1 probation vilolation, I won all :bong2:

 

I still had to phaqing deal with it, may as well all be section 8.

 

Every week in our county news paper there is at least 2 people charged with ilegal transport,  and they were arrested by the home town security.  which is a new group of goons in roscomon, crawford and otesgo county's,  They were given 7 million to harrass us on I-75,   Home town security is Mi state police.

 

I did get out of it all because of the plastic card,  I still was arrested and treated like a pot head :bong7bp:

 

Oh and it didnt cost me 10k but it was a pain in my gas!

 

Peace

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