Mmj And Driving

[Mykul]

recently I went before Judge D'Agostini of the 48th district court for a possession charge. this has been detailed elsewhere and really needs no further exposition here.

What I do need help with is this:

My lawyer asked her not to suspend my driving privileges and was denied.

She said that (And I am paraphrasing here) "Zero tolerance is zero tolerance. If there is a chance you'll be smoking or driving under the influence, then I can not, in good conscience, allow you to break the law and drive."

So, suspended license.

She was, however, kind enough to allow my lawyer to plead my case for driving in two weeks. saying that unless she can be shown a way around that, she will be taking my license for being a MMJ patient (again, paraphrasing.. these are not her exact words, but my interpretation of the intent.)

 

Now I have been doing research and there is one case (People v. Feezel, No. 138031 (June 9, 2010)) where it has been ruled that metabolites are NOT considered a class 1 substance. this overturns the previous ruling (from '06 I believe) that the metabolites (which stay in your system up to 30 days)are enough to prove OUI.

 

I mention this to illustrate that I am not just coming here and looking for answers without doing the research.

 

Unfortunately,I do not see how this affects my case. It does effectively lower the time from 30 days to about 4 hours, but still does not give a method for effectively monitoring whether or not I could be driving while high; which is what the judge requires if I'm to be allowed to drive.

 

So how about some help here please? I need a way (several actually, in case one doesn't work) that I can prove to the judge that I won't be driving while high (Or for hours afterward either.) If I can not do this, then I lose my license, either for the duration of probation (9 mo) or until I am no longer a patient.

Of course, the 'easy' way is to simply stop medicating. A) it's not an option as no other medication works for my IBS (at least nothing I've tried these past 20 years I've been treated for it)

B) I would still ave my card, and therefore COULD potentially smoke and so is a moot point.

 

So I ask for any serious suggestions that could help me.

My lawyers idea was to have a certain day each week that I could smoke, but honestly, if it worked that way I'd be doing that already. I have no idea of knowing when I will need it. I have fail safes in place (My boss will allow me to work from home days I need to medicate, I don't drive for 12 hours afterward, ETC...), but when presented with them, the judge asked "So I'm just supposed to trust him?". I don't see why not, but anyway....

 

thanks for your help. Hopefully by the time court comes (or this week so I can get it to my lawyer)I will be well armed with an argument that will be effective.

[______]

Have your attorney go back to the judge with the recent Michigan Supreme court decision.

 

http://www.courts.michigan.gov/supremecourt/Clerk/10-09/138031/138031-Opinion.pdf

 

The rules have changed on zero tolerance.

[Zombiefied]

Why are you being tried for possession? If your a patient you should get the whole case dismissed, as per the LAW.

8. Affirmative Defense and Dismissal for Medical Marihuana.

 

Sec. 8. (a) Except as provided in section 7, a patient and a patient's primary caregiver, if any, may assert the medical purpose for using marihuana as a defense to any prosecution involving marihuana, and this defense shall be presumed valid where the evidence shows that:

 

(1) A physician has stated that, in the physician's professional opinion, after having completed a full assessment of the patient's medical history and current medical condition made in the course of a bona fide physician-patient relationship, the patient is likely to receive therapeutic or palliative benefit from the medical use of marihuana to treat or alleviate the patient's serious or debilitating medical condition or symptoms of the patient's serious or debilitating medical condition;

 

(2) The patient and the patient's primary caregiver, if any, were collectively in possession of a quantity of marihuana that was not more than was reasonably necessary to ensure the uninterrupted availability of marihuana for the purpose of treating or alleviating the patient's serious or debilitating medical condition or symptoms of the patient's serious or debilitating medical condition; and

 

(3) The patient and the patient's primary caregiver, if any, were engaged in the acquisition, possession, cultivation, manufacture, use, delivery, transfer, or transportation of marihuana or paraphernalia relating to the use of marihuana to treat or alleviate the patient's serious or debilitating medical condition or symptoms of the patient's serious or debilitating medical condition.

 

(b) A person may assert the medical purpose for using marihuana in a motion to dismiss, and the charges shall be dismissed following an evidentiary hearing where the person shows the elements listed in subsection (a).

 

So as long as you meet 1,2, and 3 your case should be dismissed.

 

Another thing, you, and I will quote the law,

4. Protections for the Medical Use of Marihuana.

 

Sec. 4. (a) A qualifying patient who has been issued and possesses a registry identification card shall not be subject to arrest, prosecution, or penalty in any manner, or denied any right or privilege, including but not limited to civil penalty or disciplinary action by a business or occupational or professional licensing board or bureau, for the medical use of marihuana in accordance with this act, provided that the qualifying patient possesses an amount of marihuana that does not exceed 2.5 ounces of usable marihuana, and, if the qualifying patient has not specified that a primary caregiver will be allowed under state law to cultivate marihuana for the qualifying patient, 12 marihuana plants kept in an enclosed, locked facility. Any incidental amount of seeds, stalks, and unusable roots shall also be allowed under state law and shall not be included in this amount.

 

It is a privilege to have your Drivers License and it was givin by a Professional licensing board or bureau, so he cant suspend your license if you meet 1,2, and 3 as stated above.

I would have your lawyer bring this up to the judge, there is also a AD form on here but I am not to sure what it is, and bring up the Supreme Court desision on 11-carboxy-THC . I hope this helps.

[Mykul]

I'll take these one at a time:

 

 

"Have your attorney go back to the judge with the recent Michigan Supreme court decision.

 

http://www.courts.mi...031-Opinion.pdf

 

The rules have changed on zero tolerance."

 

While this is true, I can't see how this helps me. The Judge wants to be sure I won't be driving under the influence, she doesn't seem to care about the time frame.

(IE: If I say "The metabolytes aren't class one, the THC only stays for four hours." She will say "How can I be sure you won't be driving during those four hours?"

You see my dilemma?

 

 

Why are you being tried for possession? If your a patient you should get the whole case dismissed, as per the LAW.

 

 

So as long as you meet 1,2, and 3 your case should be dismissed.

 

Another thing, you, and I will quote the law,

 

It is a privilege to have your Drivers License and it was given by a Professional licensing board or bureau, so he cant suspend your license if you meet 1,2, and 3 as stated above.

I would have your lawyer bring this up to the judge, there is also a AD form on here but I am not to sure what it is, and bring up the Supreme Court decision on 11-carboxy-THC . I hope this helps.

 

I have actually fired my incompetent lawyer (Richard Lustig- on the NORML site, but definitely not much of a worker, choose him and you'll lose) and am trying to hire another one.

The issue is that I was not a patient at the time of the incident. (not until a month later.)

And that is a whole nother thread....I was denied the AD. Then my lawyer bullied me into pleading guilty (NEVER PLEAD GUILTY!!!!!)

The biggest issue there was that he didn't try 7411 (Where I would have kept the license), but pleaded me guilty to possession (lose the license for 6 mo)

 

I am really not trying to argue, I feel it is probably too late for my case, but i am hoping to open a dialogue that will help others understand what needs to be said and what they need to know.

[Zombiefied]

Yes, I understand, and I seen your other post about the AD. That is bull man. Your right, never plead guilty. Take your case to a jury of your peers.

Is Richard Lustig a Normal Lawyer or just a lawyer that goes to that site? I would not go to him. I dont know what to tell you except your lawyer works for you, you tell him how you want to go about things and if he doesn't listen, fire him, get a different one. This is your life in the balance. Is there any way you can challenge the "your lawyer pleaded you guilty" with you not being guilty and wanting to plead not guilty.

[______]

Let Norml know what a great lawyer this clown is. They might want to stop associating with him, then again they might not. I send money to three marijuana organizations every year. Norml is not one of them.

[Guest Wayne]

You cannot appeal an plea bargain once agreed upon in open court. You may certainly file motions for relief and/or appeal improper sentencing and probation idelines. I can't understand any logical or legal reason for denying you driving privileges based on the unknown. Should the fact that any citizen buying liquor give cause to suspending/revoking their drivers license because she can't feel certain they will not get behind the wheel after consuming it? I'ts your life and an idiots driving it into a ditch. Appeal, appeal, appeal!

[Mykul]

Yes, I understand, and I seen your other post about the AD. That is bull man. Your right, never plead guilty. Take your case to a jury of your peers.

Is Richard Lustig a Normal Lawyer or just a lawyer that goes to that site? I would not go to him. I dont know what to tell you except your lawyer works for you, you tell him how you want to go about things and if he doesn't listen, fire him, get a different one. This is your life in the balance. Is there any way you can challenge the "your lawyer pleaded you guilty" with you not being guilty and wanting to plead not guilty.

 

I assumed that he was a NORML lawyer, but was VERY OBVIOUSLY wrong. I am currently drafting a letter to NORML about this.

 

I doubt I can challenge this because ultimately I and I alone pled guilty. It was a HUGE mistake on my part, but one I will have to live with.

 

And in case I was unclear,

NEVER GO TO RICHARD LUSTIG FOR ANYTHING. IN MY OPINION (FOR LEGAL REASONS) HE IS AN INCOMPETENT, LAZY, AND DOES NOT WORK FOR YOU, BUT FOR THE MONEY.

in my opinion.

[Mykul]

You cannot appeal an plea bargain once agreed upon in open court. You may certainly file motions for relief and/or appeal improper sentencing and probation idelines. I can't understand any logical or legal reason for denying you driving privileges based on the unknown. Should the fact that any citizen buying liquor give cause to suspending/revoking their drivers license because she can't feel certain they will not get behind the wheel after consuming it? I'ts your life and an idiots driving it into a ditch. Appeal, appeal, appeal!

 

 

Agreed. I am DEFINITELY going to appeal, I'm trying to find a good lawyer to help. I think I have one, I'm just not sure I can afford it. (Total so far with lawyer, fines, and . I just want to be clear here about my plea bargain:

It was no bargain. I didn't get 7411 or anything else either. This was a straight up guilty plea. (yes, I am stupid now that you mention it, obviously.)

[Guest Wayne]

Don't beat yourself up about it. Pressure, fear, and lack of defense funds has a devastating effect on many people under such circumstances. Just a hard lesson learned in life, which goes on. I would have my lawyer ask the judge if he/she is going to revoke the driving privileges of anyone who has access to a liquor store or bar whare they could , readily, and legally purchase alcoholic beverages, become intoxicated, and get behind the wheel. How could the judge know or merely take anyone's word for it?

Utilizing the judge's logic (where did the judge graduate from law school?) no one in Michigan should have driving privileges.

[Mykul]

I would have my lawyer ask the judge if he/she is going to revoke the driving privileges of anyone who has access to a liquor store or bar where they could , readily, and legally purchase alcoholic beverages, become intoxicated, and get behind the wheel. How could the judge know or merely take anyone's word for it?

 

Good point, and one I will be sure to make. Thanks for the encouragement.