Diagnosis & Medical Records/chronic Lung Problems

[sarazorz]

So I have a few question for doctors regarding how, exactly, diseases are stamped onto patients medical records and I have some other questions about treatment. I also want to know about treatment for chronic bronchitis and asthma.

 

Question 1: So when I visit my regular Primary Care Physician and say "I think I may have PMDD. Here are my symptoms", and the doctor (who really didn't know much about the disease) nodded her head and wrote me a script for the birth control pill I specifically asked for, is it officially in my records that I have PMDD? I mean, at that point, does the doctor write down in my file that I have been diagnosed? Or does a diagnosis have to be backed up by test results or some other form of "proof"? I find it hard to believe that a doctor would write down a patient's self diagnosis as official...What say you, doctors?

 

Some rambling followed by Question 2: I have medical records showing visits for bronchitis, pneumonia, and asthma dating back from a very young age. I also have about a million chest xrays, and test results (blowing into that weird machine thing that makes a graph) showing I have asthma. Due to the repeated visits for Bronchitis I am only assuming that I have "Chronic" Bronchitis...but I'm not sure if it's official. Last year alone, I visited the ER for breathing trouble on five occasions within a period of four months, all of which resulted in a diagnosis of Pneumonia or Bronchitis and treatment followed with Anti-biotics, Predisone, Codeine Cough Syrup or other pain medication. I have no doubt in my mind that I will qualify for a med card due to my chronic lung illness. My questions here are treatment questions:

• 
   
  
• Which strains of meds should I be looking at for optimum anti-inflammatory properties?
  
• Can any lung patients or doctors tell me if they have completely replaced their use of Predisone and other steroid inhalers with medical marijuana use?
  
• What sort of results have you seen in your health?
  
• Are you still chronically ill with lung ailments, or has medical marijuana simply helped with the discomfort?
  

 

Thanks for reading! I look forward to some input

[Guest thequietone]

So I have a few question for doctors regarding how, exactly, diseases are stamped onto patients medical records and I have some other questions about treatment. This is important for me to find out because I am in the process of saving up for a med card, and I want to know exactly what is needed in order to qualify for the card. I also want to know about treatment for chronic bronchitis and asthma.

 

Question 1: So when I visit my regular Primary Care Physician and say "I think I may have PMDD. Here are my symptoms", and the doctor (who really didn't know much about the disease) nodded her head and wrote me a script for the birth control pill I specifically asked for, is it officially in my records that I have PMDD? I mean, at that point, does the doctor write down in my file that I have been diagnosed? Or does a diagnosis have to be backed up by test results or some other form of "proof"? I find it hard to believe that a doctor would write down a patient's self diagnosis as official...What say you, doctors?

 

Some rambling followed by Question 2: I have medical records showing visits for bronchitis, pneumonia, and asthma dating back from a very young age. I also have about a million chest xrays, and test results (blowing into that weird machine thing that makes a graph) showing I have asthma. Due to the repeated visits for Bronchitis I am only assuming that I have "Chronic" Bronchitis...but I'm not sure if it's official. Last year alone, I visited the ER for breathing trouble on five occasions within a period of four months, all of which resulted in a diagnosis of Pneumonia or Bronchitis and treatment followed with Anti-biotics, Predisone, Codeine Cough Syrup or other pain medication. I have no doubt in my mind that I will qualify for a med card due to my chronic lung illness. My questions here are treatment questions:

• 
   
  
• Which strains of meds should I be looking at for optimum anti-inflammatory properties?
  
• Can any lung patients or doctors tell me if they have completely replaced their use of Predisone and other steroid inhalers with medical marijuana use?
  
• What sort of results have you seen in your health?
  
• Are you still chronically ill with lung ailments, or has medical marijuana simply helped with the discomfort?
  

 

Thanks for reading! I look forward to some input

 

I only have some advice to give you, sorry I am unable to answer your questions. Have they done any CT scans of your lungs, if not I would strongly recommend getting one. I too had respiratory problems for many years. Pneumonia a couple of times every year than they said I had asthma and began treating me for that. Well it turned out to be a carcniod tumor and it had been growing for twenty years according to my doctor. Your history sounds a lot like mine and now I tell everyone who has lung problems to get a CT.

[sarazorz]

I only have some advice to give you, sorry I am unable to answer your questions. Have they done any CT scans of your lungs, if not I would strongly recommend getting one. I too had respiratory problems for many years. Pneumonia a couple of times every year than they said I had asthma and began treating me for that. Well it turned out to be a carcniod tumor and it had been growing for twenty years according to my doctor. Your history sounds a lot like mine and now I tell everyone who has lung problems to get a CT.

 

Thank you for your advice, however, my asthma is allergy related triggered by mold in the fall (from decaying leaves) and pollen in the spring/summer. My symptoms start immediately after being exposed to these particles in the air. Example: I can tell if someone has mold in their basement within five minutes of being down there, because my lungs immediately respond with inflammation which leads to chest tightness and wheezing. If I am exposed to these particles for a long period of time, my symptoms will fly out of control and cause so much irritation that I catch Bronchitis, or in severe cases, Pneumonia. I'm 100% positive I do not have a tumor.

[+SSP]

Hi, a fellow patient here....not a doctor. I have systemic chronic sarcoidosis which, among many other things, does affect my lungs. I have been on pretty much every anti inflammatory, including steroids, all the nsaids, immune suppressant drugs and tnf inhibitor drugs enrel, humaria and remicade.

 

The most evil of all was the prednisone. I can only hope you can one day taper off that. Please know that even with successful cannabis therapy, you will still have to wean slowly off the steroids, do not just stop them cold turkey.

 

I'm sure I don't have to tell you that smoking is bad for you...even cannabis. Its the process of combustion that is harmful not that cannabis just to be absolutely clear! Invest in a good vaporizer, I LOVE my volcano classic-worth every penny. I get no lung irritation at all when I vape but smoking even a joint or two can mess me up for days.

 

Know who is growing your medicine if you are unable to grow it yourself. Cannabis can be contaminated with mold and pesticides if not handled properly. I've been called a pot snob before but if you already have lung or immune issue's, you just have to be mindful!

 

Look into quality cannabis capsules which will also help with your inflammation. As to what strains, well, its the CBD's that typically help the most with inflammation. Unfortunately a lot of todays cannabis is breed with high THC and low CDB. I cant vouch for the accuracy of this website but you might find this helpful http://www.herbalelementsinc.com/products.php

[sarazorz]

Hi, a fellow patient here....not a doctor. I have systemic chronic sarcoidosis which, among many other things, does affect my lungs. I have been on pretty much every anti inflammatory, including steroids, all the nsaids, immune suppressant drugs and tnf inhibitor drugs enrel, humaria and remicade.

 

The most evil of all was the prednisone. I can only hope you can one day taper off that. Please know that even with successful cannabis therapy, you will still have to wean slowly off the steroids, do not just stop them cold turkey.

 

I'm sure I don't have to tell you that smoking is bad for you...even cannabis. Its the process of combustion that is harmful not that cannabis just to be absolutely clear! Invest in a good vaporizer, I LOVE my volcano classic-worth every penny. I get no lung irritation at all when I vape but smoking even a joint or two can mess me up for days.

 

Know who is growing your medicine if you are unable to grow it yourself. Cannabis can be contaminated with mold and pesticides if not handled properly. I've been called a pot snob before but if you already have lung or immune issue's, you just have to be mindful!

 

Look into quality cannabis capsules which will also help with your inflammation. As to what strains, well, its the CBD's that typically help the most with inflammation. Unfortunately a lot of todays cannabis is breed with high THC and low CDB. I cant vouch for the accuracy of this website but you might find this helpful http://www.herbalelementsinc.com/products.php

 

Oh I've been off Predisone...for now. If I flare up again I'm sure they'll try to throw me back on it but I refuse to take that poison. It has completely ruined my body over the years. Oh, and you don't have to tell me to use a vapo, I already know! When I attempt to smoke it irritates my lungs severely. I find even using a vapo I have some irritation, and mild coughing but nothing nearly like smoking. Even Albuterol breathing treatments are irritating! Ridiculous! I had planned to stick with the vapo method, as it would deliver the medicine right where I need it, straight to the lungs! I would likely give the capsules a try though just to check them out. Anyways, thank you for the link.

[Phil78]

chronic bronchitis is not chronic, in that you simply keep getting it over and over, along with pneumonia.

 

your PFT test, which you stated DX'd your asthma, would have shown if you have chronic bronchitis/COPD.

 

if i were you, if they decided to put you back on prednisone, i would listen to them. either that, or stop seeing them. why keep going to them if you're not going to follow your tx plan? yes, it is not good for you, but the alternative is worse.

[Phil78]

..........I have no doubt in my mind that I will qualify for a med card due to my chronic lung illness...........

 

Covered:

* Cancer

* Glaucoma

* Positive status for human immunodeficiency virus

* Acquired immune deficiency syndrome

* Hepatitis C

* Amyotrophic lateral sclerosis (ALS - Lou Gehrig's Disease)

* Crohn's disease

* Agitation of Alzheimer's disease

* Nail patella

 

 

General diseases, medical conditions, and treatment not listed but authorized in Statute:

A patient can also qualify under the statute [section 3 (a) (2)] if he/she experiences any chronic or debilitating disease or medical condition, or it's treatment, which produces one or more of the following symptoms or side effects:

 

* cachexia or wasting syndrome;

* severe and chronic pain;

* nausea;

* seizures, including but not limited to those characteristic of epilepsy;

* severe and persistent muscle spasms, including but not limited to those characteristic of multiple sclerosis

[Dr. Bob]

Well here is my 2 cents. And yes, I am a doctor.

 

Chronic bronchitis is based on a history of infection and sputum production over a period of time. As I recall it is something like 3 months a year for each of 3 years. In general terms chronic bronchitis is pretty obvious- you cough and produce sputum most of the time or you don't. It is one form of COPD (the others being asthma and emphysema) and one or more forms generally co-exist. There are no forms of lung disease (other than cancer) that really are qualifying in themselves of a card. Some try and get 'cute' and call asthma qualifying under 'muscle spasms', but that is pretty lame. Not to say there are not studies that show it is good for asthma, but most prosecutors know the 'muscle spasms' discussed in the Act are 'long muscle spasms' like those found in MS, not the smooth muscles of the bronchial tree. Don't put yourself in a position to be laughed out of court.

 

A diagnosis (official diagnosis as you term it) is based on good medical practice. Good medical practice consists of the following as a general rule (for a 'new' diagnosis)

 

1. Listen to the patient, they will tell you what is wrong with them.

2. Based on training and experience, what is the doctor's opinion of what is causing the symptoms?

3. If the opinion is correct, what is the expected course of the underlying cause?

4. Can the diagnosis be confirmed with lab tests? What is the expected course of treatment?

5. If the illness does not behave or resolve as expected, reconsider the diagnosis.

 

Example with pneumonia.

 

1. Patient complains of fever, rigors, shortness of breath, sputum production and chest pain. They are asked specifically if they don't offer a history of expected symptoms.

2. If it waddles and quacks like pneumonia, it probably is. Common things happen commonly, and an unusual presentation of a common problem is more frequently encountered than a usual presentation of an uncommon problem.

3. I would expect a worsening of symptoms over a few days, to the point the patient sought care. Unlike a cold or bronchitis, patient would appear sick up to and including to the point they looked 'toxic'.

4. I would check my impression with a chest X-Ray (looking for infiltrates) and a blood count (looking for increased WBC's). If anything was unusual (like their pet bird just died, or they had HIV) I would check some special tests to be sure I didn't miss something critical.

5. I would expect them to improve with a course of antibiotics, respiratory therapy, etc. If they continued to worsen I would look at them again to be sure I wasn't missing something (rare form of pneumonia, underlying but undiagnosed HIV or TB, etc)

 

That is a basic discussion of how the thought process works. You can see how your symptoms, timing, ETC may explain the diagnosis of PMDD. We aren't always right, but our opinions are informed and based on years of experience and training. That is why we are doctors, and why our advice concerning health is sought.

 

Dr. Bob

[sarazorz]

Thanks Dr. Bob for some pro answers. I will agree that I think people who use Asthma as a "muscle spasm" diagnosis is a bit ridiculous. I am not one of those people.

 

My lung situation is legitimate and I have the records to back up my claims. It's ruined my entire LIFE. I cough up mucus (sometimes bloody) on a daily basis, which is a painful process, and I deal with consistent chest pain severe enough for me to call off work. i've dropped out of college, twice, due to missing too much class from being ill. There are times when I cough hard enough, and cannot stop, until I throw up. Not only has my illness trashed my chance of getting a college degree, I have gone from full-time work to 3 days a week, my hours were cut by my employer due to how often I am too ill to come in. There are days when my chest hurts so bad I would rather not breathe. I am not going to continue to take Predisone, a medication that has caused me to gain 60lbs and grow a freaking beard (I have to wax my chin twice a week, I am admitting). I also have the "Predisone hump" on the back of my neck. My weight gain has caused me to have a heel spurs growing under my achilles tendon/plantars fasciitis, and painful knee swelling which makes walking around for more than 20 minutes painful enough to take Vicodin for...which takes the edge off somewhat but it's certainly not the pain relief I was hoping for.

 

Anyways, I apologize for raging out. My lung problems are chronic, disruptive to my life, and I get extremely frustrated with it on a daily basis. Due to how painful and disruptive my illness has been, I'm somewhat insulted that it's possible that I could be denied access to a med card. Currently I do not see any other options as far as treatment goes. OTC Pain meds don't do anything. Narcotics don't do a whole lot except chill out the coughing spasms (Codeine Cough Sryup). However I am unable to function at work or drive when taking any sort of narcotics. My life pretty much stops when my symptoms are at their worst. When they are at their worst, I'm in the ER getting diagnosed with Pneumonia and missing three weeks of work or school at a time.

 

After I've explained my situation a little further, do you really think I'm going to have a hard time getting my card, specifically for the "severe and chronic pain" associated with my illness?

[Dr. Bob]

You seem to have chronic severe pain and would easily qualify if you have the records to back it up. PM me if you want, or I could suggest a good clinic in your area, wherever that may be.

 

Dr. Bob

[Guest Happy Guy]

Dr. Bob Quote; Some try and get 'cute' and call asthma qualifying under 'muscle spasms', but that is pretty lame. Not to say there are not studies that show it is good for asthma, but most prosecutors know the 'muscle spasms' discussed in the Act are 'long muscle spasms' like those found in MS, not the smooth muscles of the bronchial tree. Don't put yourself in a position to be laughed out of court.

 

 

The symptoms of asthma result from inflammation and spasm of the air passages. Cannabis helps that. Myself and one of my patients have improved asthma to the point of not using our inhalers because of medical cannabis. I'm not being cute or lame. It is real and many doctors know it. I don't appreciate you qualifying our spasms as not the kind that qualify for medical cannabis. I think you ought to stick with what you are sure of when you give ammo to the opposition like that. Your comments just make it harder for asthma patients to qualify. That's not a good thing at all. What I want to know is how the heck does a prosecutor know so much about muscle spasms to know ours are 'different'? You give them the credit of a medical degree? Our doctors think it does help and they have medical degrees and they are not being cute or lame, as you put it.

[Guest Happy Guy]

Dr. Bob,

I read your advice for us patients to get 10 friends signed up so we can be a political force. I have gotten over 100 signed up. Your comments about Asthma only make it harder. How many times have you made those derogitory comments and to who? I would like to know how much damage has been done. We have to do some damage control now. We need you to make up for this by making a lot of positive comments about how asthma patients can benefit from medical cannabis. We are not happy about how you have attacked our credibility. Asthma should be one of those problems that is an automatic qualifier, not an automatic disqualifier.

[Dr. Bob]

Dr. Bob,

I read your advice for us patients to get 10 friends signed up so we can be a political force. I have gotten over 100 signed up. Your comments about Asthma only make it harder. How many times have you made those derogitory comments and to who? I would like to know how much damage has been done. We have to do some damage control now. We need you to make up for this by making a lot of positive comments about how asthma patients can benefit from medical cannabis. We are not happy about how you have attacked our credibility. Asthma should be one of those problems that is an automatic qualifier, not an automatic disqualifier.

 

Asthma is spasm and inflammation of airways. Muscle spasms as seen in MS are the qualifying condition. Asthma is not. As for the prosecutors and judges having medical degrees, I am sure most don't. What they do have is the ability to pull a card and put folks in jail.

 

As for making derogatory comments, I don't make them. I was simply saying it is not a qualification any more than anxiety is, though both are helped. I lost a 15 year old patient with asthma that was also a family friend, so don't question my concern about the disease. It is just not a qualifying condition at this time. There are enough very solid qualifications out there to get the 10 per card we need.

 

Dr. Bob

[Guest Happy Guy]

Asthma is spasm and inflammation of airways. Muscle spasms as seen in MS are the qualifying condition. Asthma is not. As for the prosecutors and judges having medical degrees, I am sure most don't. What they do have is the ability to pull a card and put folks in jail.

 

As for making derogatory comments, I don't make them. I was simply saying it is not a qualification any more than anxiety is, though both are helped. I lost a 15 year old patient with asthma that was also a family friend, so don't question my concern about the disease. It is just not a qualifying condition at this time. There are enough very solid qualifications out there to get the 10 per card we need.

 

Dr. Bob

For the general public reading this;

Dr. Bob is just one doctor and stated only one doctor's opinion. Many other doctors around the country do believe that asthma is a qualifying condition. I personally know 2 cannabis specialists that differ with Dr. Bob. Both are very competent and understand how cannabis helps asthma. They recommend vaporization. I'm a diagnosed asthma patient myself that has gotten off my inhaler because of the vaporizer use. I know other patients that also have had great results too. It is a solid qualifying condition and I can help you find the doctors that believe that and will write you a cannabis recommendation if your are diagnosed with asthma. I will be very happy to help any fellow asthma patients with their solid qualifying condition.

[Dr. Bob]

Quite true and there are many opinions. There are doctors that will justify a lot of things. The law does not mention asthma as a qualifying condition, nor anxiety. As clearly stated both are helped, but not covered. I do not write certifications for non-covered conditions. Maybe that is why I've never had a cert overturned.

 

Since you are offering opinions, please expand on your feelings about no record clinics and pre-signing certifications for other, non-physicians, to resell... Some doctors justify that and some laypeople will justify it as 'getting the cards out'.

 

Dr. Bob

[sarazorz]

The law does not mention asthma as a qualifying condition, nor anxiety. As clearly stated both are helped, but not covered.

 

Dr. Bob

 

Unfortunate. Is there a way to push for these things being added to the list? It's silly to me that other MMJ states have Anxiety listed under the qualifying diseases for a card, but Michigan does not. Apparently only people in those states find relief from Anxiety using MMJ, where as people in Michigan don't! Maybe it's the weather!

[Dr. Bob]

Unfortunate. Is there a way to push for these things being added to the list? It's silly to me that other MMJ states have Anxiety listed under the qualifying diseases for a card, but Michigan does not. Apparently only people in those states find relief from Anxiety using MMJ, where as people in Michigan don't! Maybe it's the weather!

 

There is a method, petition the state to add the diagnosis. They are required to form a committee, evaluate the request and rule on it in 60 days. We have requested both anxiety and ptsd 18 months ago, and I personally offered to sit on the committee, but so far no action. They will need to be sued to force them to take action on the requests. Though I am not aware of a request for asthma, I do agree it will help, especially when vaporized. Perhaps our friend will request it.

 

Dr. Bob

[Guest Happy Guy]

Quite true and there are many opinions. There are doctors that will justify a lot of things. The law does not mention asthma as a qualifying condition, nor anxiety. As clearly stated both are helped, but not covered. I do not write certifications for non-covered conditions. Maybe that is why I've never had a cert overturned.

 

Since you are offering opinions, please expand on your feelings about no record clinics and pre-signing certifications for other, non-physicians, to resell... Some doctors justify that and some laypeople will justify it as 'getting the cards out'.

 

Dr. Bob

Doc,

This isn't about being cute or busting a move to make a quick buck as you seem to be heading towards with your last comments.

 

This is about practicing medicine and it is a fine art. We are all different. If I tell you I have lung spasms from asthma and cannabis eleviates them, are you going to tell me it does not? I have 2nd and third opinions from established doctors that have examined me that differ with your internet diagnosis. Maybe those phone appoints of yours have sharpened you up that much? You can diagnose me right over the net? I'll stick with the doctors that have examined me. Asthma spasms are helped by cannabis. Asthma is chronic. We have chronic muscle spasms that cannabis helps. Get the picture now? We qualify. You are not the decider about all of our health issues. And neither is any prosecutor. We have our own doctors for that. Throwing out a doctors opinion is not an option. You should appreciate that. Or you would be laughed out of court, as you put it earlier.

 

edit; Looks like we helped a few more get certified with asthma with this thread. These patients will have to be seen in an office. Asthma is on a case by case basis for safety.

[Dr. Bob]

Doc,

This isn't about being cute or busting a move to make a quick buck as you seem to be heading towards with your last comments.

 

This is about practicing medicine and it is a fine art. We are all different. If I tell you I have lung spasms from asthma and cannabis eleviates them, are you going to tell me it does not? I have 2nd and third opinions from established doctors that have examined me that differ with your internet diagnosis. Maybe those phone appoints of yours have sharpened you up that much? You can diagnose me right over the net? I'll stick with the doctors that have examined me. Asthma spasms are helped by cannabis. Asthma is chronic. We have chronic muscle spasms that cannabis helps. Get the picture now? We qualify. You are not the decider about all of our health issues. And neither is any prosecutor. We have our own doctors for that. Throwing out a doctors opinion is not an option. You should appreciate that. Or you would be laughed out of court, as you put it earlier.

 

edit; Looks like we helped a few more get certified with asthma with this thread. These patients will have to be seen in an office. Asthma is on a case by case basis for safety.

 

Attack me all you want, and attack my exams or my internet certifications if you wish. Try and convince folks that this discussion is about whether cannabis helps asthma (it is not, because it clearly does). The discussion is about the MDCH approved diagnoses and cards. Asthma is not one of them. I'll be happy to send you the link to the site and you can see for yourself.

 

Thanks-

 

Dr. Bob

[Guest Happy Guy]

Attack me all you want, and attack my exams or my internet certifications if you wish. Try and convince folks that this discussion is about whether cannabis helps asthma (it is not, because it clearly does). The discussion is about the MDCH approved diagnoses and cards. Asthma is not one of them. I'll be happy to send you the link to the site and you can see for yourself.

 

Thanks-

 

Dr. Bob

Chronic muscle spasms are a qualifier. Asthma is all about chronic muscle spasms. Cannabis eleviates asthma muscle spasms. Man, I thought I already painted that picture for you. Can you see it now? Attacking you? You must be a little insecure. I'm not attacking you. I'm trying to fill you in on what the other doctors think so you can get on board. For me, this is about your attack on many patients certifications that saw good doctors and were recommended for chronic muscle spasms due to asthma. You have no ground to stand on to attack any other doctors that are in good standing. Just do your job and let others do theirs. Comments like you saying we are 'getting cute' is what this is all about. We do not appreciate that very much. We didn't say you were 'getting cute' with your phone appointment rec. business.

[sarazorz]

Sooo...anyways... thanks for all the constructive comments, people.

[Dr. Bob]

Chronic muscle spasms are a qualifier. Asthma is all about chronic muscle spasms. Cannabis eleviates asthma muscle spasms. Man, I thought I already painted that picture for you. Can you see it now? Attacking you? You must be a little insecure. I'm not attacking you. I'm trying to fill you in on what the other doctors think so you can get on board. For me, this is about your attack on many patients certifications that saw good doctors and were recommended for chronic muscle spasms due to asthma. You have no ground to stand on to attack any other doctors that are in good standing. Just do your job and let others do theirs. Comments like you saying we are 'getting cute' is what this is all about. We do not appreciate that very much. We didn't say you were 'getting cute' with your phone appointment rec. business.

 

Reaching out to rural areas with telemedicine is not new, nor is it my idea, and it clearly is accepted. I'm sorry, but asthma is not a muscle spasm like MS and doesn't qualify. I'll stick with what is allowed and leave it at that, and if they have a primary indication that is on the list, I'm glad to take a freebie with the asthma. I don't write certs for asthma, but I am sure you will find someone that will go off label. I don't wish to risk certs and patients when there are plenty of clear indications out there. Take care, attempt to hijack a post elsewhere with your ideas of what constitutes a cert. This is no longer a productive discussion.

 

Dr. Bob

[Guest Happy Guy]

Does the act say that only a special kind of chronic muscle spasm qualifies a patient? NO

 

Do several doctors in Michigan, in good standing, unimpeachable by prosecutors, say that the muscle spasms of asthma qualify? YES

 

Are their opinions what counts when it comes to the patients they see? YES

 

This was a very productive discussion. Thanks for your input Bob.

[lawyercaregiver]

So there are 2 issues here:

 

1. NO, asthma is NOT a covered condition or disease. However, if we want to really reach then we could acknowledge that asthma is nothing more than chronic bronchiospasms caused by the involuntary muscles of the bronchioles spasming. Obviously muscle spasms ARE a covered condition and Asthma would be the consequence of the condition so maybe it is covered (just like a lawyer).

 

2. Is smoking something- even the sweet smelling smoke we all love- really a legitimate and helpful treatment for Asthma? I wonder how it compares to inhalers? I also wonder if the effect is psychosomatic and perhaps diazepem (Valium etc) should be tried?

[MyExitEmergency]

Does the act say that only a special kind of chronic muscle spasm qualifies a patient? NO

 

Do several doctors in Michigan, in good standing, unimpeachable by prosecutors, say that the muscle spasms of asthma qualify? YES

 

Are their opinions what counts when it comes to the patients they see? YES

 

This was a very productive discussion. Thanks for your input Bob.

 

 

Why are you being so combative about this lol? Chill man.