Tax Revenue And The Mmma - Mi Dept. Of Treasury Opinion

[DayTripper]

Totally agree Happy... But if you were to sell overages in P2P or something, and did end up profiting say $10k off of it in a year, that SHOULD be declared...

 

And I completely agree on you need more than 5 PT's to be profitable. My township is trying to make it so you have to be in a commercial location and operate like a dispensary, but by their own ordinance, you can only service your 5 PT's... I was like wait, now I have to rent a commercial location and be open during all business hours, 2 people working there and I cna only have 5 customers? How the heck does that make it unless my PT's are all millionaires that like to blow money.

 

emphasis mine

 

Any sales, even two cents worth is a felony.

 

The MMMA does not cover sales.

 

Because the MMMA does not allow sales: declaring State, or local, taxable income from selling, or growing, or transfering, etc. is tatamount to an admission of a crime.

 

If people keep insisting that they can set up a storefront to service their 5 patients then maybe the Department reopens the rules and addresses that issue. Which reminds me; how do you/they reopen those rules? I hope it isn't too awful easy.

 

The MMMA does not cover headshops, hydro shops, or dispensaries.

 

The MMMA does not cover business of any sort.

 

The MMMA does not cover taxes directly; but it does say you can't be penalized in any manner just because you are a cardholder and so maybe that applies.

 

 

I'm with Happy on this anyway - there's no money in true Caregiving under the State law.

[+420Atheist]

We have a letter from The Department of Treasury that says very clearly that caregiver services are non taxable. Just wanted that to be crystal clear. I've been a caregiver for years now and there's not a whole lot of income anyway, if you keep track....

 

They way I read the letter is a little different I guess. I may be wrong but I would like the letter to come right out and say that at least under Michigan law personal income from caregiving services is not taxable. I think it can still be argued that this letter is speaking of sales tax and not your personal income tax.

 

If Michigan does not want your tax dollars does not mean the feds will be as generous. Either way I have no dog in the fight so I don't really care other than I don't want people to go through the ringer with the IRS.

[Mr CPA]

The guy Walled Lake is most likely into something a lot deeper than a dispensary operation that's been open for two months. I don't believe anyone is too happy about what went down. The fact that the IRS was involved in the raids tells me there has been an on-going investigation into tax evasion. You should wait and see how this pans out before you accuse me of being complicit in his criminal activities.

 

My inquiry to Treasury was a result of a state-wide question from caregivers that I was getting over and over. I don't currently represent any dispensaries.

 

 

emphasis mine

 

 

How dare you to claim that you represent 'fighting for the MMMA' while enabling those who drive Bentleys and Ferraris to gouge the sick and dying at $40 a gram in illegal operations that bring tremendous heat and turmoil down on the Patients this act was passed to protect!

 

There are no legal dispensaries and there is no PROFIT to pay you with when one works 'in accordance with this Act'.

 

Now - I'm not saying folks won't make a profit; but if you do don't be stupid and pay taxes on it to the State.

That's an admission of a crime - a felony. One conviction for anything drug related and you can kiss your caregiver gig away.

 

---

 

For a minute there I thought you wanted me to do a Fast Eddie to myself; then I realized you actually want me to die a horrible death.

I'm a little slow sometimes. Seems a bit harsh though.

Doesn't strike me as fighting for the medical marijuana community at all.

Feels more like unfeeling intimidation from a guy who saw stupid people posting stupid comments and decided to start a stupid business to take advantage of the stupid people and there stupid money.

----

 

I guess if Lansing were to entertain the concept that we want the law clarified and implemented as written you would need to make an honest living. That's scary stuff. Anger is always a result of some fear; it is a warning that something is not right in your world. That's a valid emotion for you here. Thanks for sharing.

 

edit...

 

The document you shared does have other implications; but the Treasury opinion wouldn't be binding on any other than taxes. It's nice to see reasoned legal opinion though.

 

I maintain that if you need an accountant because of your caregiving activities one has gone way beyond the intent of the voters and the law.

If one is repeatedly growing more than they need to supply patients they are registered to caregive for it looks like some sort of money making scheme to many of our opponents. I know stuff happens; but until P2P and/or Dispensary is actully reconized by the Legislature and the Court, and they set rules for the outcome and how income or sales or use or whatever taxes that will extract from them are to be implemented if you collect taxes other than federal you are saying you are making sales...

 

If a caregiver or patient is protected by the MMMA because the law or rules declare transfers Not to be a Sale how can one turn around and say oh but Yes this is and here is my Sales tax?

 

...end edit

[Mr CPA]

Yes, I've read the Law. You shouldn't paraphrase the Law like that after questioning whether I've read it.

 

Mr. CPA.

Have you read the law? Please show me, where in Michigan do you pay tax on a service? The MM Law specifically says that a PT compensating a CG for giving them MMJ is in no way paying for an illegal substance, but instead paying for a service. I work in service, and I can tell you, there are no taxes for services such as these. It does not constitute the sale of any substance. So how do you pay taxes on that?

 

the mud flinging is mostly towards the people who want to turn this into a Dispensary only system like what AZ is doing. That isn't our law, and that shouldn't change. I personally am for dispensaries being added to what we already have. And they should pay tax, and additional fees for inspections, audits, etc. But if someone is paying me for a gardening service, and a non-skilled nurse care, why would they pay tax on it?

 

As far as income tax goes, yes, I would have to pay income tax on any profit. but that's income tax I pay, not sales tax on an illegal substance. the law says I am not selling an illegal substance, so without changing it, please explain how there should be tax charged on it?

thanks

cedar

 

edited to sound a little less agressive

[Brad]

Thanks for your inquiry to treasury and for your analysis Jim. It is appreciated.

[DayTripper]

The guy Walled Lake is most likely into something a lot deeper than a dispensary operation that's been open for two months. I don't believe anyone is too happy about what went down. The fact that the IRS was involved in the raids tells me there has been an on-going investigation into tax evasion. You should wait and see how this pans out before you accuse me of being complicit in his criminal activities.

 

My inquiry to Treasury was a result of a state-wide question from caregivers that I was getting over and over. I don't currently represent any dispensaries.

 

You told me to kill myself because I refuse to accept that I should pay taxes on my MM.

 

The fact that you jumped on us for discussing it without using your talking points tells me you are afraid of something. I'm not accusing you of being complicit in that enterprise; I insinuated you must be providing accounting services to caregivers operating outside of the Act.

 

Don't take it personal - I don't.

 

------------------

 

That's not important though - what is important is that your effort does give an example of government giving the correct answer when it is petitioned to do so.

 

The reason our law is mired in 'confusion' and is 'the worst piece of legislation' leo has even seen is twofold:

1) 'Confusion' stems from those who want to operate outside of the Act.

2) 'poorly written law' stems from those who realize it is stronger than they are and needs intervention from lawmakers before we realize this from the Courts.

 

I submit we get everything the Act does cover and the elimination of all ordinances passed to thrawt it if we seek and receive a Finding of Fact on the MMMA from the Michigan Attorney General.

 

Can anyone dispute this view with sound legal reasoning?

I dare you.