Why We Need Dispensaries!

[Tyin'Flies]

The only thing good about a dispensary is that some people get to make some quick cash. Those people will be the ones that are doing all the advocating for dispensaries IMO.

 

I find this statement to be false.

[cristinew]

decriminalizing marijuana completely is the best route. get rid of the greedy caregivers and disp. thats the way to go, 3200 a pound is too much for some patients,

[Tyin'Flies]

You are not seeing it and it's right in your face. I have told you about 5 times already just in this thread.

 

Dispensaries don't magically make cannabis, growers do. Growers need to connect with patients directly without the middleman. If you believe that TV show that a grower can dump a pound for $4000 at a dispensary, while growers like myself part them out to patients for a grand total of $3200 a pound, why does anyone who needs quick cash ever part out at low prices like I do? Get rid of all the dispensary dumping and there will be a lot more parting at at $200 a zip directly to patients.

 

I'm not bitching and I really don't like you saying that. Check your wording better, thanks. I'm actually part of the solution, I work hard at that and it's not quick cash. How are you part of the solution?

 

Yes Growers make the cannabis, no one has said ANY differently. Who's talking about a TV show? We're talking about dispensaries and whether or not there is a need yes? Again I find that your "dumping" argument isn't as valid as you'd have us believe.

 

I connect with my patients perfectly, and there is sometimes overages. NONE of the meds I grow have ever been into a dispensary. Instead I go to Farmers Markets or connect with other local CG's.

 

And since I do so, how would you expect a new patient whom has no knowledge of me or I of them connect so as you said I could "part out a zip at $200 directly to patients."?

 

Do you have a phone line to all new patients to inform them of how or where to get the meds they need?

 

You have made this discussion on dispensaries and their need into an issue of greed without giving any solution other than to close all dispensaries.

 

I haven't found a VALID point in your posts yet as to why they are evil.

 

I know shooting a deer will put meat in the freezer, but I cannot hunt so I go to the store and BUY meat. I know it's more expensive to do so but... it gets meat in my freezer TODAY so I don't starve....

[greenbuddha]

Legalize it!

 

Screw all the rhetoric and BS.

 

There is no reason the MMM Act that allows patient's their meds AND other laws that would allow the general use of cannabis can't exist at the same time.

 

Caregivers could still do what they do and others could also access cannabis as well.

 

And I have one final question regarding 'dispensaries making money on cannabis... WHY would a 'care giver' sell to a dispensary, OTHER than to MAKE MONEY themselves?

 

One person's greed is somehow BETTER than another person's greed because of the 'label' they place upon themselves?

 

And with the new laws that will be coming up to 'change' cannabis legislation... I know for certain how I will be voting.

 

But each to his own...

[Tyin'Flies]

I would think a CG would take theirs to a dispensary for much the same reason they would go to farmers market. If and when they have overages can they not take to both? I doubt CG's are getting what you see as the price in the dispensary. So how would it be making fast cash?

[Timmahh]

You are not seeing it and it's right in your face. I have told you about 5 times already just in this thread.

 

Dispensaries don't magically make cannabis, growers do. Growers need to connect with patients directly without the middleman.AND HOW DO THEY DO THIS? If you believe that TV show that a grower can dump a pound for $4000 at a dispensary, while growers like myself part them out to patients for a grand total of $3200 a pound, why does anyone who needs quick cash ever part out at low prices like I do? Get rid of all the dispensary dumping and there will be a lot more parting at at $200 a zip directly to patients.

 

I'm not bitching and I really don't like you saying that. Check your wording better, thanks. I'm actually part of the solution, I work hard at that and it's not quick cash. How are you part of the solution?

 

like you, i work hard helping those i can find that would like help...

 

your singing the same chorus line, but like a scratched record, cant get to the rest of the song.

you see it as me saying your bitching, i see it as you repeating the same, though factual, useless info on solving the issue of mass access thru the entire state of Mi....

 

again im not asking you how to make it magically appear like lucky charms.

 

simple ?. a person is diagnosed with stage2 brain cancer. they are in metamora. they never used cannabis prior, never knew anyone that did. there is no CC in their area, and they dont even know about an online Medical Cannabis site like the 3MA or THC Trader for that matter. Their Dr gave them a recommendation to fight the nausia, but they have NO clue how to even begin to locate it, how to prepare it, grow it, use it. adjust dosage...

 

What do YOU suggest this person do?

a direct answer to this question would be HELPFULL.

 

 

 

Simply Tell me how you find that person, and make sure they have access to any medication.

you seem to miss the point their are a couple more people on the program than just those I and you are aware of.

 

and i daily hear and read about people having a hard time even now, espeically now, that disps are gone.

infact, alot of people around here, and i know your not very far away, have raised prices because there is no dispensary close by.

 

i know a couple people that added the cost of gas that it WOULD of cost someone had they had to drive to the dispensary to buy it for themselves. the guy feels because the dispensary is now closed, those that he works with, should have to pay him the cost of gas they would of spent going farther away to the dispensary to get their meds. It Fked up logic, but many are using it, and worse yet, many more are paying it because they have minimal to no options now.

 

its just a fact of the race. And it doesnt help that BS is driving the market to be like this, infact proving his own point. it wouldnt surprise me he even has this logic planned out.

I think your a FOOL for Not supporting them, Strictly on the fact it goes against Everything BS is saying and pushing for. by not supporting any dispensary setup, you are only further empowering BS and his bs.

 

just following simple logic....

the enemy of Your enemy, is your allie.

so the more dispensaries that open the more BS has to spread himself thin fighting them, and the more the People see him for the Pimple on Michigan's ASSthat he is..... he needs to be popped.

and if supporting dirty nasty dispensarires are one way of popping that Zit, im all for it.

 

look Im not giveing you bunny muffin because i think your wrong. ive said it before and i ll say it over and over, you make alot of very good and logical points, but in the end, how to you solve them?

 

 

sure a CG to PT situation is how the law was set and written. and if their were 1 great CG to every 10 pts, and they were all evenly spaced out, close by each other, and already knew who those in their vacinity was, we would live on Yellow Brick Road Ave. and if BS gets his way, it ll be easy, they ll be those in the cell next to and across from yours.

 

but you overlook the fact many cant grow due to lack of space, time money, ability, mobility, illness......... hell im barely keeping up with just myself and the one pt i have... i could do more, but cost would go up, and id need more area, thus more money, thus end donation has to go up to meet the expendatures......

 

if a Research pole was done to analize the number of MMMP registrants that actaully Grow, it would be less than 20%. and most good growers dont want to be affiliated with 100 or more people. most dont want to deal with the 3 or 4 they have to deal with now. not everyone likes the spotlight.

simple number to check in your area. ask every grower you meet, how many non growers do they personally know. i bet that number far exceeds 20.

 

im asking you, to explain a viable way to do it without a dispensary. that can be implemented on a state wide level.

[Timmahh]

i hear you, but its 3 yrs in now, and their are barely any true CCs around. many turned into dispensaries, and now they are closed up. some went to a delivery service, opposed to a store front.

 

doesnt change the fact, their are Way more Pts in need, with no means of contact to the growers with available meds.

 

 

remember the old saying, a friend with weed, is a friend indeed?

 

well those days are gone. i know personaly 5 people in my area the grow for others. they are always out, and have people looking for more. many as i noted, raised price. Suppy went down, so demand with up, and the price along with it.

so even when dispensaries were everywhere it seemed, and they charged more for it, overall the cost was beginning to drop. the one guy that just raised prices, was about to stop growing all together because he didnt feel it was going to be worth his time.

 

then Schuette and the CoA passed their ruling. and he started to smile bigtime...

So contrary to popular beliefs, this guy is seemingly the rule, and people like yourself and others like us, are the exception to it.

 

 

as sad as that is to say.. compassion is for the needy. everyone else pays cash.

[Tyin'Flies]

I said,

 

"Growers need to connect with patients directly without the middleman."

 

and you asked;

 

AND HOW DO THEY DO THIS?

 

The answer is compliance centers. A place to meet. Talk about the rules, fill out forms, ect. A public place like a library. I ran a compassion club for three months. I know what it's like. If every caregiver took their turn for three months there would be plenty of people to run it for free. If a patient can go to a dispensary they can go to the library and meet a caregiver. Maybe the very same caregiver that used to sell to the dispensary. The meds would be cheaper and more accountable to the grower.

 

Yes that might work. Do you have a list of caregivers that will volunteer 3 months of their time to this? Can we get Consumers to volunteer the electricity for a sign and lights to see with? Do you know of a mmj friendly place to have this? Some place that will be totally donated?

 

Or is there a chance these essentials would have to actually be paid for?

[Timmahh]

how about location thru out the entire state?

 

point is, this is a HUGE undertaking at any level. no one system can work everywhere.... thus Patients need a variety of avenues to access medication from. and a variety of meds and ways to use it......

 

CCs are great for making contacts. in a few months, you may find a person or two that trusts you enough, and you trust enough to start up a CG/Pt relationship.... but in the meantime........................

[Timmahh]

I love the idea! And what's more, I never stopped doing it. Not for two years now. It really doesn't work like you say. Sorry. There are simply not enough caregivers like you describe, and it is not the dispensaries' fault. I have to send way too many people elsewhere, who knows where, probably to a dispensary. It just doesn't scale to meet the need. It is impossible for me to morally cite 4(e) in Oakland County after what I have seen in court, and I know for sure that I have had long discussions with Oakland County law enforcement when I didn't know they were law enforcement. Are they going after me because there are no more dispensaries? Super fun, and just what I had in mind when I started this, right?

 

Not just that, but many patients don't want to share their address with unknown caregivers. In addition many caregivers don't want to share their address with unknown patients. It really makes for a very complicated situation when there is any kind of third party involved. And wow! When it goes wrong it goes wrong instantly, and usually completely devoid of recourse for one party or the other, leaving permanent bad feelings. And me the de facto meditator?

 

It's been difficult. Don't expect people to do it for free. I still haven't scheduled my next meeting, and I struggle with it every month. I pretty much keep doing it because I know there are so few people that will, and I don't want the idea to die, but frankly, the club is ineffective for meeting patients medicinal needs unless they happen to be attached to one of the member caregivers already.

 

 

That is sadly, the truth of the matter.

 

and Rest, I completely agree on the centers. But have you actually considered the scope of things that would need to come together for that to happen in just the main populated areas, let alone state wide? the start up costs alone would be Staggering.

 

as much bad that CAN come with Some dispensaries, the outright good they bring in terms of public acceptance, and sheer accessabilty, coupled with the sheer hatred of them BS has. i say open them up. if i had the money to get started, which would include a retainer for Michael or similar, I would.

[Tyin'Flies]

It didn't cost me anything but copies of forms and info when I ran it. Libraries are free. It's what we have, use it. Quit dreaming and get on board with what is real. Dispensaries aren't going to fly, that is obvious. The thing that got in the way the most was the dreamers that wouldn't listen and had their own crazy ideas of what the law meant. Now we know the reality of the situation, we know more about what the courts think. We know cops have cards. We know that the patient/caregiver model is king because there is nothing else that a regular person, without a ton of cash to pay an attorney, can afford to do.

 

You can say' "OPEN THEM UP" all day long and you might as well be saying "OPEN SESAME" to a solid rock wall. Michigan Patients' futures are growing their own, or dealing with a caregiver on a one to one. I've always said, "Know your grower". That still holds true.....

 

 

And you still have yet to raise a valid point for NOT having them.

 

Your argument against them has been the same. You repeat the same words hoping it will turn people to your thoughts. Thoughts that are clearly CLOSED off to ANY real solution.

 

If you ran a CC, then how is it you CANNOT see the need for some patients? How compassionate is that? Keep meds from them till they KNOW a CG?

[Ronulan]

I've said it before, to me it's all about options for the pt. if you don't want to use them don't, but if your in need they should be available. And a few less vacant buildings and a few more jobs can't hurt this state

[jjbigs]

"you can too": no, not everyone has the means or ability to grow, or to grow consistently. I - for example - simply do not have the space. And even if I did, I would much rather pay someone for their time and expertise than deal with all of the hassles of growing and the possibilities of a failed crop. Growing is simply not for everyone.

 

And cheaper is not the only consideration. Do you test everything thing that you produce (including % THC, CBD, CBN, mold)? Can you consistently provide a 20% CBD/1% THC product in tincture? Can you consistently provide a 10%/10% smokeable product? Can you provide the sheer range of strains and medibles that a large dispensary can?

 

z

 

I can! so can you. It doesnt take much room! get yourself a tent a t5 and have at it! the dispenses are shut down and the farm markets are mostly gone also, the only one I know of now is too far for me to goto!

 

as far as tinctures and medibles, oils, it realy is easy to do if you have the product! I can do it so can you!

 

Im mostly in agreement with restrorium, How ever there are c.gs who have gone out and spent everything they have to help pts, and they dont want to personaly gouged pts, so they off their product to the dispenses and it affords them to be compassionate to their own pts!

 

I have a great c.g, but as you know something always seems to come up! It is nice to have the option of a farm market or dispense, Yes it should be seperate from our law!

 

One last thing, I mite be wrong, but are we not the united states of america? and if we are united states, what is to stop us from not being united with the other states and d.c? State Law Trumps fed law period! now lets try tellin b.s that and the judges!

[Tyin'Flies]

Quit dreaming and get on board with what is real.

No one here is dreaming, we're searching and discussing REAL options. Not closing our mindset to options like BS would do.

 

I know I'm new to this site, but you really seem to be fighting the movement from within by limiting your thoughts to " only my way is best"

[Tyin'Flies]

Sorry if I came off harsh, but you really need to understand the COA first before you start talking about dispensaries being a valid option. If you need help finding the wording I would be happy to give it to you and try to help explain it.

 

I do understand, and I do still see them as an option.

 

It's ok that you think others on the site are less informed about things, and it's cool that you don't feel they can help patients.

[Tyin'Flies]

You don't believe in the Michigan Court of Appeals then? You want to ignore the judges' opinion?

 

What I'd like, is to change opinion.

[Tyin'Flies]

Then you need to help get the two conservative Michigan Supreme Court Justices, that are up for re-election in 2012, out. Because that's the only way the opinion can be changed. We are where we are for the foreseeable future... a long time to come.

 

Believe me, I DO my part! And try to inform others.

 

Sadly though, sometimes it's met with absolute resistance. even from within

 

 

I'm open to all options, I keep an open mind when it comes to finding solutions that work. When I see a solution that can help way more than it hurts, I try to expand on it and figure out the pros and cons. Shutting the door on ANY option right now is not what this movement needs.

 

Yes we have alot of people in power that have shut the door. Our job is to find a VIABLE solution that HELPS patients and present it to the powers that be in hopes of changing their views.

 

From your posts, I do not think you are in the same boat.

[Tyin'Flies]

It's good that we got this hammered out. Thanks for your help informing others that the courts say dispensaries are illegal and only the supreme court can overturn the COA opinion.

 

 

 

Yes, much better to lay down and let them decide what is ok than to find a solution. Thanks for showing where your support lies

 

 

We all know what the courts have said. This topic was about Dispensaries and WHY we need them, not about what's happening with the lawmakers.

[cristinew]

The COA is just fancy wording for ambulance chaser

[Timmahh]

It didn't cost me anything but copies of forms and info when I ran it. Libraries are free. It's what we have, use it. Quit dreaming and get on board with what is real. Dispensaries aren't going to fly, that is obvious. The thing that got in the way the most was the dreamers that wouldn't listen and had their own crazy ideas of what the law meant. Now we know the reality of the situation, we know more about what the courts think. We know cops have cards. We know that the patient/caregiver model is king because there is nothing else that a regular person, without a ton of cash to pay an attorney, can afford to do.

 

You can say' "OPEN THEM UP" all day long and you might as well be saying "OPEN SESAME" to a solid rock wall. Michigan Patients' futures are growing their own, or dealing with a caregiver on a one to one. I've always said, "Know your grower". That still holds true.....

 

Quit dreaming and get on board with what is real. Dispensaries aren't going to fly, that is obvious. The thing that got in the way the most was the dreamers that wouldn't listen and had their own crazy ideas of what the law meant.

 

now im a Crazy Dreamer huh? Nice try with the reach around press to make the implication its people with my understanding of the big picture, and that we are the reason Mi is im the state it is in on the MMJ front? us crazy dreamers with our progressive idea such as cannabis as medicine. or access for everyone.

 

Again Rest. your a record with a scratch. you should really have that scratch looked into, just its causing you have a BSOD Windows Error.. 0x000004380 (illogical request made)

 

If im a crazy dreamer for thinking Cannabis could be medicine, that access for everyone in the state is a doable thing, and that BS is a religeous Zealot that is walking in Hitlers Shadows. then I Stand Guilty..

 

but you may want to look at the face in the mirror some time soon... when you think that everyone in the state that can grow well, is going to stand up and say, Michigan, im your POT MAN, i ll do it for you for nothing. Cuz Im all about whats good for humanity.... im mr Compassion, and then stand there and call ME the dreamer, its just like the pot calling the kettle black.

 

So this club you started about 3 yrs ago isnt around anymore because of why?

 

 

and we Know the Courts are full of People who are on BS' coattails. I always anticipated the cops will get and have cards, and use them on both ends of the law. If you or others didnt you didnt look at the Big Picture... This should of been easy to see.

 

one of my biggest complaints in this whole matter is validation of cards.

 

NOTHING is going to work unless we Pts and CGs can have a way to Validate card numbers of those we work with. If we can validate a cards authenticity, then its quite probable you could be working with someone who is NOT on the MMMP Registry...

 

CC, Disp. FMs are under serious risk if we can not validate card authenticity, and that it is not expired, revoked or just a fake card....

and lets face a little honest fact.

Generally, people hardly give two defecates about their own family and you expect they ll stand up loud and proud to grow for people they do not know, have no inclination to know, have no desire to get to know, and these people are somehow going to make the system work all better?

 

And IM a Crazy Dreamer?

 

At this point in the game, if your fighting against dispensaries, you may as well join BS' team because your fighting againt what every Pt needs, and that is OPEN ACCESS to their Medication... NOW, not 3 or 4 months from now when they FINIALLY find a CG they can work with, or maybe they were just lucky and found a seed from heaven, that grew into the Colubian Gold Road to Oz.

[Timmahh]

Doesn't matter. They are illegal. The act didn't make them legal, that's what the courts(COA) said last. Listen to the courts. They are the deciders. No dreamers please. I don't need to make up any valid points other than that. It goes without saying, but I'll say it just for you, the COA said the act didn't make them legal in Michigan. Even if they were said to be legal, I believe the feds would shut them down, just like in Cali.

 

nice, THANK YOU FOR CLARIFYING YOUR POINT, and my arguement. TO YOU< IT DOESNT MATTER and that is where it ends. its blatently obvious you have a problem seeing the big picture, even when its chewing on the end of your Nose.

 

Dispensaries are NOT ILLEGAL! If they were ILLEGAL, they would not of been allowed to open in the 1st place. If the were Illegal, they would be being closed down and ran thru CRIMINAL COURTS Not CIVIL Courts Using a Public Nuisance. If they were Illegal, they would of been OUTLINED as Illegal in the Act in the 1st place..If Dispensaries are illgal, then so are farmers markets, True Non Profits, or anyone that has any dealing with anyone beyond their 5 assigned patients.

you think a Michigan full of 6 person pyramid schemes are going to move us forward? it will forward right into the 1st cell on the left.

 

Is that what you want? cuz that is exactly what your fighting for...the way i see it.

 

 

YOU need to stop drinking the Kool-Aid man. its got that bad brown acid in it from Woodstock that BS brewed up in the helps bathtub.

You want to go along with BS and the COA, thats your lynching to run with. have at it. Just be careful what you wish for, you might get it.

[jjbigs]

I just love reading a bunch of non sense arm chair or jail house attnys!

 

The only factual thing in this thread is the c.o.a ruling! Dispenses are illegal! for that matter so are farm markets! that dont mean im against them!

 

Time for me to do something productive and tend to my girls!

[Tyin'Flies]

Help me understand your interpretation of what the COA said about dispensaries then. Or are you completely ignoring their opinion?

 

 

 

Not so long ago in this state and others, the Courts said MMJ was illegal. Until the dreamers got them to change their minds.

To say that dispensaries are bad for MMJ patients and Caregivers simply because the Court says they're illegal is IMO foolish.

[Tyin'Flies]

Restorium is just trying to warn everyone about the current dangers of engaging in the practice, and the reality of what happens when you get on the wrong side of the law as a dispensary owner. It is not the purpose of the thread, which is why it may be causing some static, but I think he is trying to help patients and caregivers by alerting them to the fact that if they openly sell cannabis, they are likely going to find themselves unprotected by the act if they end up in a courtroom. It is good advice, but not really relevant to whether or not Michigan patients need dispensaries.

 

 

RIGHT! and I do agree with that. But like you stated it doesn't really have a bearing on the OP. I don't argue that what they do or what can happen in them could be very bad.

 

But not having that avenue for patients, (new patients more than not), to explore would be bad. Patients NEED access to meds and sometimes the only option they have is a dispensary. Taking that away from them does no one any good.

[Tyin'Flies]

I like to admit when I'm wrong. That's how you learn. Point out where I'm wrong, make a good case, and I admit I'm wrong. It's really not about me now is it?

 

I believe that the need for dispensaries here does hinge, to some extent, on their legality. That brings what I said right on topic. I could be wrong.

 

 

Ok, what extent does the legality play over need? If they are illegal there is no need?

 

I'm in no way bashing you Rest, or anything to that nature. I'm just trying to get your input on WHY the need is not there if the courts say it's illegal.