New And Trying To Follow The Law

[keylan]

After spending hours on this site trying to find out what I have to do to be legal I have a frigging headache. My husband is going to try to get a card, he has been taking Dilaudid  for years and he has developed a tolerance to it. He goes to the VA so his MD there wont be able to fill out a app for a card. We are hoping that the PA he sees in our hometown will. I am aware that the MD he practices under will actually have to do the signing. Wish us luck!  With the new rules regarding the relationship between patient and MD, if the local MD wont sign an app for him I guess he is screwed

 

MM was out of the question for him until we found out recently that you can now grow outside, the cost of buying it was just too prohibitive so was growing it indoors. We have a greenhouse attached to our home and I can grow a few plants for him there. Ive been reading all day and the rules are simply absurd, but I will follow them to the letter. Got to do what it takes. I will be his caregiver and I will separate his plants in the greenhouse so that I can have a specific locked secure area for just them. Plus I will also lock the greenhouse. I plan to also put a fence up that will prevent anyone from seeing the plants from the neighbors property. We are off the road so the greenhouse is not visible from it. I am grateful that the powers that be have now allowed "outside growing".

[Kingdiamond]

As long as he has copies of his medical records any medical marijuana clinic doctor can give him his recommendation for a small fee.

[keylan]

As long as he has copies of his medical records any medical marijuana clinic doctor can give him his recommendation for a small fee.

with the new ruling isn't it better to get the recommendation from a Md that has a history with treating you?  I see  problems ahead for MM clinic recommendations, they have no history with treating you and the way the AG is acting using a clinic MD is a great opening for him to "rid" MI of the MDs he views as only "pot docs". His behavior so far doesn't give me a warm fuzzy feeling, I cant afford a legal battle or to have my home siezed. Id rather not take that risk. Thanks for the advise though I appreciate you replying

[Kingdiamond]

As long as the clinic does a hand on examination with follow up visits every 6 months there should be no problems .

[mibrains]

that's pretty much correct king..

 

i would add also that so long as your husband has good records that support his cause for cannabis use then he should have no problems using a certification specialist such as doctor bob.

 

doctor bob now also guarantees he will represent you in a medical cannabis prosecution included in his examination price if you used him for certification.

 

that's a big deal. 

 

it means he stands behind his recommendation and he is willing to bet his life on proving your husbands medical needs.

 

a fly by night clinic might not offer those same qualities so i would absolutely say your choice with proceeding with caution is not only warranted it is a great starting point and plan.

 

people that begin this miraculous healing journey with a cautious approach when it comes to their daily use and growing techniques have been fairing very well... (so long as your not in a hostile county such as Oakland)

 

by the way... welcome to the forums..

 

i sincerely hope your husband finds the help in this plant that he and you are seeking... as a Gulf war combat vet myself i take pride in the fact that i never used cannabis before my military time.. now many years later i can honestly say that using my own organic home grown cannabis has officially changed my life.

 

for the better most days..

 

now... 4 years later i am a caregiver doing everything in my power to spread the knowledge about cannabis being a miracle plant everywhere i can

 

it is important that you share your stories and spread the knowledge.. if cannabis helps or not it still remains relevant that your husband tried to find relief with it.

 

depending on his qualifying condition he may find benefits with specific strains... cannabis literally has thousands of strains that have millions of effects depending on billions of variables.

 

please don't get lost in all the information on our, or any other cannabis site... there truly is a ton of things to sort through.. especially when your brand new to this plant and its miracle healing abilities....

 

please just ask.

 

there are many of us here that are more than happy to help people with their medical cannabis needs.

 

welcome again and have a great weekend.

[t-pain]

dont hesitate to ask questions.

 

a primary doctor is best, but then some doctors after hearing the word 'marijuana' will drop a patient.

so , in those cases, if you really like your doctor, it maybe better to test the waters before hinting that you use mmj.

e.g. 'my brother in law got an mmj card for his back pain, what do you think about mmj? does it work for people?'

 

then if its a prohibitionist doctor... they put that mj in your chart, and that eliminates a whole bunch of doctors from even seeing you

Edited October 5, 2013 by t-pain

[keylan]

dont hesitate to ask questions.

 

a primary doctor is best, but then some doctors after hearing the word 'marijuana' will drop a patient.

so , in those cases, if you really like your doctor, it maybe better to test the waters before hinting that you use mmj.

e.g. 'my brother in law got an mmj card for his back pain, what do you think about mmj? does it work for people?'

 

then if its a prohibitionist doctor... they put that mj in your chart, and that eliminates a whole bunch of doctors from even seeing you

 

 

Thanks for the warning, Wasn't aware of this, I do know that a lot of MDs are really gun shy when it comes to MM. Its just not worth the hassle to them to get involved. Im a nurse and back when the law first went into effect I heard more than a few conversations by the docs, they dreaded the law back then. Im not sure that its a question of the docs being anti mm as more than a few have written Rxs for Marinol . I thinks it is the legal issues they fear more than anything. I do understand their position, being a nurse I had to read the law to see that my license wont be at risk being a caregiver to my husband.. Most healthcare professionals haven't read the law and don't know what protection it offers. We are at risk so often in our professional lives we tend to assume the worst. I am sure their are anti mm docs out there though. They are no different than the general population. Look at Dr Sanjay Gupta. He only changed his position recently - Kudos to him for being so public.

[keylan]

that's pretty much correct king..

 

i would add also that so long as your husband has good records that support his cause for cannabis use then he should have no problems using a certification specialist such as doctor bob.

 

doctor bob now also guarantees he will represent you in a medical cannabis prosecution included in his examination

price if you used him for certification

that's a big deal. 

 

it means he stands behind his recommendation and he is willing to bet his life on proving your husbands medical needs.

 

a fly by night clinic might not offer those same qualities so i would absolutely say your choice with proceeding with caution is not only warranted it is a great starting point and plan.

 

people that begin this miraculous healing journey with a cautious approach when it comes to their daily use and growing techniques have been fairing very well... (so long as your not in a hostile county such as Oakland)

 

by the way... welcome to the forums..

 

i sincerely hope your husband finds the help in this plant that he and you are seeking... as a Gulf war combat vet myself i take pride in the fact that i never used cannabis before my military time.. now many years later i can honestly say that using my own organic home grown cannabis has officially changed my life.

 

for the better most days..

 

now... 4 years later i am a caregiver doing everything in my power to spread the knowledge about cannabis being a miracle plant everywhere i can

 

it is important that you share your stories and spread the knowledge.. if cannabis helps or not it still remains relevant that your husband tried to find relief with it.

 

depending on his qualifying condition he may find benefits with specific strains... cannabis literally has thousands of strains that have millions of effects depending on billions of variables.

 

please don't get lost in all the information on our, or any other cannabis site... there truly is a ton of things to sort through.. especially when your brand new to this plant and its miracle healing abilities....

 

please just ask.

 

there are many of us here that are more than happy to help people with their medical cannabis needs.

 

welcome again and have a great weekend.

Thanks for the info and the welcome - to late for me not to get lost in al the info though. That happened many hours ago. I am curious to see if this really works. Being a nurse Im not willing to believe until I see. Im a rubber meets the road kinda person. I do hope it works for him. Its surely better than taking ever increasing amounts of Dilaudid provided it works! Im certainly willing to give it a shot. BTW  What strains do you recommend for back pain? That answer alone will save me untold hours of internet reading

 

While Im at it - you did say to ask away   Which is better seeds or clones? I am a pretty good gardener - 15 plus years so starting seeds and sexing shouldn't be a big problem for me -Ive started seeds for years and sexed plants. It seems to me that clones would tend to insure that your getting quality and the strain you actually need. But my son tells me clones are not that easy to get.

[keylan]

I will certainly give  Dr Bob a call if our local doc seems at all hinky when we give him a call to feel him out.

 

My experience with mm was way way back in my Hippie days. I had a card carrying sadist for a dentist.So at about 14 I had the brilliant idea to smoke some pot before my dentist appt. Bad bad idea, what was a 45 minute appt felt like hours upon hours, and the pain if anything was worse. That said I hope it works for my husband.

[mibrains]

absolutely...

 

we love relevant questions around here.

 

for back pain i would (depending on specific circumstances) tend to recommend an indica dominant strain.

most likely one that would have strong effect but not overwhelm the senses.

 

right now i am growing 3 indica dominate strains.

 

one is blue widow which i got from Dutch passion seed company out of Amsterdam as a freebee from dinafem I think it was..

i made the mistake of ordering feminized seeds because i assumed i wanted to be sure i got female plants...

 

the problem with feminized seeds is that the very nature of the act of feminizing them creates a weakness in their DNA that may or may not cause trouble in their offspring.

each and every cannabis plant from a feminized seed i am growing has a tendency to throw nanners(male pollen sacs on a female plant) at the first sign of any stresses.

 

at this juncture your best bet is to use seeds.  clones and cloning are great when you keep them in house.. when you bring a clone into your grow space from an outside source you most often times also invite an unwanted bug infestation.

 

so.. unless you have an "isolation chamber" which is able to grow a plant an entire cycle separate and apart from the area of your other plants i would definitely suggest using good quality seeds.

 

next question.. where do you find quality seeds? depending on your location and abilities we the cannabis community will be able to help recommend places to obtain your stock.

 

i just put some aurora indica seeds into my cycle... it is a strong indica dominant strain and i hope it will help my patients that require that mixture.   i spend a lot of time trying to find better strains and better quality cannabis.. i started 3 non-feminized seeds and am hoping that one will be a keeper.  its kind of a slow process to find keepers unless you bring known clones into your cycle... however be aware clones carry bugs.  2 out of 3 times i brought in clones i got spider mites.  these days i wont bring in a clone... not until i complete a non essential grow space that is capable of finishing the clone from start to finish... isolated and safe from the primary grow space..

once you have had mites.. you will do everything to avoid getting them again.  

 

the truth is.. do what works.

start slow.  begin easy and you will hopefully learn quickly.

stick to the basics at first and then learn to augment and expand after you understand the plant.

many strains are all hype.  the medical cannabis industry is new and fraught with people that will try to deceive a person for a dollar...

 

good luck and i hope your husband finds a strain that helps him feel better..

 

try to remember cannabis use can be a lot about perception.  what you believe can be held to a higher probability of coming to fruition..

 

encouragement and honesty are best.

 

i would recommend that you guys start slow.  try it a little at a time and work your way into it.

 

the thing is if it works he will know fairly quickly..

 

i use a sativa dominate strain in the morning and an indica dominant in the evening.. unfortunately the strains heritage will only tell you so much.  he will have to try a few different types before he finds one he likes.. my suggestion is to not give up to early... 

 

if any particular issue arises from his use then see if a different strain might help alleviate that symptom while still providing the same relief for his primary use reasons.

[keylan]

Ive had spider mites in my greenhouse before -  what a nightmare that was. Spent hours out there for weeks with a hand vac sucking the buggers up. Don't want to play that game again wasn't fun. So seeds it is! I sure appreciate you posting all the answers you have with all my "newbie " questions !!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am a night shifter and got called off work tonight hence here I sit, with tons of info to go through. At least this ol country woman is experienced in growing stuff. Marajuana doesn't seem all that hard to grow from what Ive garnered on the net. Ive certainly grown some difficult things in the years Ive been gardening. The greenhouse sure helps. Ive grown tomatoes that are 10 foot tall in there. Right now Ive got two tomatoe plant under lights in my dining room window I  will get maters till Feb

 

The thing that worries me the most is the law! I know that I am going to get a visit when its flyover time the copters are out by me every year. Im actually thinking of going to the police with pics before they start the fly overs and show them what I have and ask if they see any problems.

[t-pain]

you might want to think about installing some blurring privacy film on your greenhouse roof.

as long as it does not block too much sunlight. should keep prying eyes out?

 

the thing about showing police is that theres multiple agencies. so you'll have to show the sherrif, the city, the county, and then whatever 'task force' is in effect for your area. like BAYANET. and then hope one of them isnt crazy.

hope your city didnt have some ordinance against growing. still waiting for ter beek vs wyoming to finish in the mich supreme court...

 

edit: forgot, theres also the state police to contact.

 

buy seeds online, seems easy route. otherwise you can get clones from a caregiver, or possibly some brave mmma patients on craigslist. but clones sometimes have mites...

 

if you grew tomatoes, you can grow marijuana. 

Edited October 5, 2013 by t-pain

[bobandtorey]

Welcome Here

 

IMHO i would not go and tell the police anything i also think that the Law we have is very clear and well written you may have 12 plants locked up and 2.5 oz for each card or recommendation and i do believe that you can't be arrested 

And also i believe things are getting better in the Courts  IMHO I thinks it is the legal issues the Doctors fear more than anything

 

true i feel the same

[bobandtorey]

People v Brown

this is a good read

 

 

Published Opinion of the Court of Appeals, __ Mich App __ (2012)

This case addressed the probable cause analysis in light of the MMMA. Here, the defendant’s former roommate contacted and informed police that he saw grow lights, ventilation fans, and small marihuana plants growing their residence. The officers conducted trash pulls from the house and found marihuana.

The officer included those facts in a search warrant affidavit. The affidavit did not contain any statement as to whether the defendant was a medical marijuana patient. The search warrant was approved and the search was executed. Officers found 8 marijuana plants and 2 grams of marijuana.

The defendant filed a motion to dismiss and for a evidentiary hearing. Defendant argued the facts included in the affidavit failed to establish probable cause that a crime was committed because the MMMA made it legal to possess and grow certain amounts of marijuana.

The trial court agreed and found the affidavit did not contain sufficient facts to establish probable cause. Specifically, the trial court found that due to the MMMA’s passage, the search warrant affidavit had to provide specific facts that the possession of the marijuana alleged in the affidavit was not legal under the MMMA.

However, despite that ruling, the court found that the evidence should not be suppressed based on the good-faith exception to the exclusionary rule.

On appeal, the Court of Appeals affirmed the trial court, but for a different reason. Specifically, the appellate court found the facts in the affidavit established the necessary probable cause, despite the passage of the MMMA. Contrary to the trial court’s conclusion, the appellate court found the MMMA did not make the possession or cultivation of marijuana “legal.” Instead, the found that any possession of marijuana continues to violate the Public Health Code and is indicative of a criminal act sufficient for a probable cause finding. The court held:

 

 Thus, we conclude that to establish probable cause, a search-warrant affidavit need not provide facts from which a magistrate could conclude that a suspect’s marijuana-related activities are specifically not legal under the MMMA.

http://www.onmedicalmarijuana.com/people-v-brown/

Edited October 5, 2013 by bobandtorey