State Should Set Up Dispensary System...

[Marijuana Ranch]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EE9KT_dU_R8

[mizerman]

You have the rooster, the hen, and the chicken. The rooster goes with the chicken...So, who's having sex with the hen?

 

 

Frank Costanza

[Guest Happy Guy]

Thanks A and J for helping us get back on topic. Here's the question again:

Do you have an example of how a low income patient can use this service?

[peanutbutter]

Thanks A and J for helping us get back on topic. Here's the question again:

 

It's hard to see the question, when it's combined with the insult.

[peanutbutter]

This thread is absolutely crazy. This service is owned by Tonto from our Planet Green Trees radio show. He is a very caring and compassionate one-man-show that is doing this to help patients and caregivers produce better medication and learn what works for them.

 

These simple "dipstrip" tests have taught me and our club members more about the quality and purity of our medicine than any other testing we have access to, which is nil.

 

Please forgive me. The dip strip method is indeed much better than nothing at all.

 

FYI The testing conducted at Harborside, in CA, costs about $75 per sample.

 

more FYI there are currently several universities and hospitals that are testing Simpson Hemp Oil against samples of human cancers. That's here in Michigan. Results are expected in the next couple of weeks.

 

They have seen enough to look closer.

 

High end testing, I figure, is required to zero in on the exact cannabinoid profiles that work the best. Other areas of the cannabis plant need to be explored as well. Those compounds that make up the smell of the plant, for instance.

[Guest Happy Guy]

This thread is absolutely crazy. This service is owned by Tonto from our Planet Green Trees radio show. He is a very caring and compassionate one-man-show that is doing this to help patients and caregivers produce better medication and learn what works for them.

 

These simple "dipstrip" tests have taught me and our club members more about the quality and purity of our medicine than any other testing we have access to, which is nil.

What have they taught you about the quality and purity of your meds? Thanks.

[bobandtorey]

sounds like eddie hasko

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PAGBvLGpEQA&NR=1

[Guest Happy Guy]

The most important thing they have taught us is how incredibly important proper flush and cure are to potency and purity.

Most of us patient growers knew about flushing. Are we doing it right to flush for 10-14 days like we have always been taught? Or did the testing reveal something we didn't already know? Thanks.

[Guest Happy Guy]

We definitely know that organic does not mean no flush. A few of the 100% organic samples were still laden with acids even when bone dry, which indicates to me that residual materials from the last feeding were still trapped in the plant material when tested. This fact, shown even as loosely as it was, convinced more than one patient to alter his approach in the grow room.

 

That being said, slow curing may be a way to remove the acids from even chemical hydroponic medicine even without flushing, as some of the well-cured samples grown with chemical hydroponics showed very low residual acids even without a long flush. Impractical for most patients and caregivers, but good to know nonetheless. Without a long, slow cure, I would consider 14 day flush a minimum based on what I saw in the test results if hydroponic fertilizers are used.

 

Additionally, although it is of little use now with the state of our genetics in Michigan, a corpus of testing is being gathered that will allow patients to understand the specific combinations of CDB/THC/THCV/CBC/CBG that give them either relief from their condition or problems under certain social contexts. This will allow more people to use herbal cannabis as medicine rather than just hunting and pecking for the right strain all the time. Especially for those growing their own, strain experimentation is expensive. It is nice to know in advance that the clone that you are picking up from that club matches the medicine that you are using and that the grow teacher is growing and that the tester is testing. That helps patients.

 

The cost of the testing that I have heard bandied about is less than half what has been mentioned elsewhere in this thread and puts it well within reach for most clubs to test every harvest to keep checking themselves and their practices. I am in full support of this kind of voluntary testing and I think that the clubs that engage in the honest use of it are doing a great service to their patient members.

 

I do realize that the thin-layer chromatography testing is inferior to gas chromatography, but the legal environment in Michigan is threatening enough right now that it is difficult to convince somebody to invest hundreds of thousands in a potentially raidable business "scheme" that would likely be called out as a "big money move" by many vocal members of this community. We cannot have our cake and eat it too. We scare away big money or we don't, but let's not scare away both!

So we have confirmation that what we teach is the right way to grow. Thanks. It has been confirmed a million times already. If it took a test to make people believe what we have already been trying to teach then that is all good.

 

You say this;

Additionally, although it is of little use now with the state of our genetics in Michigan, a corpus of testing is being gathered that will allow patients to understand the specific combinations of CDB/THC/THCV/CBC/CBG that give them either relief from their condition or problems under certain social contexts. This will allow more people to use herbal cannabis as medicine rather than just hunting and pecking for the right strain all the time. Especially for those growing their own, strain experimentation is expensive. It is nice to know in advance that the clone that you are picking up from that club matches the medicine that you are using and that the grow teacher is growing and that the tester is testing. That helps patients.

 

Do you understand that we can already manipulate CBD/THC/THCV/CBC/CBG through temperature of destruction? I have posted it on this web site over a dozen times. There's another good example someone else posted recently in the duff butter thread. The information is all right at our fingerstips just as you would expect because we are not the first to walk down this path. It not about secret recipes and expensive testing, or even the variety a dispensary can offer. You can manipulate any strain to produce the effects patients need. Some would have you believe that this is a whole new world here in Michigan. We are actually followers here. The real science and real clinical trials for diseases like cancer and MS have taken place in states and countries that are ahead of us in their thinking regarding cannabis. We don't have to go over the same old ground and make the same mistakes. We can pay attention and learn from those that have already been where we are now.

[peanutbutter]

So we have confirmation that what we teach is the right way to grow. Thanks. It has been confirmed a million times already. If it took a test to make people believe what we have already been trying to teach then that is all good.

 

So all of this testing stuff is a waste of time ..

 

Just ask HG .. he already knows everything there is to know.

[Guest Happy Guy]

That's a science term that I threw out there that isn't very common. I also told you that you could find it in the duff butter thread. whoME knows all about it;

http://michiganmedicalmarijuana.org/topic/26466-duff-toast-butter/page__p__241212__hl__%2Bduff+%2Bbutter__fromsearch__1#entry241212

Again, all this information, temperature adjusting, flushing, curing, has all been out there for decades now. It's all has been confirmed, over and over, first by humans, then with testing.

[Guest Happy Guy]

Here's another example I posted the other day but it got filibustered right over;

http://leavesofgrass.info/info/Fractionating-Cannabinoids.pdf

[Guest Happy Guy]

It was the Michigan dispensary owner that was caught on tape telling us how he would hide the chemical smelling cannabis in medibles. You brought it up so I don't want to hear about bashing these poor folks. This shows that we couldn't ever trust a test from anyone other than a professional lab that sealed the sample and it would have to be untampered with until the patient opened it. Let's get real. No one would be able to afford that. Only the most wealthy among us could pay for testing. You are heading us straight into the wall at cruising speed. Step back and look at the beauty of the system we now have. The biggest 'glaring' example of failure, as you put it, is that we can't get our cards on time. Fix that and we have a complete system that works as it was designed to. The successful business model for a dispensary doesn't include any competition. They have lobbied for their monopoly. We have proof of that. A state regulated system would look exactly like the proposed privately run model with a few more restrictions thrown in there. It's a disaster waiting to happen.

What we need to do is wait and see if patient to patient transfers are legal. If they are then the dispensaries are legal and let them do what is legal. We have no right to stop them. Let the chips fall where they may. We don't need any more regulation. Whether it be leveled at dispensaries or patients, no new regulations.

[Guest Happy Guy]

We will wait and see what the courts say about the law we have in place. Let's get this one defined first before we add any new regulations.

 

You say; I don't think that protecting all dispensaries with patient-to-patient is the way to do it. That will

clear the way for loads of bad behavior.

 

Not your call. I have to say I'm glad it is not. That is what dispensaries say they do, transfer between patients. It's either legal or it's not. It's the best way to protect dispensaries and any patients transfering.

[Dlo]

I did not go because Michael went to gather information. He reported back to me after every meeting. My presence would have kept the traitors silent as they know my stance on imposing regulations on our community. The fact is you should never talk to the police or prosecutors. They are not bound by their word. They have heard every reason in the world why they should prosecute us. These monopoly wannabes simply want legislation that would adopt the Colorado model. You assist them by trying to impose their regulations on our community.

 

I will not get in bed with these folks because they want to screw patients/caregivers. Traitors from our side and law enforcement on the other. This is not people sitting down and talking to legislatures. They are talking bad about our folks to popo. Popo kicks in our doors and terrifies patients/caregivers. I will not negotiate anything with law enforcement that compromises our law or puts patients/caregivers in the line of fire. There is a proper venue for everything. Cooperating with police to preserve and enhance your position in the marketplace is not a proper venue.

 

Now that you know I know everything about Lansing, we can start to talk things through. I will not sit silently by and allow our community to be ravaged or manipulated by anyone. If you want regulations, perhaps you should discuss them with the people and not think that you know what's best. We don't want to be led to the slaughter by the elite. We don't want to be dependent on the rich. We just want to grow our medicine and be left alone. That is the common tie that holds our community together. If dispensaries want to be regulated, so be it. But they will not impose their will on our community, nor will we allow them to form a monopoly and force mom and pop operations out of business and prevent us from growing. This is our law and no amount of money in the world can buy it.

 

 

[mizerman]

We definitely know that organic does not mean no flush. A few of the 100% organic samples were still laden with acids even when bone dry, which indicates to me that residual materials from the last feeding were still trapped in the plant material when tested. This fact, shown even as loosely as it was, convinced more than one patient to alter his approach in the grow room.

 

That being said, slow curing may be a way to remove the acids from even chemical hydroponic medicine even without flushing, as some of the well-cured samples grown with chemical hydroponics showed very low residual acids even without a long flush. Impractical for most patients and caregivers, but good to know nonetheless. Without a long, slow cure, I would consider 14 day flush a minimum based on what I saw in the test results if hydroponic fertilizers are used.

 

Additionally, although it is of little use now with the state of our genetics in Michigan, a corpus of testing is being gathered that will allow patients to understand the specific combinations of CDB/THC/THCV/CBC/CBG that give them either relief from their condition or problems under certain social contexts. This will allow more people to use herbal cannabis as medicine rather than just hunting and pecking for the right strain all the time. Especially for those growing their own, strain experimentation is expensive. It is nice to know in advance that the clone that you are picking up from that club matches the medicine that you are using and that the grow teacher is growing and that the tester is testing. That helps patients.

 

The cost of the testing that I have heard bandied about is less than half what has been mentioned elsewhere in this thread and puts it well within reach for most clubs to test every harvest to keep checking themselves and their practices. I am in full support of this kind of voluntary testing and I think that the clubs that engage in the honest use of it are doing a great service to their patient members.

 

I do realize that the thin-layer chromatography testing is inferior to gas chromatography, but the legal environment in Michigan is threatening enough right now that it is difficult to convince somebody to invest hundreds of thousands in a potentially raidable business "scheme" that would likely be called out as a "big money move" by many vocal members of this community. We cannot have our cake and eat it too. We scare away big money or we don't, but let's not scare away both!

Great post as usual and always full of insight!

 

 

Happy Holidays,

 

 

 

Mizerman

[Guest Happy Guy]

You rock, Joe. Thank you.

 

And what you are saying about the out-of-state dispensary lobby, I definitely agree with you. They are the real enemy here (to both patients and caregivers, in my opinion) and must be watched tirelessly. That is the main reason I am there, as a matter of fact.

 

I am a true believer in the idea that growing caregivers and patients can take the best care of the entire population of Michigan. So much so that I want to make sure that nobody in the state is able to secure special growing rights and that dispensaries, if they are ever explicitly protected by Michigan law, are required to use domestic supply. This is the way to preserve our rights for everyone rather than just the elite few.

 

I actually have changed my mind in the past year about dispensaries. I no longer think they are the best way to serve the patients and caregivers of Michigan, especially in an unregulated environment. Personally, I think the farmers' markets are doing a better job overall and won't require the regulations that I think are necessary to temper the actions of dispensaries.

 

This model, if explicitly protected by patient-to-patient transfers, works without additional regulation.

 

But it makes me sick every time a dispensary is raided, because very few of them actually think they are violating the law, spirit or otherwise. We need to tell them the rules or finally that they cannot play. If patient-to-patient is the only rule, we will get what we have now, regardless. We will still have dispensary owners defending themselves in court or trying to get their meds back after illegal confiscation when some authority figure deems them "not medical."

 

If the current dispensary cases are all we are going to give them for protection, I think they will be waiting a while and may not feel so secure even when they are complete.

What about the dispensary case where the cops had cards? That proves that the dispensary was transfering from patient to patient. The patients can't plead the 5th like in the other case. We have our test case.

[bobandtorey]

What about the dispensary case where the cops had cards? That proves that the dispensary was transferring from patient to patient. The patients can't plead the 5th like in the other case. We have our test case.

 

 

we wont know that for another 2-5 years

[Guest Happy Guy]

we wont know that for another 2-5 years

How's it looking right now? Anyone know if it looks like it's going the distance? Any court dates yet? Any more sightings of the cops with cards? They look more like patients than cops from the pics I have seen. Only the one had a picture on his MM card.

[peanutbutter]

How's it looking right now? Anyone know if it looks like it's going the distance? Any court dates yet? Any more sightings of the cops with cards? They look more like patients than cops from the pics I have seen. Only the one had a picture on his MM card.

 

Which one? Derek Meyers?

[Guest Happy Guy]

Which one? Derek Meyers?

Card says Evans. Meyers must be his stage name? LOL Or the other way around.

[peanutbutter]

Card says Evans. Meyers must be his stage name? LOL Or the other way around.

 

And what about the card that says Candace R. Carlsom?

 

BTW Meyers is his real last name. Evans was the name on the fake card. He has a new card without the picture and a different last name on the new card.

 

Candace has a new card without picture now with a different last name.

[Guest Happy Guy]

They all look like regular people/patients you might meet at a cc or clinic. A couple of them look like people I know but when you zoom in on high res you can tell they aren't the same. Would be good to get the show on the road for transfers before they have too many fish in the net. Are the dispensary folks dragging their feet again? Too bad a patient didn't testify in the other dispensary case. We would have another good test case. It wouldn't have hurt the patient and it would have defined the law.

[peanutbutter]

This is one of two places that you posted bad information, just this morning so far, as if you were a voice of authority.

 

There were more than one fake ID cards printed with a picture. There were several.

 

Most, maybe all, of those ID cards that were printed with pictures have been replaced. New names were printed on the new cards without pictures.

[Guest Happy Guy]

This is one of two places that you posted bad information, just this morning so far, as if you were a voice of authority.

 

There were more than one fake ID cards printed with a picture. There were several.

 

Most, maybe all, of those ID cards that were printed with pictures have been replaced. New names were printed on the new cards without pictures.

Mr Agenda? I present the info as I have it. I have the id pictures of 5 officers. I tell it like I see it. Nothing wrong with what I said. It's all true. If you have more information than I it doesn't make what I have wrong. You are twisting things around again. Take a break from that non productive activity that only covers what might be useful.