Dea Strikes Again

[+420Atheist]

As Garyfisher points out it is about possession. We don't know if these guys had separate locked facilities or not.

 

<edited to add while I was composing this it was posted they were separate locked facilities.>

 

I believe the local LEO is looking for any reason they can to go after grows. They don't like our law and they don't like us. They think we are hippies who are ruining society because we tend to think outside of their box. They know they could very well lose their cases if the caregivers have enough cards to cover their plant count. If they call the feds then they don't have to be concerned with the caregivers winning and setting precedent about multi grow operations in MI.

 

Turning these grows over to the feds gives local LEO two things. First it kills any chance of precedent being set and second it lets them win a publicity battle. They can go to the press and say see these caregivers are just drug dealers. They are not following the law and attempting to make huge profits by growing marijuana. Under normal circumstances this would be called entrepreneurship and good business but for us it is equated with criminal drug dealers.

 

Our law is still young. It seems to me these large grows and dispensaries are going to turn public opinion against us. Honestly PB what our law says ultimately does not matter if the general public believes they have been duped into helping drug dealers. You and I know that is not the case but that is the story LEO is trying to sell. We have to concentrate on winning hearts and minds before we start pushing these limits or we will appear to be all about the money. Michiganders helping Michiganders. That needs to be more than just a motto. It needs to be our whole focus and way of life.

[Croppled1]

It is very important to understand what charges of having over 99 plants mean in Federal Court . 5-40 years with a mandatory 5 year minimum and huge fines .

 

http://www.justice.gov/dea/agency/penalties.htm

[brbud]

As Garyfisher points out it is about possession. We don't know if these guys had separate locked facilities or not.

 

<edited to add while I was composing this it was posted they were separate locked facilities.>

 

I believe the local LEO is looking for any reason they can to go after grows. They don't like our law and they don't like us. They think we are hippies who are ruining society because we tend to think outside of their box. They know they could very well lose their cases if the caregivers have enough cards to cover their plant count. If they call the feds then they don't have to be concerned with the caregivers winning and setting precedent about multi grow operations in MI.

 

Turning these grows over to the feds gives local LEO two things. First it kills any chance of precedent being set and second it lets them win a publicity battle. They can go to the press and say see these caregivers are just drug dealers. They are not following the law and attempting to make huge profits by growing marijuana. Under normal circumstances this would be called entrepreneurship and good business but for us it is equated with criminal drug dealers.

 

Our law is still young. It seems to me these large grows and dispensaries are going to turn public opinion against us. Honestly PB what our law says ultimately does not matter if the general public believes they have been duped into helping drug dealers. You and I know that is not the case but that is the story LEO is trying to sell. We have to concentrate on winning hearts and minds before we start pushing these limits or we will appear to be all about the money. Michiganders helping Michiganders. That needs to be more than just a motto. It needs to be our whole focus and way of life.

 

Right On...well put

 

72 grows may even look commercial in many communities

[trix]

The city of Oakland could become home to some of the world’s largest government-licensed marijuana-growing operations, with permits to distribute products around the state, according to a draft ordinance released yesterday.

 

The city’s public safety committee meets tonight to consider the plan to permit four industrial-scale, “medical cannabis” cultivation facilities.

 

The ordinance does not limit the size of the indoor operations, but says the council has received proposals ranging from 20,000 to 100,000 square feet.

 

“The cultivation of medical cannabis in Oakland has not been regulated and occurs entirely in small-scale home operations or larger-scale illicit warehouses,” reads a report submitted to the committee by city council members Rebecca Kaplan and Larry Reid. “These unregulated operations have led to public safety hazards, including fires, burglaries and home invasions, health risks to patients, and related response costs to the city.” <----- yuh of raids and law suits, and not getting paid for the operation. sound familiar?

 

But the plan doesn’t restrict operations to Oakland. “Responsible transfer permits” would allow registered dispensaries anywhere in the state to purchase medical marijuana from the city’s pot farms. “Sales would be subject to the recently approved sales tax on medical cannabis providing additional revenue for the city through sales taxes,” reads the report.

 

In addition to improving public safety, the report suggests the plan could help revive the city’s anemic finances, raising anywhere from $3 million to $38 million in permit fees and sales taxes.

 

Experts say licensed marijuana-growing operations of this size and purpose do not exist anywhere in the world. Even the pot-friendly Netherlands only legally permits small-scale marijuana cultivation for distribution to consumers.

 

“I am not aware of any indoor-growing facility of that size or one whose product is meant to be consumed,” said Jonathan Caulkins, a Carnegie Mellon professor who co-authored a recent RAND Corporation study on marijuana in California.

 

Dale Gieringer, who heads the California branch of the National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws, said he could think of only a few government-sanctioned, outdoor pot farms that were larger than the indoor facilities being considered for Oakland.

 

“This is a very big deal,” he said.

 

The plan is raising a few eyebrows, even among legalization advocates like Gieringer. He said the ordinance envisions a “monopoly” for marijuana growers while also maintaining a virtual stranglehold on distribution (the plan would increase the number of legal dispensaries in Oakland from four to six).

 

“There are certainly more than four brands of wine and beer in Oakland and there are certainly more than four brands of cannabis,” Gieringer said.

 

But the supporters predict the plan would lead to lower prices and help wipe out illegal growing operations.

 

“Permitting larger-scale cultivation will allow for lower production costs per pound by creating economies of scale,” reads the committee report. “Lower production costs will allow regulated cultivation facilities to undercut wholesale prices of cannabis grown in unregulated operations.” Still, the report estimates dispensaries will continue to purchase at least 20 percent of their product from boutique growers who cultivate within a 96-square-foot legal limit.

 

Berkeley’s City Council is also considering industrial-scale marijuana cultivation and Mendocino recently passed regulationsallowing outdoor pot farms to expand capacity to 99 plants per land parcel.

 

It’s leading some observers to wonder whether the battle for the statewide medical marijuana market – and accompanying tax dollars – is intensifying among local governments, well in advance of the vote this fall to legalize marijuana use in California.

 

Of course, much depends on the actions (or inactions) of the federal government. The feds still classify pot as a schedule one narcotic and DEA agents continue to raid some farms that claim to be operating within the state’s medical marijuana laws.

[trix]

Cali is having what seems like the same problems we are from what I have been reading?

 

The problem is the GOVERNMENT not getting a big enough cut, they want it all.

 

Trix

[brbud]

I wouldnt want cali's problems, let alone Oakland..lol

 

thats says a lot to coming from Michigan

 

we think different here in Mi

 

where you from?

 

spent some time at the City Center...that city riots wether their team wins or loose

[trix]

what I get from that is, they are trying to take the right to grow away from Cali patients, and only permitting government run dispensaries to distribute. Also the relevant part is 99 plants is federal law and DEA is pushing there as well..no matter what there state law is..

 

Cali is the pioneer of this MM adventure, crap rolls down hill an it usually lands in the lap of the citizens IMO that is..

 

Trix

[brbud]

what I get from that is, they are trying to take the right to grow away from Cali patients, and only permitting government run dispensaries to distribute. Also the relevant part is 99 plants is federal law and DEA is pushing there as well..no matter what there state law is..

 

Cali is the pioneer of this MM adventure, crap rolls down hill an it usually lands in the lap of the citizens IMO that is..

 

Trix

 

and how long you lived in Michigan Friend?

[trix]

Born and raised in Michigan, current victim of the system as well.

 

That aside my point being was this stuff is going to continue to happen. DEA, and NARC squads will bust you for over 99 plants, legal or not..

 

They use the word medical marijuana in the law. but on my arrest warrant it just says manufacturing marijuana. no metion of medical anything..

 

Trix

[Danielshemp]

what I get from that is, they are trying to take the right to grow away from Cali patients, and only permitting government run dispensaries to distribute. Also the relevant part is 99 plants is federal law and DEA is pushing there as well..no matter what there state law is..

 

Cali is the pioneer of this MM adventure, crap rolls down hill an it usually lands in the lap of the citizens IMO that is..

 

Trix

 

Michigan has bigger problems than California concerning medical marijuana. Every Republican politician would like to make a name for themselves by railing on the MMMa. The Republicans will control the state government at all levels for, at least, the next 2 years. Expect the court of appeals and supreme court to rule against medical marijuana cases. The law is doomed.

 

In May of this year, I will be moving back to my home state of California. In California the laws have been tested in court and police have been sued for violating the protections. Michigan is a long way from that.

[bobandtorey]

Born and raised in Michigan, current victim of the system as well.

 

That aside my point being was this stuff is going to continue to happen. DEA, and NARC squads will bust you for over 99 plants, legal or not..

 

They use the word medical marijuana in the law. but on my arrest warrant it just says manufacturing marijuana. no mention of medical anything..

 

Trix

 

Thanks

this is why we may be able to use are cards in court because are Lawyers were thinking ahead are cards have a sticker on it that may save us because it's evidents now that it has that on it

we hope any way

[foxman711]

 

 

The law if very clear that only a patient and his Cg may have access to the plants.

 

The rules say a patient or a caregiver not the patient or the caregiver

[peanutbutter]

From my understanding of a long conversation i had with someone from the area of the bust this is the impression i got of what happened to these guys.. They were two caregivers (i didnt hear anything about others) working from the same location. They were in seperate locked rooms. There were 146 plants reported by the police. Im wondering if some of those plants were actually cuttings. The local police went there and insisted on an inspection. The two caregivers knowing they were in complete compliance with mi mm laws let them come in. The Locals then left but went right to the phone and called the DEA. Thats how the dea found them.

HERE IS THE LESSON FOLKS.. even if you are in complete compliance with the Mi MM act.. Dont let the jerks in your house or grow.. They are not out to help you or be your friend.. they only want to bust you.

 

Two different location .. One of which they counted two over. So they arrest two people from two different locations and call it a single grow ..

 

The locals figure they won't be able to do anything with it. So being ticked off about our new law, they get their revenge by calling the feds ..

 

And next a lot of people here at the Michigan Medical Marijuana Association assume guilt until proven innocent.

 

THINK PEOPLE!!

 

You've been watching to many cop shows. The media spends a lot of time to convince us that the cops always get the right person. That if someone is arrested for something they must be guilty.

 

That courts are always honest and just .. We know better!!

[brbud]

Michigan has bigger problems than California concerning medical marijuana. Every Republican politician would like to make a name for themselves by railing on the MMMa. The Republicans will control the state government at all levels for, at least, the next 2 years. Expect the court of appeals and supreme court to rule against medical marijuana cases. The law is doomed.

 

In May of this year, I will be moving back to my home state of California. In California the laws have been tested in court and police have been sued for violating the protections. Michigan is a long way from that.

 

Thank You for Your Honesty

 

I believe many have come from out of state.

I respect your acknowledging your homestate.

 

We Michiganders welcome out of staters but not to exploit us. Not directed at you.

 

Thank You Sincerely for Speaking Truth

 

As far as the Law is doomed...you underestimate the tenacity of the Wolverine State

[brbud]

The rules say a patient or a caregiver not the patient or the caregiver

 

LOL I dont think that will fly...maybe in cali...not here in Michigan

 

How long you been living in Michigan?

[brbud]

1 plant over is illegal

1 gram over is illegal

transporting cross state lines is illegal

selling BS Weed will not be tolerated

 

Stay Legal Support Michigan

[peanutbutter]

Michigan has bigger problems than California concerning medical marijuana. Every Republican politician would like to make a name for themselves by railing on the MMMa. The Republicans will control the state government at all levels for, at least, the next 2 years. Expect the court of appeals and supreme court to rule against medical marijuana cases. The law is doomed.

 

In May of this year, I will be moving back to my home state of California. In California the laws have been tested in court and police have been sued for violating the protections. Michigan is a long way from that.

 

OK .. lets put an end to this.

 

I arranged a survey to be conducted. I have never asked for funding for this study from the people at MMMA. Even so, I'll share the results:

 

• 
   
  Charmie;
   
  Here is a forward of the results of the survey conducted by Marketing
  Resource Group, Inc. out of Lansing.
   
  I hope that others will send you additional comments that you may be able to
  use for the press release.
   
  There has been an assumption by both sides of the medical marijuana debate
  in Michigan. That assumption is that after the new law went into place,
  there was a fall in support by Michigan voters.
   
  Mmj supporters feared that "bad behavior" on the part of some has damaged
  the reputation of the new law to the point the majority of voters no longer
  supported the community.
   
  Mmj opponents perceived a victory in the election last fall. They too
  believe voter support for our new law had fallen below the 50% mark. This
  has emboldened some political leaders to begin to attempt to trim back the
  freedoms given to us by the voters as much as possible. This action would
  require a 75% majority in both houses of Michigan legislature. If public
  approval has fallen enough, it might be possible to repeal the entire law.
   
  Such is the hope of those against using marijuana as a medicine in Michigan.
   
  A new survey has shown that this hope is a false hope. The fears of the
  medical marijuana community have been unwarranted.
   
  The simple fact is that if the election were held today, more that 60% of
  Michigan voters would still vote in favor of our law.
   
  For all of it's warts and wrinkles, bad press, dispensaries, raids, court
  cases, televised law enforcement announcements and all of the efforts by
  those against the ability of people to use this natural medicine.
   
  In spite of it all, the opinion of Michigan voters has barely budged.
   
  

 

From: "Paul King" <paulk@mrgmi.com>

To: "peanutbutter" <xxxxx@sbcglobal.net>

Sent: Friday, January 28, 2011 2:29 PM

Subject: January Michigan Statewide Poll - Medical Marijuana: Aggregate

Results

 

 

PB: we finished the statewide poll last night. I¹ve attached the

aggregate results. It doesn't look to me like support for the medical

marijuana law has waned much, if at all, since it was approved by voters.

These results are nearly the same as the election results of 2008.

 

I¹ll send you cross tabs either later today or first thing Monday.

 

Let me know if you have any questions or concerns.

 

Thanks again,

-pk

0111MIPOLLMEDMARTABB01.pdf

0111MIPOLLMEDMARTABB02.pdf

0111MIPOLLMEDMARTABB03.pdf

0111MIPOLLSMedMarAGGS.pdf

[Croppled1]

1 plant over is illegal

1 gram over is illegal

transporting cross state lines is illegal

selling BS Weed will not be tolerated

 

Stay Legal Support Michigan

 

Sad when our officers can no longer use discreation in the field not even to deterimine what they want to confiscate under forfeiture ( they take everything ) . I have had seeds fall off plants and one die that put me over the plant count or weight limit ( am i supposed to lie about this like a criminal ) . I had to learn how to try to manage all this - its not the program its the enforcement that is unmanageable . . I have no problems destroying the overage yet there is a period where your not in compliance as well as health in many situations creates periods where your short of your medicinal needs or not able to check on things minute by minute . Of course our medical system also denies access to conventional medications after they find out your on the program . Shame on people for how they are reacting on both sides to this . Never was any different when using FDA meds either all argueing and no help for the patient - any problems are swept under the rug jus as " drug abuse " without any regard to the imperfect path patients travel and teeter on between death and positive benefit . No programs of comfort to detox the dependant patients they are left to struggle alone or diverted to ones that do not work often injuring the patient both physically and mentally then abandon them .

Pretty much all regulation stands in the way of accessing comfort and healing along with the accompanying discrimination the sick face in society ...after all in the minds of the healthy you have to be doing something wrong to be sick and or unsuccessful in life . If that wasn't true it could happen to them and we all know how much we cost " them " .

 

Two plants over that could be two branches that tore off according to what they do now . The films of court proceedings so far have shown them for what they are and how they are and the miscariage of justice that is occuring . It is only now that I understand how it would be wrong to even aknowledge Rick Jones his policies and leglislation are so full of bigotry , ignornace , hatered and discrimination towards the fulfillment of accomplishing postive medicinal goals here in Michigan . I finally get it but someone needs to talk to him and help him out . How could any Christain put these penaties on their fellow humans who are seeking and often receiving medicianl benefit . Benefit that would be immense if the persecution was eneded so people could just make their medibles and gather in postive forced groups healing , with market forces weeding out the groups that do not promote postive outcomes and inclusion .

[+Annnie]

OK .. lets put an end to this.

 

I arranged a survey to be conducted. I have never asked for funding for this study from the people at MMMA. Even so, I'll share the results:

 

• 
   
  Charmie;
   
  Here is a forward of the results of the survey conducted by Marketing
  Resource Group, Inc. out of Lansing.
   
  I hope that others will send you additional comments that you may be able to
  use for the press release.
   
  There has been an assumption by both sides of the medical marijuana debate
  in Michigan. That assumption is that after the new law went into place,
  there was a fall in support by Michigan voters.
   
  Mmj supporters feared that "bad behavior" on the part of some has damaged
  the reputation of the new law to the point the majority of voters no longer
  supported the community.
   
  Mmj opponents perceived a victory in the election last fall. They too
  believe voter support for our new law had fallen below the 50% mark. This
  has emboldened some political leaders to begin to attempt to trim back the
  freedoms given to us by the voters as much as possible. This action would
  require a 75% majority in both houses of Michigan legislature. If public
  approval has fallen enough, it might be possible to repeal the entire law.
   
  Such is the hope of those against using marijuana as a medicine in Michigan.
   
  A new survey has shown that this hope is a false hope. The fears of the
  medical marijuana community have been unwarranted.
   
  The simple fact is that if the election were held today, more that 60% of
  Michigan voters would still vote in favor of our law.
   
  For all of it's warts and wrinkles, bad press, dispensaries, raids, court
  cases, televised law enforcement announcements and all of the efforts by
  those against the ability of people to use this natural medicine.
   
  In spite of it all, the opinion of Michigan voters has barely budged.
   
  

Thanks for sharing this pb.. I have been saying all along that i dont believe the support has waned.. In fact lets put legalize on the ballot and watch the voters come rushing out of the woodwork..

[brbud]

Thanks for sharing this pb.. I have been saying all along that i dont believe the support has waned.. In fact lets put legalize on the ballot and watch the voters come rushing out of the woodwork..

 

Right On

 

waned.....another republican propaganda angle

 

Support for MMP is Growing

 

there are many new growers here in MI and actually most indications of councils is that they are open minded at least, skeptical but open minded

Be POLITE...Do Not Shout at these representatives. Peace

Things will get better after we rid the state of carpetbaggers and the like

 

Stay Legal Support Michigan

[foxman711]

LOL I dont think that will fly...maybe in cali...not here in Michigan

 

How long you been living in Michigan?

I've been in Michigan since January of 1989, 22 years. This is not a tiny technicality. The rule use the indefinite article "A", not the definite article "THE". It is not reasonable to say that another caregiver cannot tend your grow in the event of your being sick or otherwise incapacitated or if you need to be out of town for other business or family emergency.

[brbud]

I've been in Michigan since January of 1989, 22 years. This is not a tiny technicality. The rule use the indefinite article "A", not the definite article "THE". It is not reasonable to say that another caregiver cannot tend your grow in the event of your being sick or otherwise incapacitated or if you need to be out of town for other business or family emergency.

 

Not gonna fly...almost laughable

 

you'll see

[greenbuddha]

Until there is change at the 'FEDERAL' level of government, local LEO and the DEA can and 'will' continue to knock on the door no matter 'what' the plant count might be, and no matter 'who' might be in charge of the 'grow'.

 

'LEGALIZE' it and let the federal government deal with 'that'.

 

 

 

[foxman711]

Not gonna fly...almost laughable

 

you'll see

You do not argue your point. You just say that you are right and I'm wrong. The law is all about language. Either offer an argument supported by something, or be quiet.

[Bisharoo]

More threats from cops or those who side with them and against individual human rights? How do you sleep at night? Don't you see what you are doing is helping destroy the lives of sick and dying humans who have harmed no others? That is OK for you? Wow!

I will send thoughts your way that your heart may soften to allow for compassion and love and to rid yourself of the hatred you have for your brothers and sisters here. Please contemplate very seriously your long-term damage you are doing to yourself by these actions.

We welcome a change of heart from you and your friends and colleagues.