Jump to content

Informal Seminar At The Wayne County Circuit Court

Recommended Posts

There was an informal seminar at the wayne County Circuit Court, put on by Judge Kenny. Here are some notes passed on to me.


Speaker: Ms. Clarkston – manager of MDCH


She went over the basics—not a lot I didn’t know/we haven’t heard before.

She was very careful not to give legal advice or interpret the law, but instead would state what the law says and where the gray areas/lack of clarity it. She also said that these areas are up for the legal community to help decide as cases come up.


Some points I wrote down:


1. The law decriminalizes mj for med uses; it does not legalize it


2. Federal gov’t has stated no conflict with state’s law; the DEA will stand back as long as patients/cgs are within strict compliance


3. still schedule 1 narcotic


4. the MDCH DOES do a background check on every caregiver


5. she went through the definitions section


6. There was a question someone asked about a CG having a felony for selling LEGAL drugs such as vicodin

a. Answer: depends on what the judgment says


7. Medical use definition

a. It’s really really inclusive—covers large spectrum, including “internal possession”


8. Growing: Enclosed locked facility


9. people allowed in the grow room:

a. A patient and A caregiver – doesn’t say THE patient or THE caregiver


10. Having more than one cg in one location

a. Above applies –A cg and A patient are allowed in grow room

b. However, cg is only allowed to possess a certain amount of plants; so if they are in a grow room with 100 plants with 3 cgs total, they may be around more plants than they are allowed to possess


11. She made it clear that the MDCH has no idea where a cg is growing


12. List of conditions that qualify a patient

a. Patient protected by definition for the acquisition of meds

b. Condition includes: treatment of the condition


13. Doctor:

a. Bona fide relationship and completes a full assessment and in the dr.’s opinion pt qualifies

b. Solely offering an opinion that mj MAY help


14. Shiawassee county- Dist Court case

a. Enclosed locked facility = can have plants all over the house

b. Home owner is deemed “security”

c. Being appealed


15. Seedlings and clones = not plants


16. No card = seller of mj can be protected


17. Dispensaries

a. Word is not mentioned anywhere in the act

b. As long as local communities are ok with it and all of the zoning/ordinances are met, as well as any LLC/Non-profit registration


18. Cost of meds

a. She said she advises “good business practices”


19. MDCH

a. They get 300-350 applications/day

b. In April 2009 they got 1500 apps that month

c. NOW, as of April 2010, they get 1500/week

d. 3 staff members working there

e. Said they are 3-3 ½ months behind

f. Takes 3-4 months to actually process the cards


20. Section 4 of statute

a. Cg – “to whom a person is connected”

b. A person = not a registered person

c. Or for assisting a patient = med use, acquisition

d. Protected if within presence or vicinity


21. If patient dies, what does CG do with plants

a. She had no answer

b. Cg must notify state that patient dies, with notarized signature and death certificate


22. Case that came out today = OWID

a. THC does not constitute influence

b. State of MI v. George Evans Feezel 138031 (unpublished?)


23. Smoke vs. Possess in public

a. Can’t smoke on a bus, but can possess, etc

b. Doesn’t mention universities as far as restrictions go

Link to comment
Share on other sites





Star Reporting; And, Very Worthy News it is.


Now, THAT's what we're talkin' about, eh?!


Did I mention "OUTSTANDING"?


Way to Advocate for the Cause!



Link to comment
Share on other sites

The only point that was not known to me comes at #15.


Seedlings and clones = not plants So, at what point to these things become plants? I had heard that if there are roots, then it is a plant. A seeding will always have roots. Most, if not all clones I've seen have roots. (I guess when first cut, they do not). Again, when do these things become plants?


BTW - PEOPLE OF THE STATE OF MICHIGAN V GEORGE EVAN FEEZEL can be found here: http://courts.michigan.gov/supremecourt/Clerk/10-09/138031/138031-Opinion.pdf

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This is all very interesting and timely. Ironincally, I have a court date downtown involving child custody and MMM. My ex tring to use my MMM status against me in court. Does anyone have any exp with these types of cases?




No personal experience here but make sure the court referee see the part in the law covering this.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This is all very interesting and timely. Ironincally, I have a court date downtown involving child custody and MMM. My ex tring to use my MMM status against me in court. Does anyone have any exp with these types of cases?



I posted the LAW in your topic about this. You shall be denied any right or privilege for using cannabis, and unless your creating a unsafe environment for your kids, then you shall not be denied custody... Check out the topic you posted for the actual law...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I was at this presentation and her comments were not as clear cut as the summary would suggest.


The presentation was for prosecutors, judges and lawyers. For some background I am none of the above and was just invited to tag along with a friend who is a public defender. I would have liked to have asked a question or two, but with at least 15 prosecutors in the room and a judge sitting next to me that could pass for Bill O'Rilley's brother (just rolled his eyes and shook his head at most of Celeste's comments) I was not really comfortable identifying myself as a patient.


My main purpose in attending was to see what sort of questions and interest this sort of audience had regarding the law. Unfortunately they really did not ask any questions or make any statements to Celeste that gave me a read on their attitude about the medical marijuana.


For example, Celeste mentioned that a seller (non-caregiver), selling to a registered patient, could be protected under the law. This did not really elicit any discussion.


She hit on the issue of a dispensary. She made a simple statement that the MMP law does not address them and that it is up to local cities and counties to make their own rules. To me with all the discussions one sees about p-p and c-c transfers it would be impossible for the MMP laws/rules to not affect whether opening a dispensary is legal or not. She did not bring up any of these issues and regrettably there were no real questions from the prosecutors or judges on this.


She presented the 20 days and you are legal idea concept while at the same time showing a slide that seemed to conflict with her statement. No one questioned her. Very odd. In this instance she spoke about the the backlog and the 20 day thing but the slide showed that they are prevented from giving leo any info other than verifying a card registry #. Left me wanting to ask how leo confirms that your paperwork is real if her office can't tell him. Latter it was very reassuring that my cynical friend from the public defenders office suggested that it was not a problem. They would just put you in jail while your lawyer and leo worked out verifying your paperwork.


The one overriding theme of her presentation was that the law was fraught with ambiguities. While I was aware of many, one I missed was "usable material". I just assumed that the 2.5 ounces per patient was a fairly clearcut objective #. She however pointed out that there has been no wording regarding medibles. For example what happens when you take an ounce of that of the 25 and make it into a pound of brownies. Do you now have over 16 ounces of "usable material".


Another issue was access to the grow area. This was in relation to discussing the concept of a collective. She pointed out that access is not limited to the primary caregiver or patient as is commonly assumed. She illustrated this by pointing out that the law uses the description "a caregiver" when describing access as opposed to using more limiting phrase.. "the caregiver".

Link to comment
Share on other sites


This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Create New...