Grafting Experiment Underway

[Tommy217xxx]

From what I can tell, the graft looks ok. I wont be able to tell if its gonna make it until I either remove the wrapping or I see new growth. I left 1 little set of leave on the cutting. I'll prob remove the wrapping on sunday and inspect the graft. I'm still plannin on doin another graft on sunday.

 

I called mark at H2o and talked to him for a few min about the whole grafting process. He said the beeswax should be good enough to seal the wrapping. I'm gonna look locally for some plant seal b/c he's on the other side of the state. He said he would mail me some if I couldn't find any. Mark is a super knowledgeable and nice guy. Gonna take a road trip when I'm ready for my light upgrade.

[Hempcheff]

ace hardware on vandyke in shelby twp/utica has the sealer , (i asked about the wax), id call up there just to make sure its the same stuff. also, after more research, it seems the linseed oil and the tallow in the recipe keeps the wax from cracking, the charcoal blocks light, and the resin acts mainly as an adhesive hope that helps a little, if you have a problem with the sealer, although i imagine its similiar to the wax, but more like tar.

[Tommy217xxx]

Ok, I removed the wrapping today and dice again. The stem was very shriveled and dry. The good news is the beeswax proved to be a good sealant. I'm still doing research on grafting other plants. and I'm still attempting another graft on sunday. I'm possibly thinking about a side veneer graft and a approach graft.

 

More to come.

[Mememe]

maybe try a T-Bud graft with wax. Secrets of Plant Propogation says grafts can take some time and look dead for a month before they perk up.

[kruztydj]

From what I can tell, the graft looks ok. I wont be able to tell if its gonna make it until I either remove the wrapping or I see new growth. I left 1 little set of leave on the cutting. I'll prob remove the wrapping on sunday and inspect the graft. I'm still plannin on doin another graft on sunday.

 

I called mark at H2o and talked to him for a few min about the whole grafting process. He said the beeswax should be good enough to seal the wrapping. I'm gonna look locally for some plant seal b/c he's on the other side of the state. He said he would mail me some if I couldn't find any. Mark is a super knowledgeable and nice guy. Gonna take a road trip when I'm ready for my light upgrade.

 

 

Yep Mark will help ya best he can. That wound seal reminds me of elmers glue. I figured he'd mail ya some if ya need it as both Mark and his wife Terry are great folks. They let us hold our club meetings in there grow store untill we out grew the place so I knew he'd be your best bet for help.Be some of the nicest folks you'll ever meet.....

[Tommy217xxx]

OK, so tomorrow I'm planning on trimming to top of my donor plant. Its getting to tall some I'm gonna cut it down probably the top 3 or 4 nodes off. So it looks like i'll have 3 or 4 graft options tomorrow.

 

My plan is to top the aurora indica and then graft the cuttings onto my Ice plant. I'm gonna do at least 3 grafts then put the host plant right into the greenhouse. I'm thinking of leaving the plant in the greenhouse for at least 2 weeks. Does my fish tank greenhouse sound good enough or should I work something else out?

 

I hope to start the grafting early b/c I'm goin to the ren fest around noon. They have some bad donkey glass pieces cheap. I'll update in the morning.

[Grow Thread]

OK, so tomorrow I'm planning on trimming to top of my donor plant. Its getting to tall some I'm gonna cut it down probably the top 3 or 4 nodes off. So it looks like i'll have 3 or 4 graft options tomorrow.

 

My plan is to top the aurora indica and then graft the cuttings onto my Ice plant. I'm gonna do at least 3 grafts then put the host plant right into the greenhouse. I'm thinking of leaving the plant in the greenhouse for at least 2 weeks. Does my fish tank greenhouse sound good enough or should I work something else out?

 

I hope to start the grafting early b/c I'm goin to the ren fest around noon. They have some bad donkey glass pieces cheap. I'll update in the morning.

 

did i misunderstand, or are you going to be taking cuttings from the top of a plant in veg and attempt to graft them to another plant?

 

the hormones in the lower branches are more apt for rooting/making clones. top branches can be very difficult to get to root normally...... so im sure a graft would be 10x harder.

 

maybe i read it wrong, maybe you already knew this, but i thought i'd add just in case i wanna see this work for you.

[Tommy217xxx]

did i misunderstand, or are you going to be taking cuttings from the top of a plant in veg and attempt to graft them to another plant?

 

the hormones in the lower branches are more apt for rooting/making clones. top branches can be very difficult to get to root normally...... so im sure a graft would be 10x harder.

 

maybe i read it wrong, maybe you already knew this, but i thought i'd add just in case i wanna see this work for you.

 

I agree with taking lower branches for cloning but if you think about it, a plant will heal it self any where. My thinking is that the upper branches are still in the newest growth phase/development of its life so it might be easier to graft upper branches. I'm gonna have at least 3 extra branches and im almost over my plant count so i'll attempt to graft them on to my main mother plant. I hope at least one of these grafts take.

 

I'm gonna graft at least 3 branches in a little while. I'm also goin to use rubber bands to hold the graft together. The rubber bands will stretch as the plant grows and i should be able to leave it on for a while without it hurting the plant.

 

Keep our figures crossed. I hope by doing several grafts at least one will work.

[Tommy217xxx]

Ok, I did 3 grafts today. 2 aurora indica to ice and 1 ice to aurora indica. I have a bunch on pics but I dont have time to post all of them right now. Here are a few. The pic of the scion floating in water was the piece that I did a veneer graft with.

 

These pics show all the layers of the plant pretty well.

 

Will post more later.

[Tommy217xxx]

This is totally off topic but I just got back from the ren fest and I got this bad boy. It was a little pricey but I know where it came from. Its not like one of those gas station pipes.

 

 

I'll add more pics of the graft in a few hours.

[Tommy217xxx]

OK, Back to the topic.

 

This is the aurora indica that I wanted to trim and keep small. I made the cut somewhere around the line. I had prob like 4 or 5 good cuttings to choose from. I used 2 of the cuttings to graft and the rest were used to practice making the cuts right.

 

This plant is Ice from nirvana. I did a side veneer gift here. I took a piece of the main stem that I cut from the aurora indica. The stem piece that attempted to use was probably an inch long with 1 little branch coming off. The pic of the plant in the water was the one that I used for this graft.

 

 

This next pic is also a side veneer graft but I did the graft on a branch instead of the main stem. This was the second graft on the ice plant.

 

This is the plant all grafted up.

 

This set of pics is of the Aurora indica that I grafted a Ice cutting to. With all of my grafts I tried I picked a location on the host plant that was close to the same size or just a little larger then the cutting/scion. This cutting is kinda hard to see. Its the little green bush just above the rubber bands.

 

I used rubber bands to hold all of the grafts together. My plan is to leave the plants in my fish tank greenhouse for like 2 weeks. I want to make sure the cutting and host stay nice and moist until they heal. I'm not sure if 2 weeks is to long or not. I'm gonna keep the tank sealed for a few days then crack the lid a little to let fresh air in a dry it out a little.

 

I had a little problem with the greenhouse but I think I figured it out. My plants were getting burnt when I put them in the tank. At first I thought it was the glass magnifying the light causing the burn but after thinking about it for a while I think its actually the water droplets magnifying the light. A flat piece of glass doesn't magnify light but the concave water droplets will. Does this sound even remotely right?

 

I'm gonna edit the pic of the branch in water with photoshop later. I'm gonna add lines and titles of the plant layers so anyone else attempting to graft can know what to look for. Well at least as I see it.

[Tommy217xxx]

I did a little photoshop editing on these pics. I'm not sure if I'm 100% right on some of the labels. Please let me know if I'm wrong. I hope this helps anyone attempting this grafting process.

[1337Gr33n]

Thanks a ton for the breakdown, TOmmy. Very cool!

[T1420]

Yeah, if he was trying to ROOT the cutting then yes, but he is looking for vigor. It maybe more difficult using rooting techniques, since grafting tissue together is big in the tree/ornamental world I'd bet harder tissue is key. I'd say dip the cutting in superthrive for vitamins and hormones, then seal'r with the wax. I believe grafting wax contains a acid that "ETCHs" the tissue, creating holes in the tissue cloth creating tunnels for the tissue to merge. Then USE WILT PROOF it will stop your cutting from transpiring.You got me interested in this... I got a friend who was talking about this 8 months ago and blew him off, And he has a degree in botany and horticulture. I WILL call him and talk about the procedures used. You will get it...Just keep tryin

did i misunderstand, or are you going to be taking cuttings from the top of a plant in veg and attempt to graft them to another plant?

 

the hormones in the lower branches are more apt for rooting/making clones. top branches can be very difficult to get to root normally...... so im sure a graft would be 10x harder.

 

maybe i read it wrong, maybe you already knew this, but i thought i'd add just in case i wanna see this work for you.

[Tommy217xxx]

Yeah, if he was trying to ROOT the cutting then yes, but he is looking for vigor. It maybe more difficult using rooting techniques, since grafting tissue together is big in the tree/ornamental world I'd bet harder tissue is key. I'd say dip the cutting in superthrive for vitamins and hormones, then seal'r with the wax. I believe grafting wax contains a acid that "ETCHs" the tissue, creating holes in the tissue cloth creating tunnels for the tissue to merge. Then USE WILT PROOF it will stop your cutting from transpiring.You got me interested in this... I got a friend who was talking about this 8 months ago and blew him off, And he has a degree in botany and horticulture. I WILL call him and talk about the procedures used. You will get it...Just keep tryin

 

If you find out any info from your friend then please post it. While I was editing the pic with photoshop I started to think that the cuts I'm making on the host plant are not deep enough. If I cant get any of these grafts to take then I'm gonna work on making my cuts just a little deeper. I might not be getting to the cambrium on the host stem.

 

I think harder or older tissue may be the key also. It was alot easier to see the individual layers with the larger main stem as apposed to small, less developed scions.

[Tommy217xxx]

So far everything looks good but I've said that before. For some reason everything looks/feels better about this attempt. They have been in my fish tank greenhouse for 3 days. I'm gonna leave them in there until at least sunday.

 

I'll post more in the next few days.

[Tommy217xxx]

Ok, I checked on the grafts this morning and 2 out 3 looked like (I can't convey a point without vulgarities). The 2 branch grafts were saggy and dieing. The veneer graft on the ice plant still looks really good. The branch looks like it did in the first day but that doesn't mean anything yet. I'm really starting to question if I'm making the cuts on the host plant deep enough. I'm probably gonna let these ones do there thing but I'm still planing another graft this sunday.

[Tommy217xxx]

OK, So today is day 6 into graft attempt 3,4 and 5. The ice cutting/scion to aurora indica host defanitly is not gonna make it. The cutting is saggy and limp and pretty much dead. We also attempted to graft 2 aurora indica cuttings to a ice host plant. I did a side veneer graft and from what I can tell everything looks pretty good with that one.

 

These first 3 pics are of the side veneer graft on the stem about 20 min ago. It looks pretty healthy so far.

 

These next 2 pics are of the branch graft. It also looks pretty healthy and green. also takin 20 min ago.

 

This next pic was from last sunday when I did the graft just so everyone can see where the grafts are located at.

 

The plant has been in my fish tank greenhouse for about 6 days now. I'm gonna go nice and slow with her now b/c both of the grafts are looking good but we have been down this road before. I'll update more later.

[Rob420]

Good pics and fantastic log!

[Mememe]

have you tried side a veneer graft using 2 live plants? Worst case, they don't graft... but they wouldn't die either.

[freakydawg420]

have you tried side a veneer graft using 2 live plants? Worst case, they don't graft... but they wouldn't die either.

 

 

meme, I think you are talking about this....

 

2.2.7 Approach-grafting or inarching

http://www.fao.org/inpho/content/documents/vlibrary/ac306e/ac306e03.htm

 

They talk about doing it with cashews. It makes for an interesting read, and the same theory should work for our plants you would think??

[tricloud]

Thing is ya dont want to root the cutting , but make it GRAFT to the host. Ya dont want root hormones. Seal them up and let them rip. Read up on tree grafting as it's about the same......... It can be done but breading is way better

 

Yep, toss the Clonex.......................

[Mememe]

meme, I think you are talking about this....

 

2.2.7 Approach-grafting or inarching

http://www.fao.org/inpho/content/documents/vlibrary/ac306e/ac306e03.htm

 

They talk about doing it with cashews. It makes for an interesting read, and the same theory should work for our plants you would think??

 

Yes, approach grafting, thank you. Has to work, it already has roach in the name:)

[Tommy217xxx]

OK, I had to move all my mothers into a grow box that I made so I could start flowering the other half of my plants. Both of the branch grafts failed. The veneer graft that I did on the stem looks ok but I'm not holding my breath. I'm gonna give my plants a few weeks to heal and start growing again before I attempt another graft.

 

I'll keep everyone posted on the veneer/stem graft.

[Tiptoe'n]

hey had an idea ...dont know if it would work and i havent the space to try . so here is a diagram of what i had in mind.