What Type Of Access Do Patients Want?

[purple pimpernel]

 

 

And when an individual rents a storage shed at you neighborhood storage facility, and stores the boat that they told their insurance company is at the bottom of Saginaw Bay in order to collect a fraudulent claim, the storage facility cannot be shut down, as long as the owner cannot be shown to have knowledge of the circumstance.

 

 

Where can I find that please?

 

 

Grand Blanc attorney offering alternative business plan to keep medical marijuana dispensaries open in Burton, Flint

 

By Roberto Acosta | racosta1@mlive.com

on February 23, 2013 at 9:00 AM, updated February 23, 2013 at 11:32 AM

View full size A Grand Blanc-based attorney has proposed a new business model for medical marijuana dispensaries in Burton and Flint to remain open. MLive.com File Photo  

GENESEE COUNTY, MI – Burton officials have approved a proposal from a Grand Blanc-based attorney that could set the stage for medical marijuana dispensaries to remain open in Genesee County following a recent state Supreme Court ruling regulating the way they operate.

 

Attorney Bruce Leach has proposed to cities, including Flint, a method of operating dispensaries that he says would not violate the "McQueen ruling," which prohibits patient-to-patient transfers of marijuana. But his proposal has met with some skepticism due to its complexity.

 

“We’ve devised a new structure of operation we feel will be able to legally protect them on the civil public nuisance and state level,” said Leach, legal counsel for Hemphill Wellness Center, located on Associates Drive that will remain open under a collective model he admitted will be “a bit of a logistical headache for them to adjust to this new structure.”

 

In a Friday, Feb. 22 letter from Burton City Attorney Rick Austin to Leach, Austin states “It is my opinion that this business plan is a viable plan in that it contemplates only transfers of marijuana and marijuana products between licensed caregivers and patients of those caregivers as contemplated by the Michigan Medical Marijuana Act.”

 

The collective model, which Leach said he came up with more than two years ago while in California to research medical marijuana law and businesses, would allow each caregiver to provide medical marijuana to their five patients through individual lockers at dispensaries. Each patient would then have the opportunity to be a caregiver and provide marijuana for five other patients.

 

Leach called the decision by officials “a great victory for medical marijuana patient's rights and safe access in Michigan. We are proud to recognize the City of Burton as Michigan's leader in compassion and understanding. We can only hope that other local municipalities and their leaders will have the same vision, intelligence, and compassion and will follow Burton's example.”

 

The Barn dispensary on East Bristol Road, the first such facility to open in the city of Burton in 2011, closed its doors Feb. 8 following the high court’s ruling. Burton Alternative Medicine on Dort Highway had previously closed its doors, while Meme’s Green Dream on East Bristol Road -- which Leach also represented as legal counsel -- announced its closure earlier this week after receiving a letter from the city notifying it to end patient-to-patient transfers.

 

Leach said the difference between the private membership collective, operated as a network of dispensaries and what he called “retail dispensaries” is the retail outlets allowed for patient-to-patients transfers where individuals “could come in and trade on the spot.” That trading was deemed a public nuisance under the state’s Public Health Code in the Supreme Court ruling.

 

Under Leach's proposal, anyone hoping to join a collective would have to fill out a membership application, change of caregiver forms and attend a legal briefing on the collective model.

 

“We really believe, on behalf of Hemphill Wellness Center, that people need access. They’re having their legs cut off to access to safe medicine,” said Leach. He said in a Feb. 18 letter to Burton officials that closing dispensaries “Will force our local citizens, many of whom are legitimately, severely ill medical patients right back into the hand of local street dealers, gangs and thugs who pose the greatest risk of harm to our community for the past 10 years or more.”

 

Austin said Burton officials were not in a rush to close dispensaries, as they had been legally operating in the area until the recent Supreme Court ruling, but he has expressed some concern with Leach about the collective plan.

 

“As I have shared with you now on several occasions, while I find the plan to be theoretically compliant, I harbor concerns regarding the ability of the enterprise to operate in accordance with the plan on a daily–real life basis,” he said in the letter.

 

Police Chief Tom Osterholzer said during a recent legislative committee meeting that while he was skeptical about the business model being sustainable, there have been no issues with the dispensaries other than two instances where people tried to break in to take marijuana.

 

“I appreciate anyone digging and clawing to do what they can to stay in business,” said Councilman Danny Wells during a regularly scheduled council meeting this week when Leach provided a copy of his plan to administration officials.

 

Burton Mayor Paula Zelenko was a little doubtful the alternate plan would work, but she echoed others' sentiments that if the plan is legal, it would be considered to keep dispensaries open in the city.

 

“We haven’t had any problems with them. We had no problems with them,” she said. “I would like them to find a way to stay in business. I believe they serve a good purpose (for patients).”

 

Leach has also discussed his plan with officials in the city of Flint, where he acts as legal counsel for Michigan Organic Solutions on South Dort Highway and We Grow Education and Collective on Miller Road.

 

Flint City Attorney Peter Bade said Leach has met with legal representation to discuss the proposal for dispensaries. He said some action is expected to take place in the future by city officials.

 

“The city is very likely to adopt an ordinance that regulates it as well, so that will provide another level of control over dispensaries,” he said.

 

“The most important part of the ruling is that marijuana can only be sold by a caregiver to his or her patients. Caregivers are permitted to have five patients,” Bade said.

 

“(Dispensaries) have been providing to caregivers that were not their individual patients. McQueen made clear that they can’t do that.”

 

“It’s hard to evaluate a concept and see how it applies to McQueen,” he said in about the collective dispensary proposal. But, Bade said, “I think that there could be more than one caregiver at their facility. I don’t know anything in the law that there could only be one caregiver per facility.”

 

Bade noted attorneys for the city have talked with representatives from dispensaries operating within the city, and "I think they would say we are cooperative. We wanted to reach out to these folks."

 

Nick Panessidi, operator of Michigan Safe Transfer on Corunna Road in Flint, said he had not heard of the collective idea but would be open to any suggestions.

 

"We always want people have to safe access. If it comes to a network, I’m willing to work with the city and any municipality," he said. "They are listening to us more now than they were three years ago. They have more understanding of these (medical marijuana) laws."

 

The court ruling has changed the way the business operates, but Panessidi said it offers other services such as consulting and testing of medicinal marijuana, which has allowed it to adjust following the high court's ruling.

 

“Clearly, Michigan has a medical marijuana act that voters have approved in the state. Our effort isn’t to resist that," Bade said. “We just have to follow the law. That’s why we have a moratorium in place. The Supreme Court decision shows us how to clearly apply the law.”

 

Leach said “Despite repeated attacks by the Attorney General to narrow and shut down the Medical Marijuana program, the Supreme Court decision in McQueen provided us with a framework to operate completely within the bounds of the law and the protections of the MMMA.”

 

With a reported 8,231 registered medical marijuana patients in Genesee County in 2012, a 14 percent increase from 2011, Leach said a collective at Hemphill Wellness Center could have hundreds of patients seeking medication.

 

“No one wants to break the law, no one wants to go to jail here,” Leach said of dispensary owners. “We just want to do what’s legally allowed and in the best interest of our patients.”

[GregS]

Tenants who store cannabis might wish to engage in section 8 protections. Or not. If someone chooses to designate a boxholder as their caregiver, that would be a private matter. If the boxholder is ducky with the risk, that might be considered an option. I understand that as a possiblility, just as I understand that these boxes could be used to store stolen goods or bowling shoes..

Edited February 23, 2013 by GregS

[GregS]

Tenants who store cannabis might wish to engage in section 8 protections. Or not. If someone chooses to designate a boxholder as their caregiver, that would be a private matter. If the boxholder is ducky with the risk, that might be considered an option. I understand that as a possiblility, just as I understand that these boxes could be used to store stolen goods, gym togs, or your lunch.

 

Call me Sgt. Schultz.

Edited February 23, 2013 by GregS

[Restorium2]

And when an individual rents a storage shed at you neighborhood storage facility, and stores the boat that they told their insurance company is at the bottom of Saginaw Bay in order to collect a fraudulent claim, the storage facility cannot be shut down, as long as the owner cannot be shown to have knowledge of the circumstance.

If marijuana transfers is your game then you will be shut down whether they can make a case or not. Don't try to game with marijuana even if you think it might be legal. Law enforcement would probably think it's not legal and you are in no position to argue it with them.

[GregS]

Sounds like a lot of trouble. Why bother with the risks?

 

You only supply five patients, why not get safe deposit boxes and only you and the patient have keys?

 

A little discretion and some odor proof containers, no one need ever know. Plus, it's only $30 a year.

 

Sure. That is an option, and if done right a good one.

Edited February 23, 2013 by GregS

[Restorium2]

Call me Sgt. Schultz.

Your cell mate will call you that if you treat him good.

[pic book]

Some of the people have spoken and they chose Harborside Dispensary in Oakland as their model.

Meaning safe access.

Strain Access.

Profits from the $20 million in annual sales given back to the broader community.

Steve's is the biggest, but also the longest run dispensary in the world.

Regulated and taxed.

Accountable.

Weed is examined under a scope and lab-tested. Some meds offered by growers is rejected for mold, insects or their leavings, lack of potency, etc.

Harborside is not what every patient near Oakland, CA, chooses, but 100,000 patients a year do.

You asked 'what kind of access do patients want?' and the model in Oakland is one popular choice, with holistic healing offered; chiropractic, massage, education on growing, etc.

Edited February 23, 2013 by pic book

[Northern Lab]

 

 

NOT gonna happen.

 

What would be the harm in asking?

 

 

 

No. The intent is to provide private, secure storage space for rent.

 

Idk. I think declaring right up front that this is intended to facilitate secure, absentee transfers between a cg and their registered pt(s) would alleviate at least some suspicion.

[GregS]

What would be the harm in asking?

 

 

 

Idk. I think declaring right up front that this is intended to facilitate secure, absentee transfers between a cg and their registered pt(s) would alleviate at least some suspicion.

 

Prosecutors are people who do not need be told anything they do not need to know.

Edited February 23, 2013 by GregS

[GregS]

If marijuana transfers is your game then you will be shut down whether they can make a case or not. Don't try to game with marijuana even if you think it might be legal. Law enforcement would probably think it's not legal and you are in no position to argue it with them.

 

MJ xfers is not the game. Rather, it is storage rental and the game is to collect rents. MJ storage, which is not illegal, is only one of any number of things these would be used for.

[GregS]

Resto. Please forgive me, but I am unable to find your remarks that explain how I would be involved in breaking a chain of custody. Will you be so kind to point them out?

[GregS]

Revenue stream means you are making money off the transfers. You have just tripped into another realm of illegal activity.

 

Revenue stream means i am collecting rents and access fees. Nothing more.

Edited February 23, 2013 by GregS

[pic book]

So in atty LeBlanc's plan, distribution would ape the post office, with the diffs being:

(1) no one knows but 6 people what is actually being stored in the 'mail' box.

(2) no one has a key but the (renter) cg and his (up to 5) patients.

(3) $30 rental per box is the business' sole income.

(4) distribtion to patients is far more convenient for them but far less personal than a meeting.

What have I missed?

Edited February 23, 2013 by pic book

[GregS]

At $50/locker/month you'd have to get 60 people involved at the very least. 50 Pts and 10 CGs. Do you really think you can find that many people willing to pay $50/month, at minimum?

 

There are other services that can be provided at a cost, to include access fees and registration and copy services, And as I have said repeatedly, I see this as an ancillary revenue stream in any small business.

 

In operating a business it is necessary to let all the nickels and dimes pile up. And this is a business. The days of patients getting free cannabis are just about over. They will need to at least cover the cost to produce it, uness they have someone else, probably a close friend or family member, to cover that cost.

Edited February 23, 2013 by GregS

[GregS]

Posted Today, 02:12 PM

"So in atty LeBlanc's plan, distribution would ape the post office, with the diffs being:

(1) no one knows but 6 people what is actually being stored in the 'mail' box.

(2) no one has a key but the (renter) cg and his (up to 5) patients.

(3) $30 rental per box is the business' sole income.

(4) distribtion to patients is far more convenient for them but far less personal than a meeting.

What have I missed? "

 

That this is likely not a workable stand alone business. In operating a business it is necessary to let the nickels and dimes pile up from all revenue sources. What I suggest is, AGAIN, an ancillary or supplemental revenue stream for profit enhancement. If nothing more, it could drive traffic into your business, which may or may not have anything to do with cannabis. Then it is up to the management to offer value in terms of goods and services that may well have nothig to do with canabis. For instance, I am looking at an opportunity in an E-Cigarette store.

 

A private area that would permit pts and cgs or pts only could be considered. Along with a mainstay business that has nothing to do with that, it could make your business a destination.

Edited February 23, 2013 by GregS

[GregS]

3grbw

Edited February 23, 2013 by GregS

[+Malamute]

If someone does something stupid, like giving the combination or key to someone who is a non-qualified individiual to retrieve d0pe, if it is for an illegal transaction, the business owner, again has no knowledge, gives no consent, and has no criminal liability. What goes on with lessees and those they grant access to is between them, precisely as it is at your neighborhood storage facility.

 

In short, it is not my responsibility, and certainly not in my interest, to ride herd over what lessors and those who they permit access to do, except to assure that my property is not damaged..

 

What do you do with abandoned lockers that still have medicine in them(that ya don't about)? Someone besides the cg/pt have access and ownership to/of these lockers.

[GregS]

What do you do with abandoned lockers that still have medicine in them(that ya don't about)? Someone besides the cg/pt have access and ownership to/of these lockers.

 

The lock would be cut off if the renter fails to pay the rent. Any contents would be disposed of just as they are by your neighborhood storage unit owner. Found contraband has to be addressed under the law. What are those laws?

[GregS]

If, for instance the owner cuts the lock and finds the boat that was reported sunk by the tenant to connive a fraudulent insurance claim, there must be proper ways to handle it. The facility owner would be in potential trouble only if s/he were to convert it to an illegal use.

Edited February 23, 2013 by GregS

[GregS]

If it is cannabis, and I am a patient, I can legally convert an allowable amount to myself to treat my debilitating condition(s). Any more would have to be destroyed.

Edited February 23, 2013 by GregS

[pic book]

 

 

I do not necessarily see it that way. Everything stored would be under lock and key. ID may be necessary to determine, in the case of damage to my property, who had caused it, but it is not entirely necessary. A fee would be charged for access to the vault, all stored stuff would be locked down, and without access to the comb or a key, there is no way anyone could get into anyone's locker unauthorized, except to break in. As long as an individual were to lay out the fee to enter, and with sufficient securtity surveillance,,the system is reasonably secure. Business insurance would cover the cost of repair in the event of damage.No one would be able to get into a locker they have not been authorized access to by the lessee.

No human attendant necessary. Just like at unmanned athletic clubs that allow their members 24-hour use, members would be issued access cards to enter the secured post office and once in, use that same card to acess the locker. Just like ath clubs, the card would create an electronic record of who/when/entry/exit. Think hotel rooms.

 

Edited February 23, 2013 by pic book

[GregS]

Another point to mention is that pt/cg cards are not necessary, or even wanted, as ID. State photo ID is enough.

[Restorium2]

Another point to mention is that pt/cg cards are not necessary, or even wanted, as ID. State photo ID is enough.

Why even have id or locks? Why not just hangs some socks on the wall?

[GregS]

Because you would be too excited to sleep.

 

What is your point? On the surface it is another of your childish remarks. Please prove me wrong.

 

Where are your remarks about how I would be involved in breaking a chain of custody?

Edited February 23, 2013 by GregS

[GregS]

And damage deposits would be required.