Erratic Ph In Dwc And Misc. Question.

[rustyjams]

1)Hey boy's and girl's, I'm new here and I already have a few questions. I'll start off by telling you that this is my FIRST hydro grow and I'm about 20 seconds away from going back to soil. Maybe someone can tell me what I'm doing wrong?  So last week I started my 6 bucket DWC system and it started downhill from day 1. Here are some details... I'm using the same basic set up as everyone else I've seen using DWC, 5 gal bucket, net pot lid, hydroton, air pumps, etc. Anyway my ph is seriously gimped up. When I started, I used 2 day old tap water that measured 6.8ph, I then added (Jungle Juice-not ph friendly) 8ml micro, 8ml grow, 8ml bloom per 5 gallons water. I let that sit for about an hour with the air pump running and re-checked the ph for an adjust. The ph was 7.5 so I lowered it accordingly to 5.9 ph. Sounds good right? Not so fast, I checked it the next morning and ph had jumped to 9.7. So I re-adjusted it down to 5.8. Checked it the next morning and it jumped to 7.4, so again, I re-adjusted to 5.8. I've already used at least 25ml of ph down on 1 bucket. Please tell me this isn't normal, if it is, back to dirt I go. I can't afford the nutrients let alone gallons of ph adjust. What am I doing wrong?

 

Solution I started with..

6.8ph  tap water

630 ppm (for seedlings)

67 degrees

 

2)Seedling question. Here are 2 of 6 Fem Aurora seedlings and there is a few problems. The first problem is that these bad girls are growing VERY slow. The second problem is yellowing of the bottom leaves(all of them are doing this). I'm using a 6500k full spectrum light and I am not over watering. If anything I'm under watering. Maybe I'm letting the soil get to dry? I water every 3 days or as needed and each seedling cup gets 30ml of R.O. water(no nutes).

 

Picture 1.jpg

The bottom leaves(1 and 3) are totally yellow with leave #2 following right behind 

 

Picture 2.jpg

Notice the yellowing with brown spots?

 

Sorry about the book but any help would be much appreciated

                                                       Thanks, Rusty

Edited April 14, 2013 by rustyjams

[Highlander]

What kind of pH meter are you using, and when did you last calibrate it?

[Dlo]

 

 

If it was 6.8 to start then you added nutes, it then went to 7.5 in 1hour.

Its not normal. Good luck

[Dlo]

Nutes should make Ph drop.

Edited April 15, 2013 by Dlo

[rustyjams]

What kind of pH meter are you using, and when did you last calibrate it?

A cheap pos from ebay. It's say's it comes pre calibrated so I haven't had to re-cal yet. When I first got it a few weeks ago I tested it with ro water that the manufacture say's is 6.5 and the meter was dead nuts.

[rustyjams]

If it was 6.8 to start then you added nutes, it then went to 7.5 in 1hour.

Its not normal. Good luck

I got it back within the correct parameters again but I have to ask, will fluctuation in water temp effect ph?  

[rustyjams]

Nutes should make Ph drop.

That's what I was told my friend. I was so dumbfounded I started thinking maybe it was something to do with the bucket itself. Maybe chemicals leeching into the water or something. But I made sure I washed them out well before use so I seriously doubt that's the problem.

[Dlo]

If your new to hydro, try lucas method. No guessing. Works for your soil too.JMO

[rustyjams]

Yes Dlo, I'm a total noob so my apologies for the bombardment of questions. I've done some research on this "Lucas Method" and I like the idea. I'll try Lucas if it eliminates some of the guesswork. Especially since I'm just starting. I will switch to this method when I change out my water tomorrow.

[Dlo]

Youll need to know how to calibrate that pen if your doing hydro. Good to learn as much as you can about you equipment. JMO

[LongHairBri]

I get the POS meters from ebay too, exact same one you pictured. only I get 6 at a time. seems its been a good idea to get 2 or 3 extra of the cheap meters lying around so I have something to check them against when I suspect there's a problem.

 

before use, I always measure straight tap water first. if it's not 7 and change, I know that pen is garbage. another note, ALL pH pens are meant for the glass bulb on the tip to be kept moist. there's a sponge inside the cap your supposed to moisten with every use.

 

also, you had to adjust the pH down?? I have never even bought pH up before. any time my pH is off, it's always low and needs the blue liquid to raise it to target (5.8) 

 

ProTek can raise the pH, but it's always back to normal the next day. you shouldn't be having big swings or need to lower pH....EVER.

 

when my pH begins to fluctuate I change the rez and all is well for another 2-3 months

[Hydraulic Jack]

Buy a Blue Lab ph meter and be done with it...I've had mine for years....The only problems I've had with it is when I get clumsy and break the probe.....They have new PH pens out that are pretty reasonable... http://www.getbluelab.com/shop/Bluelab+pH+Pen.html

HJ

[thecannabiskid]

I got it back within the correct parameters again but I have to ask, will fluctuation in water temp effect ph?  

YES! good meters have automatic temperature compensation.

[phaquetoo]

If it was 6.8 to start then you added nutes, it then went to 7.5 in 1hour.

Its not normal. Good luck

well first off dont use the full recipee of nutes, only use like a1/3 to start, than get your self a res so you can let your mixed with nutes ph'd water let sit for at least a wk, checking the ph every day, mine jumps all around for at least 5 days, mine comes out at like 7, but ive had it go upto 8 and down to 5 before ive used it! so get your self an air stone and a bubbler and at least a 35 to 55 gallon res and check it every day,

 

as far as your lil clones, id only be spraying ph'd water on them for a lil while, no nutes! I like my ph at 6.5

 

Peace

Jim

[phaquetoo]

That's what I was told my friend. I was so dumbfounded I started thinking maybe it was something to do with the bucket itself. Maybe chemicals leeching into the water or something. But I made sure I washed them out well before use so I seriously doubt that's the problem.

 

That is one of the reasons I went back to dirt, dwc made me think to much, but soon I hope to give it a try again, there are alot of people on here who are having great grows in dwc, it made my head hurt lol, so i went to promix and quit following the nute recipee, they want you to use to much, I use 1/3 of the recipee when i start and than bump it up as I need to, Ive never used more than half the nute recipee and im doing a whole lot better now, GH nutes here!

 

Peace

Jim

[rustyjams]

Thanks to all that replied. I learned useful tid-bits from all of you!! Everything is fine now. It WAS the Ph meter itself. I feel like a silly billy bumping my head against the wall for something so trivial.  My next J I'm dedicating to you dude's. Later I will start a thread and post some pics at various stages as they come. Thanks again!! 

 

Oh, BTW Hydro Jack, I just ordered your linked Bluelab Ph Pen from Amazon. I was reading some reviews and everyone like's this pen. Supposed to be here by Friday!

 

 

[Darkmatter]

yeah that pH meter you pictured is useless. everyone I know that uses it has the same problem

[Hydraulic Jack]

You will love the Blue Lab pen...It holds calibration and their customer service ROCKS!    HJ

[rustyjams]

yeah that pH meter you pictured is useless. everyone I know that uses it has the same problem

Yep, I thought I'd I try to save a few bucks and in the long run it ended up costing me money. It's in the trash.

[rustyjams]

Exactly what I'm looking for H.J.

Edited April 16, 2013 by rustyjams

[Highlander]

In hydro you might consider a meter instead of a pen.  I have found the TriMeter to be very reliable to monitor pH, ppm and temps.  With constant readouts, it is easy to make the needed adjustments to keep things on track.

[rustyjams]

Yo Highlander and others, sorry dudes, I forgot to mention that I'm on a fixed income so I'm looking to do this hydro as cheap as possible. As it stands right now, if my set up doesn't work I am out over $400 in equipment cost's that took me well over a year to save up(not including the $80 bluelab meter I just purchased). I can't just go out and buy an item needed without saving up. I have done over a years worth of research on this hydro thing and through my studies nobody ever said it was so costly. With the cost of supplies/equipment/electricity I'm failing to see the cost effectiveness in growing your own. This is NOT a hobby for me and I'm doing it for my own medicinal purposes. With the money I've spent(so far) I could have purchased enough marijuana to last me an entire year. I'll keep experimenting with what I have albeit inexpensive "junk" and see what happens(I could NEVER do this with hi end equipment-can't afford). If I fail it's either back to buying my own weed or back to debilitating pills(that almost killed me from withdrawl when I stopped using them). Or better yet, I can quit all of it and live in pain for the rest of my day's. The part that hurt's me the most about this IS NOT THE MONEY, I could care less about that. It's the year's worth of wasted time doing research/studies that upset's me. And evidently a year wasn't enough. All I can really say is, THANK GOD IT'S SPRING!!!!! I'm patiently waiting on ground temp to reach desired needs. Out of all the stuff I've bought to date I think the $1.99 meat thermometer(from the dollar store) I'm using to monitor outdoor soil temp was the best investment I've made so far.

 

 

PEACE

Edited April 17, 2013 by rustyjams

[Highlander]

I feel for ya Rusty.  It is hard to get good advice sometimes.  I tell anyone looking to get into DWC is that it isn't cost-effective on the small scale.  And it hard to do when you're on a budget.  Come July when your water temps are in the 80s and you're pulling out your hair and your plants due to root slime rot, you'll either have to pony up $400 for a chiller or spend $5/day on ice.  And ice isn't a very effective solution either. 

 

When I grew in dirt on a smaller scale, I'd add red vinegar to my city water (comes from Detroit).  I think it was about a tablespoon per gallon.  I rarely checked pH after that.  Also, rainwater is right about 5.7, so that's another way to get around buying a pH meter.  But don't assume melted snow will have the proper pH; it is usually in the 8s.

[phaquetoo]

please tell me where i can get enough mm for the yr for 400 bucks, I will quit to, im tired of being a baby sitter lol!

 

Peace

Jim

[Herb Cannabis]

In nature, gravity causes the fruit (seeds) to drop to the ground in the fall of the year.  Next spring when temps and moisture are just right, they emerge for the next cycle.  What I am telling you is that you can plant your seeds now and according to Jorge Cervantes, a seeds sex can be influence by light, temp and water.  You will find this information on page 20 of his book Marijuana Horticulture.  I have had seeds sprout from an overwinter many times.  In order for you to influence your seeds to become female, they require 14 hours bright blue light, cooler temps and a wet soil with high nitrogen content.  Back in 2010 I had 26 of the volunteers, all but 4 of them were female.  Last year I had 6 volunteers and all were female.  You will need to keep your seedlings in the above conditions until the 3rd set of true leaves form. 

 

Good luck to you and your medicine making.