Need Help Staying Legal

[Croppled1]

If it is dry it counts, curing means nothing to LEO. Reduce your plant volume and your weight. Oil is the best way. Start reducing everything until you are compliant. Plan on everything (someone else commented on this) being counted against your legal limit. Scale your grow back. Figure out how much you actually need for a month and work backwards ie 2.5oz/patient. How many plants do you need to harvest to produce that amount figuring in your average yield per plant.

 

Many of us are disabled and dehabillitated not even cooking food normally the enforcement has to be realistic and change . The problem is we can't grow a non interupted supply now scaling back is no answer . Get rid of the weight limits beyond what is reasonable for ones plant count . At least allow a few pounds so people can take grow breaks because right now 3/5 grows being inspected are resulting in a arrest and many are good people just trying to use cannabis for their private medical needs . Growing does not equal selling like our Law not only assumes but allows LEO to convict for sales someone that never sold anything .They require no proof but your growing plants this is what has happened while nobody would dare speak against stricter drug laws . Michigan laws are very oppresive and now they have a new target who can't afford lawyers and defend themselves qualified medical patients .

 

And don't anyone worry about the weight limits allowing cartels or gangs to prosper every Drug Unit in Michigan reports to a Federal Officer and I am sure they would pick up the big cases that should be prosecuted .

Edited May 13, 2012 by Croppled1

[Reaper]

I mark everything as "uncured". Yeah, it probly won't hold up in court and LEO doesn't follow the law anyway, but what has held up in court...nothing!!!

[Celliach]

A lot of people ask me if a just harvested plants counts since it's neither a plant nor "usable marihuana." I always answer that by the time you get to court that plant will be dry.

[Highlander]

A lot of people ask me if a just harvested plants counts since it's neither a plant nor "usable marihuana." I always answer that by the time you get to court that plant will be dry.

 

I have been asked that question many times too. Many people assume that since wet MJ isn't included in the definition of "usable" that it is unregulated and simply doesn't count. My answer is to read the protections:

 

Sec. 4. (a) A qualifying patient who has been issued and possesses a registry identification card shall not be subject to arrest, prosecution, or penalty in any manner, or denied any right or privilege, including but not limited to civil penalty or disciplinary action by a business or occupational or professional licensing board or bureau, for the medical use of marihuana in accordance with this act, provided that the qualifying patient possesses an amount of marihuana that does not exceed 2.5 ounces of usable marihuana, and, if the qualifying patient has not specified that a primary caregiver will be allowed under state law to cultivate marihuana for the qualifying patient, 12 marihuana plants kept in an enclosed, locked facility. Any incidental amount of seeds, stalks, and unusable roots shall also be allowed under state law and shall not be included in this amount.

 

If you have 12 plants growing, and 2.5 oz dry and some wet marijuana laying around, you have an amount of marijuana that exceeds 2.5oz of usable and 12 plants.

[Fat Freddy]

Make arrangements with Blueberry and cut back on plant count. There was some talk about only one caregiver being allowed to grow at a given location.

Best to play it safe.

also the cannabis cancer project is always accepting donated material to make oil with for cancer patients.

you want to get your numbers down, the best advice given so far was "don't grow so much." second best was to reduce it down into hash or oil of some type.

 

not saying you did, but your story sounds similar to the stories of others i know. they made grow set ups for large amounts, thinking they were going to get rich at dispensaries. then the dispensaries fell through (i have been saying they weren't legal for a couple years now). we have been like a pack of dogs on some things, egging each other forward inch by inch, talking ourselves into thinking we're covered when we are out of our own yard. regardless, the dispensaries fell through; nothing you can do about it at this point.

 

you can-

1. not grow so much

2. reduce down to hash/oil/etc

3. hit up the farmers markets

4. help out some friends in need (with cards, of course)

5. bring someone else on as a patient

 

i'm sure there are other things, as well. the easiest would be to not grow so much, if you want to stay totally compliant.

 

i would advise against effing with leo, unless you want to be the next test case for mmj. don't try the, "but officer it's not fully cured" routine, because they won't give a fudge. just like they won't give a fudge if you are over on your plant count. they don't care if it's ready or not. for example, they take the whole plant, weigh it and there is your weight. they have no clue what is what.

[hecticdad]

leaving the roots on the plants while drying makes the marijuana count as a plant towards your total count. Also while this site is an excellent resource, I would recommend retaining/ seeking the advice of a good marijuana lawyer..... That can save you a lot of headaches and speculation.

[Croppled1]

A lot of people ask me if a just harvested plants counts since it's neither a plant nor "usable marihuana." I always answer that by the time you get to court that plant will be dry.

 

By this explanation every plant you have will be " dry " in court . How can you then ever be legal ? In no scenario would a patient ever be legal under State law if this is how the act is enforced and interpreted The only way to harvest without fear of a misunderstanding leading to arrest is to pick buds as needed which forces one to use over and under ripened plus improperly cured cannabis . The act was written broadly to protect all patients and allow a medical defense for all cases of medical use that a card section 4 situation wouldn't cover but it isn't being recognized that way by opponants . Opponants that disproportionally control positions in the Courts and Law Enforcement .

 

So many of the seriously dehabillitated and qualified patients are on dependent medications with horrendous withdrawl profiles . Just like some can die from a beesting they can die from interputions in their normal medical routines as short as a few hours . It has occured already but the heart attacks , breathing problems and strokes are not attributed to their care in the jail system but previous drug use .Patients need much more protection from arbitrary subjective arrests absent many proved sales transactions outside the community for profit . I believe all aspects of medical use need a legal means to carry them out but often patients need to consider risk while we fight for fair and safe treatment . Just as law enforcement charged with protecting all in the publics saftey has to reflect on how they can injure and even kill patients by their actions .

 

Lets hope the normal election year arrests pushed by those with a political agenda take into account patients vulnerabillity Lets not forget all the great people in Law Enforcement and Government that are allowing Farmers Markets and Dispensaries to operate at their own risk under State and Federal Enforcement Policies . Who treat patients and caregivers with respect and tolerance . That run orginizations like Law Enforcement Officers Against Prohibtion ( LEAP ) . Sadly regulators always want total control and too regulate thats another situation we will have to be flexible . Maybe at some point patients and caregivers will have to use special currency to track farmers market exchanges like has been done eslewhere but really can't be done until that Medical Cannabis Billl passes the National House , Senate and is signed by the President . When I vote knowing if a President would sign that bill will make a difference .

Edited May 16, 2012 by Croppled1

[Croppled1]

leaving the roots on the plants while drying makes the marijuana count as a plant towards your total count. Also while this site is an excellent resource, I would recommend retaining/ seeking the advice of a good marijuana lawyer..... That can save you a lot of headaches and speculation.

 

Single patient grows are very problematic because of the point where the plant is dry and you have to weigh it for the first time .You need to remove and weigh it which some sick cannot do immediately in one sitting Plus many are having difficulty working with whole plants due to size etc .There has to be a more reasonable way and I believe that would be only to allow weight limits to apply to transportation . That does not mean I am trying to avoid complaince just that there are points in the process now where you literly cannot be legal and one has no idea what a wet plant will weigh when dry with the stems , stalk and roots removed .We are entitled to a non interupted supply and many have had issues that is the number one complaint of patients . The point about leaving the roots on makes sense but should arrest depend on such technical interpretation when people in weakened condition can die from the stress of it ?

Edited May 16, 2012 by Croppled1

[bobandtorey]

That does not mean I am trying to avoid complaince just that there are points in the process now where you literly cannot be legal

good point

we all are illegal if you can't tell the jury you have a mmj card i think people should understand that a card won't help any one in court

[Ms Chocolate]

An easy solution to staying legal; reduce the size of your grow operation.

[boroboro]

leaving the roots on the plants while drying makes the marijuana count as a plant towards your total count.......

 

Anybody have much experience with this? I've typically either trimmed fresh or hung rootless plants upside down for drying. I was already planning to try drying the entire plants with roots for the next harvest. Since they're in 5 gallon coco pots they'll probably need to dry right-side-up / root side down, but I haven't dried that way before.

 

Our attempt at a legal harvest involves a few people, preferably three: One cutting and trimming buds and two people processing scraps, trim, popcorn buds into ice-water hash. I know fresh warm buds are less desireable than frozen, but this way you can't catch us with more than the legal limit off the plant at any one time (unless you count buds in ice water as 'usable', and I suppose that's not beneath the boys in blue).

Edited May 16, 2012 by boroboro

[pic book]

some folks have Thanksgiving peacock, while commoners have Thanksgiving turkey. The turkey is $20, the peacock $600.

[pic book]

There was some talk about only one caregiver being allowed to grow at a given location.

And some of the 'talk' was the decision by the Federal judge who heard the Duvall case 4/20/12. Two CG's growing on the same address or parcel gets one of them 5 years while the other goes free. Which CG will you be?

Edited May 17, 2012 by pic book

[Mememe]

What about leaving alot of stalk?

Edited May 18, 2012 by Mememe

[Croppled1]

That does not mean I am trying to avoid complaince just that there are points in the process now where you literly cannot be legal

good point

we all are illegal if you can't tell the jury you have a mmj card i think people should understand that a card won't help any one in court

 

Bob if that bill would help you by guaranteeing you could use your card in court remind me which one it is and I willl write my reps supporting at least that part of the language . Who would think we could not tell juries the truth in a Court . This is what we need to get in the media . We need someone to get on local talk shows in the mainstream media before the election . Now is the time for our side .to appeal to a sense of fair play and instil a interest in the public . A few extremists on both sides are causing all this pain and suffering for everyone .

 

The problem is if they wouldn't recognize it before ( the legislative rules in court whey would they now its still just legislative rules ) the Judicial branch is seperate and run by the Judges .

Edited May 17, 2012 by Croppled1

[Murph]

Listen all,

 

this above is a really bad discussion topic for a public forum. Especially for said grower - we know LEO monitors these boards - and admitting to having amounts in excess of what is legally allowed is not wise. Everyone should be availing themselves of the patient/caregiver model 1patient and Caregiver, to another 5 patients and caregivers. And never should anyone exceed 49 (or at most 99) plants as that triggers Fed. Sent. mandatory min. -- everyone needs to be safe and somewhat paranoid in the Michigan MM community.

 

Having or admitting to having over Section 4 "amounts" (if that is the Section you rely upon to grow legally under) is not wise. Discussions of "cards" is presumed to be the Sect. 4 Registry Cards ...so posting admissions to having over such amounts is not wise and could be dangerous -- a tad bit of common sense is best exercised here.

 

Avatars offer little protection ("they don't know who I am,or where") -- yeah right, most people can be located by their IP address....further refinement is simple --- so use TOR or other randomization proxy to at least confuse the issue---https://www.torproje...vidalia.html.en

 

Actually it is best to use most every protection you can online -- as many do not even run antivirus and firewalls --- which is like leaving your door open and unlocked (on your computer) all the time ! Updating the antivirus and firewall patches daily. same with TOR< or better yet, use VPN -- www.hidemyass.com - common sense people, common sense.

 

Others online cannot show you their card here so we rely on anonomous communication -- but it is not anon at ALL !! Please be safe. Qualify all admissions......

 

Sect. 8 allows amounts in excess of Sect. 4 if needed to ensure regular constant medically needed supply(e.g that in excess of Section 4 limits) - but I am unsure (and doubt) one could go under both sections (although it is an interesting issue). Using the "dispensary model -- um, although it is doubtful much resources are directed at this, it could cause some serious issues.

 

Just trying to make sure everyone is safe as posting here is voluntary --- and not needed really --- talk to your buddies if you need advise.

Meet and chat with growers at events where you can see them -- contact growers offline or by phone. Best yet, many grow forums exist for help with grows -- indeed 1000s...

 

NEVER ever, ever, admit to something -- remaining silent is a Constitutionally protected right.

 

I want to and enjoy these discussions as much as anyone --- perhaps it is better to qualify EVERYTHING, or otherwise note it is a hypothetical -- "A friend has or says", or "Hypothetically, I harvest 25 Oz a month"

IT IS MUCH SAFER !

 

The ONLY reason I can see for posting such things as above is (1) an attempt to drum up "business" or (2) "brag" -- both foolhardy in today's environment and not really needed. I am not saying anyone did so, or posted such with that intent, so do not flame me -- just pointing out the obvious.

 

M

Edited May 17, 2012 by Murph

[Murph]

Bob if that bill would help you by guaranteeing you could use your card in court remind me which one it is and I willl write my reps supporting at least that part of the language . Who would think we could not tell juries the truth in a Court . This is what we need to get in the media . We need someone to get on local talk shows in the mainstream media before the election . Now is the time for our side .to appeal to a sense of fair play and instil a interest in the public . A few extremists on both sides are causing all this pain and suffering for everyone .

 

The problem is if they wouldn't recognize it before ( the legislative rules in court whey would they now its still just legislative rules ) the Judicial branch is seperate and run by the Judges .

 

Best way to use medical marijuana defense in court is plaster everything to do with it with the words "MEDICAL MARIJUANA" -- then if they attempt to introduce anything, it says medical marijuana on it --- tampering with evidence to "remove" the "medical marijuana stickers/posts/warnings --- would be evidence tampering -- everything to a grow or MM should say plastered all over it the words "MEDICAL MARIJUANA"

 

(I even see people putting it on fan leaves with light blocking tape excessive but neat to see) -- I am even starting selling stickers, stencils, and postings for this purpose...

 

if everything you have says "MEDICAL MARIJUANA" on it, -- from lights, pots, fans, nutes, bottles, jars -- frickin EVERYTHING ----- then it would be pretty hard to keep that from a jury, would it not?

 

M

Edited May 17, 2012 by Murph