Koon Decision Killed Mmj For Now. Demand And Prices In Freefall

[peanutbutter]

Leaving all the errors from doctors trying to be lawyers intact .. nice ..

[CaveatLector]

Leaving all the errors from doctors trying to be lawyers intact .. nice ..

As opposed to peanutbutter trying to be a doctor, lawyer, and chemist!

[CaveatLector]

(d) Synthetic equivalents of the substances contained in the plant, or in the resinous extractives of cannabis and synthetic substances, derivatives, and their isomers with similar chemical structure or pharmacological activity, or both, such as the following, are included in schedule 1:

(i) /\1 cis or trans tetrahydrocannabinol, and their optical isomers.

(ii) /\6 cis or trans tetrahydrocannabinol, and their optical isomers.

(iii) /\3,4, cis or trans tetrahydrocannabinol, and their optical isomers.

(e) Compounds of structures of substances referred to in subdivision (d), regardless of numerical designation of atomic positions, are included.

(f) Gamma-hydroxybutyrate and any isomer, salt, or salt of isomer of gamma-hydroxybutyrate.

 

Some trade and other names: Sodium oxybate 4-hydroxybutanoic acid monosodium salt

 

 

 

Like I said, I'm not a chemist so I don't know what the above references include but it seems to me that synthetic thc within marinol is included. In which case that would mean you cannot drive with marinol in you. So stop recommending people get a marinol script. If the above includes marinol thc then recommending marinol as a "mask" is going to harm those who rely on that advice thinking that they are 100% safe.

[peanutbutter]

(d) Synthetic equivalents of the substances contained in the plant, or in the resinous extractives of cannabis and synthetic substances, derivatives, and their isomers with similar chemical structure or pharmacological activity, or both, such as the following, are included in schedule 1:

(i) /\1 cis or trans tetrahydrocannabinol, and their optical isomers.

(ii) /\6 cis or trans tetrahydrocannabinol, and their optical isomers.

(iii) /\3,4, cis or trans tetrahydrocannabinol, and their optical isomers.

(e) Compounds of structures of substances referred to in subdivision (d), regardless of numerical designation of atomic positions, are included.

(f) Gamma-hydroxybutyrate and any isomer, salt, or salt of isomer of gamma-hydroxybutyrate.

 

Some trade and other names: Sodium oxybate 4-hydroxybutanoic acid monosodium salt

 

 

 

Like I said, I'm not a chemist so I don't know what the above references include but it seems to me that synthetic thc within marinol is included. In which case that would mean you cannot drive with marinol in you. So stop recommending people get a marinol script. If the above includes marinol thc then recommending marinol as a "mask" is going to harm those who rely on that advice thinking that they are 100% safe.

 

No one has tried to answer my question.

 

Some here might actually be qualified to answer.

 

Instead of an answer, I am told I'm a bad person for asking and I need to stop asking .. got it.

[peanutbutter]

Why do people here insist that Marinol is schedule one?

 

Why spread that false information?

[CaveatLector]

No one has tried to answer my question.

 

Some here might actually be qualified to answer.

 

Instead of an answer, I am told I'm a bad person for asking and I need to stop asking .. got it.

Why don't you stop being so disingenuous. No one said stop asking a question---people are saying stop recommending absurd tactics to attempt to mask thc. Especially since you have no clue that it will work or if, in fact, it will actually backfire and cause more harm than good.

 

What is it you are failing to comprehend in that concept outlined above?

[CaveatLector]

Why do people here insist that Marinol is schedule one?

 

Why spread that false information?

Do me a favor and cut and paste where someone said marinol is schedule 1.

[peanutbutter]

(d) Synthetic equivalents of the substances contained in the plant, or in the resinous extractives of cannabis and synthetic substances, derivatives, and their isomers with similar chemical structure or pharmacological activity, or both, such as the following, are included in schedule 1:

(i) /\1 cis or trans tetrahydrocannabinol, and their optical isomers.

(ii) /\6 cis or trans tetrahydrocannabinol, and their optical isomers.

(iii) /\3,4, cis or trans tetrahydrocannabinol, and their optical isomers.

(e) Compounds of structures of substances referred to in subdivision (d), regardless of numerical designation of atomic positions, are included.

(f) Gamma-hydroxybutyrate and any isomer, salt, or salt of isomer of gamma-hydroxybutyrate.

 

Some trade and other names: Sodium oxybate 4-hydroxybutanoic acid monosodium salt

 

 

 

Like I said, I'm not a chemist so I don't know what the above references include but it seems to me that synthetic thc within marinol is included. In which case that would mean you cannot drive with marinol in you. So stop recommending people get a marinol script. If the above includes marinol thc then recommending marinol as a "mask" is going to harm those who rely on that advice thinking that they are 100% safe.

 

This is the THC section of schedule one.

 

Here is the THC section of schedule 3: Dronabinol (synthetic) in sesame oil and encapsulated in a soft gelatin capsule in a U.S. Food and Drug Administration approved product 7369 [some other names for dronabinol: (6aR-trans)-6a,7,8,10a-tetrahydro-6,6,9-trimethyl-3-pentyl-6H-dibenzo [b,d]pyran-1-ol] or (-)-delta-9-(trans)-tetrahydrocannabinol]

[peanutbutter]

Let's put out a more specific question:

 

Does Michigans zero tolerance driving law apply to Merinol?

[CaveatLector]

This is the THC section of schedule one.

 

Here is the THC section of schedule 3: Dronabinol (synthetic) in sesame oil and encapsulated in a soft gelatin capsule in a U.S. Food and Drug Administration approved product 7369 [some other names for dronabinol: (6aR-trans)-6a,7,8,10a-tetrahydro-6,6,9-trimethyl-3-pentyl-6H-dibenzo [b,d]pyran-1-ol] or (-)-delta-9-(trans)-tetrahydrocannabinol]

 

That's exactly right. Marinol is synthetic thc, is it not? Synthetic thc is listed as a schedule 1 drug under the law. The law further states:

 

(8) A person, whether licensed or not, shall not operate a vehicle upon a highway or other place open to the general public or generally accessible to motor vehicles, including an area designated for the parking of vehicles, within this state if the person has in his or her body any amount of a controlled substance listed in schedule 1 under section 7212 of the public health code, 1978 PA 368, MCL 333.7212, or a rule promulgated under that section, or of a controlled substance described in section 7214(a)(iv) of the public health code, 1978 PA 368, MCL 333.7214

 

Ergo, since synthetic thc is listed in schedule one then you cannot drive with it in your system. Period. End of story.

 

However, as I said I am not a chemist so the question becomes whether the synthetic thc in marinol is the same thc listed in schedule 1. It sure seems like it so my answer is YES unless you can prove otherwise. But you cannot prove otherwise which is why you need to stop with your absurd assertion that a marinol script is a magic bullet.

[peanutbutter]

That's exactly right. Marinol is synthetic thc, is it not? Synthetic thc is listed as a schedule 1 drug under the law. The law further states:

 

(8) A person, whether licensed or not, shall not operate a vehicle upon a highway or other place open to the general public or generally accessible to motor vehicles, including an area designated for the parking of vehicles, within this state if the person has in his or her body any amount of a controlled substance listed in schedule 1 under section 7212 of the public health code, 1978 PA 368, MCL 333.7212, or a rule promulgated under that section, or of a controlled substance described in section 7214(a)(iv) of the public health code, 1978 PA 368, MCL 333.7214

 

Ergo, since synthetic thc is listed in schedule one then you cannot drive with it in your system. Period. End of story.

 

However, as I said I am not a chemist so the question becomes whether the synthetic thc in marinol is the same thc listed in schedule 1. It sure seems like it so my answer is YES unless you can prove otherwise. But you cannot prove otherwise which is why you need to stop with your absurd assertion that a marinol script is a magic bullet.

 

LOL I just quoted you the federal law ..

 

Do you seriously think your word is better than quoting federal law?

 

Which judge is going to accept your word instead of federal law?

[peanutbutter]

"I think" isn't federal law and it isn't state law.

 

I quoted you the federal law.

 

Is Marinol a schedule 3 substance and does zero tolerance apply to it?

[CaveatLector]

"I think" isn't federal law and it isn't state law.

 

I quoted you the federal law.

 

Is Marinol a schedule 3 substance and does zero tolerance apply to it?

What the heck are you talking about? I just quoted you state law and that is what is controlling in regard to a state issue. I didn't say, "I think." So, again, stop making things up.

 

Scroll up. Synthetic thc is on Michigan's schedule 1 list. Ok, you get that now right? It is on the list and what I think has nothing to do with it. So, now, for your reading pleasure read more of Michigan state law below.

 

(8) A person, whether licensed or not, shall not operate a vehicle upon a highway or other place open to the general public or generally accessible to motor vehicles, including an area designated for the parking of vehicles, within this state if the person has in his or her body any amount of a controlled substance listed in schedule 1 under section 7212 of the public health code

 

Let me synthesize this for you one last time. Synthetic thc is on the schedule 1 list under section 7212 of the public health code. Okay, you still with me? Good!

 

Marinol is synthetic thc! Okay, I didn't lose you yet correct?

 

Ergo, under section (8) above you see that you cannot drive with synthetic thc in your system since it is listed in schedule 1 under 7212 of the Public Health Code. Federal law is not relevant here.

 

Okay, did it sink in this time?

[peanutbutter]

What the heck are you talking about? I just quoted you state law and that is what is controlling in regard to a state issue. I didn't say, "I think." So, again, stop making things up.

 

Scroll up. Synthetic thc is on Michigan's schedule 1 list. Ok, you get that now right? It is on the list and what I think has nothing to do with it. So, now, for your reading pleasure read more of Michigan state law below.

 

(8) A person, whether licensed or not, shall not operate a vehicle upon a highway or other place open to the general public or generally accessible to motor vehicles, including an area designated for the parking of vehicles, within this state if the person has in his or her body any amount of a controlled substance listed in schedule 1 under section 7212 of the public health code

 

Let me synthesize this for you one last time. Synthetic thc is on the schedule 1 list under section 7212 of the public health code. Okay, you still with me? Good!

 

Marinol is synthetic thc! Okay, I didn't lose you yet correct?

 

Ergo, under section (8) above you see that you cannot drive with synthetic thc in your system since it is listed in schedule 1 under 7212 of the Public Health Code. Federal law is not relevant here.

 

Okay, did it sink in this time?

 

LOL your logic is flawed.

 

Is this whole board insane enough to believe Marinol is a schedule 1 substance?

[peanutbutter]

If Marinol is schedule one no doctor can write a script for it ..

[CaveatLector]

LOL your logic is flawed.

 

Is this whole board insane enough to believe Marinol is a schedule 1 substance?

My logic is flawed? I didn't write the law. It's in black in white in the law stating that synthetic thc is schedule 1. Is there a reason you refuse to accept that? Can you read? Like I said before, show me your exception based in law that certain synthetic thc is not schedule 1. You saying it doesn't create an exception. So show me the exception. I'm not saying one doesn't exist I'm saying show me.

[+Malamute]

My uneducated guess is this,.. Michigan never revised their Schedules to concur with Federal law. As far as driving, it seems Michigan still considers any THC, natural or synthetic, to be a schedule 1 substance when it comes to driving.

[peanutbutter]

So your game is something like .. you can't link it good enough so I'm right?

 

Marinol is schedule one until I can prove otherwise?

 

What kind of legal BS impression does that leave?

[+Malamute]

It seems the Michigan laws have not been updated to reflect Marinol as schedule III.

 

Just saying.

 

I just read over all of them under Michigan law and they do not have marinol in schedule III at all.

 

But the real question is,... Why does thi smatter if you are a medical cannabis patient? You have cannabis in your system. Regardless.

 

This seems like another cockamamie scheme trying to prove pt/pt is legal or dispensaries are legal and all these other silly ideas that have spouted as fact in this forum previously.

 

Now is the idea worth discussing? Sure. But it has been shot down. Now you are simply arguing points that don't matter.

 

Next idea?

[+Malamute]

Honestly Mal, I can't think of any. Drawing blood is a pretty benign procedure. If it is court ordered, I really don't think that it can be prevented, unless you fight the techs and then you have a whole different set of problems, and when those are resolved they will still draw the blood.

 

Dr. Bob

 

Yea. I had looked long and hard. I thought there may be an exception for people that can't stop bleeding, but i havent found a buggerin thing.

[+Malamute]

R 338.3114 Schedule 1; tetrahydrocannabinols.

Rule 14. Synthetic equivalents of the substances contained in the plant or in the resinous extractives of

cannabis and synthetic substances, derivatives, and their isomers with similar chemical structure

or pharmacological activity, or both, such as the following, are included in schedule 1:

(a)Δ

1

cis or trans tetrahydrocannabinol and their optical isomers, excluding dronabinol in sesame

oil and encapsulated in a soft gelatin capsule in a drug product approved by the United States food

and drug administration.

(b)Δ

6

cis or trans tetrahydrocannabinol and their optical isomers.

©Δ

3,4

cis or trans tetrahydrocannabinol and their optical isomers.Since the nomenclature of these

substances is not internationally standardized, compounds of these structures, regardless of

numerical designation of atomic positions, are included. History: 1979 AC; 1986 AACS

 

Ahh cool. But it still doesnt help since you are using raw cannabis anyway.

 

May work once.

[CaveatLector]

My uneducated guess is this,.. Michigan never revised their Schedules to concur with Federal law. As far as driving, it seems Michigan still considers any THC, natural or synthetic, to be a schedule 1 substance when it comes to driving.

I concur.

[+Malamute]

Interesting.

 

Dronabinol is in Schedule 3 in the Administrative rules, but not the law.

 

Lazy buggers.

[+Malamute]

If you only had dronabinol in your system, i suspect you will have a chance to win and impairment must be proved.

 

This will only work one time likely and then every prosecutor in the state will make sure to test for other substances such as THCV when in question. It doesnt cost squat to test for THCV over THC. A few bucks and it is done.

 

I could be wrong. But if you were driving and ANY marijuana was found in the car,... kiss that good bye.

[CaveatLector]

So your game is something like .. you can't link it good enough so I'm right?

 

Marinol is schedule one until I can prove otherwise?

 

What kind of legal BS impression does that leave?

Cut and paste where anyone said Marinol is schedule 1! You can't because no one said it is so please make some sense here.

 

What was said was that synthetic thc is schedule 1. If you read the law you will see that. Your argument that marinol is schedule 3 has nothing to do with the price of tea in China. It is entirely possible that schedule 1 was left the way it is for reasons such as preventing someone from driving while on synthetic thc. Then maybe they scheduled marinol as 3 so it could be prescribed. Don't let your brain burst here, just consider that anomaly for a moment.

 

It is also entirely possible that synthetic thc remained schedule 1 because it was overlooked when marinol was scheduled. That doesn't change the fact that thc is schedule 1 in the law right now. What you are saying is that you'll say, "Your honor, I was taking marinol, which is schedule 3. I know that synthetic thc is schedule1 and I know that there is a separate law that says you cannot drive with schedule 1 listed drugs in your system but gosh darn it that ain't fair!" It's in the law chief. No driving on schedule 1 listed drugs.

 

Next, consider your bastardized logic. What you are accusing me of doing is exactly what you are doing. You are telling me that since marinol is schedule 3 that synthetic thc cannot be schedule 1. That is laughable because I can argue the reverse of that to you!

 

Still think it's safe to drive on marinol? You got the script you said. Turn yourself into the guinea pig. Pop a marinol and go tell a cop you took one and then drive away. If you're so sure of yourself that you are willing to suggest everyone do this then prove it to the community. Put up or shut up.