Statement From Cpu

[hofner67]

How do I know? Because I looked at who's in the state congress and how they normally vote on social issues. We need to get a better understanding of the big picture of how the state government works to get a better understanding of where these bills are going. The republican caucus has already amended the bills and made them worse....after the public hearings. All the republicans will vote along party lines and they're only a few votes short of a super-majority. Now add in the democratic black caucus.....they always vote against anything to do with drugs....period. Between the two groups there is a super majority.

 

The bills will probably pass.....unfortunately.

Probably in ur estimation. Instead it sounded more like for sure about that deluxe hamburger, when speaking to Tim.

[Celliach]

Probably in ur estimation. Instead it sounded more like for sure about that deluxe hamburger, when speaking to Tim.

I'm so sure that I'd be willing to bet you on it......and give you odds.

[Timmahh]

Timmah,

 

The burger shop is an interesting analogy but think about what you have seen so far in your visits to Lansing. The chef's in your Lansing burger shop believe they were hired by an owner(republican voters) that wants them to put out rancid burgers. They view you as a customer of the burger shop down the street. They do not view you as a customer or their boss.

 

Standing on the steps of the Capitol can be a bonding experience for the members of the community, but you have met these people (legislators) and seen them in action. Can you honestly say to others that a protest rally is the best way to stop the vote?

 

 

not at all Semi. but the way you close down a bad restaurant is not to keep going back and spending money, you get CannActive about them. You Boycott their business, you get your neighbors and family involved. and if their is no other restaurant down the street, which their isnt, then you are left 2 options

 

eat the bunny muffin, or clear it out. I vote for the later, and a protest every day is one way to help the end means.

[Celliach]

The problem with this restaurant in the analogy is that it isn't feeding tainted food to everyone.....just us. Everyone else is feeling satisfied with their meal, and a lot of those customers don't want us in the restaurant when they're eating there.

You do realize that your tactic is the same as Nancy Reagan's tactic for the War on Drugs don't you?

Just say no!

We all see how well that message is working to fix the illegal drug problem.

[hofner67]

I'm so sure that I'd be willing to bet you on it......and give you odds.

Ok oh Great Nostradamas, I would like two sets of odds and 2 predictions:

1.) Odds CPU will support at least one bill that amends the Act.

2.) Odds one or more of the bills amending the act get passed by both houses.

3.) Will Ford common stock hit 13.50 by the end of April?

4.) What will be the Michigan lottos daily 3 for Tuesday 4/10/2012?

[purklize]

You do realize that your tactic is the same as Nancy Reagan's tactic for the War on Drugs don't you?

 

Just say no!

We all see how well that message is working to fix the illegal drug problem.

 

This analogy doesn't make sense. When Nancy said "Just say no!" it was mindless conservative nonsense, like telling kids to never have sex, it doesn't work, you can't just change social norms by yelling. But "Just say no!" to prohibition is another matter entirely. It is a thought through position that could actually work, as it is in response to social POLICY not social NORMS.

[purklize]

Does someone have a list of ALL bills that are going to be voted on this session?

 

Should we all be scrambling to renew before the rules change? Could it get harder for us to renew? Is our right to grow at risk from any of these bills? The anxiety of this is ruining day after day of my life and I would like to know that I'm not going to have to hack my precious plants apart and trash them. I am in Ann Arbor and we do have a mmj ordinance but I have been unable to find a clear answer as to whether the AAPD will respect it.

 

Has the affirmative defense ever worked for anyone? Will it be more or less likely to work if/when these bills pass?

[Celliach]

you can't just change social norms by yelling.

 

That's exactly my point!!!!!!

[GregS]

So what are we going to do over the next couple of weeks aside from arguing among ourselves?

 

I have a call into Richard Hammond's office. He is my rep and happens to be the Minority Leader of the Democratic Caucus.

 

What is anyone else doing that will work constructively??

[cristinew]

ALL bills that are going to be voted on this session?

 

there are 4 please read them, you will still be able to grow and see a dr and get your card,

[purklize]

Joe has been saying on rollitup.org that there will be "Distribution" bills of some sort voted on on the 18th, does anyone know more about this? This is why I asked about "all" bills. Is there really only going to be four voted on and nothing more before the election (end of the session)?

 

there are 4 please read them, you will still be able to grow and see a dr and get your card,

 

I did read them. It's dubious whether your statement there will hold true, IMO, depending on how the courts interpret the language. Given the CoA's behavior I don't feel too good about it.

 

That's exactly my point!!!!!!

 

I'm confused... social norms are not things like laws, they are what people do in their own private lives, reflected by social attitudes toward something... you can "just say no!" to fascism (policy) but you can't "just say no!" to drug use.

 

I will be breathing a deep sigh of relief when all this crap is over with, assuming we survive it.

[GregS]

The House is not in session this week. Legislators will be in their districts and will keep office hours to arrange to speak with their constituencies.

[GregS]

And the package of bills is up for debate on the House floor. Only afterward they may or may not pass them as is, with changes, or not at all. Point being that it is crunch time.

[SFC]

I am truly hoping Ford hits 13.50 I bought 500 @10.00. So I am all for #3. as far as CPU supporting the bills, we may agree to be neutral providing they accept ALL of our revisions. But I am fairly confident that is not going to happen. So we will be against. BTW, it is technically four bills but if you split the different parts of the bills up in reality it is about double that.

#2, I still put the odds at around 50%, but I do know there are some serious cracks between Dems, and Rep's that we must exploit. Today I started the day negative, but one little bird out there heard a positive that we already kinda knew.

 

GregS gave excellent advice. Try getting some individual facetime with the reps RIGHT NOW!!! Of course some will be out of state, but there is only one way to find out, Call!

 

And Hof, I do not thing you are BB, I said you have been fed the BS by him for two years.

 

Edit: One other thing the dispensary bill Dear Leader is harping about is supposed to go to committee on the 18th not to a vote.

[Hayduke]

So what are we going to do over the next couple of weeks aside from arguing among ourselves?

 

I have a call into Richard Hammond's office. He is my rep and happens to be the Minority Leader of the Democratic Caucus.

 

What is anyone else doing that will work constructively??

 

 

better get his name right, for one, lol...

 

 

Richard Hammel

[Timmahh]

Shoot Tim, I share that concern. And yes I am concerned the bills will be blasted through as fast as possible. One need only look at the additional language in 4834 especially, and 4856 specifically, and of course the omissions that look like they are not coming back to 4851. But sharing a protest put together by Mr. Cain would be an unmitigated disaster. CPU and 3MA are talking at the board level and we are all more than willing to compromise with the other group. In the end, post Mr. Cain, just like prior to Mr. Cain, CPU and 3MA have an awful lot in common. In fact all the groups share commonalities, but none so much at the two I mentioned.

 

I just don't feel a rally would have any impact at this moment in history. But you are right that throwing it after the House potentially passes the package is a bit like closing the door after the walls have caved in...

 

We need to influence the Dems to oppose the bills. We need to convince Rep Cavanagh he should stop his support of the package. I think his heart is in the right place. The question is can the cannabis contact with Rep Cavanagh convince him of this. Cross your fingers, let's try to be cautiously optimistic....

 

 

 

Trust me Heyduke, when I say Sharing a protest with Joe is not on my mind, nor what I am suggesting.

the fact is, the 17th was chosen about 6 weeks ago by Whitney Hickman (3MA member Cannamamma) and she posted about it on her Facebook Page. This was her call to walk on Lansing, and She put the initial work and time into it, I believe as a part of her Local Compassion Club, and her work locally in here district.

 

Joe heard about it (unfortunately likely inadvertently by me) and did what Joe does, and tried to take it over and make it the Joe Cain Show, just as he did with the Saginaw protest last fall, I initiated to bring attention not only the the MMM Act and its abuse by him (Bill Shcuette), but more importantly the fact these were closed door meetings being held by our state and local Government Employees.

 

So in all honesty, the 17th was never a thing Joe supported. ask the Mods that were around, he said for a a while it wasn't a good time to protest. I believe when he seen her FB Page, and the possibility there could of been more than a few thousand people, perhaps even more than last Sept. he tried to do what he does and capitalize on it, but just to trash it, which he basically succeeded in doing....

 

I dont believe for one second Joe was going to do anything but control the 17th for his own gain, as he did much of everything he was involved in. And his only goal was to maintain the fact Joe can put 7000 plus people on the states steps last September. I wasn't there for it, I was working, and still semi in the Cannacloset still.

 

But to see all the efforts that Ms Hickman put into it go down the drain due to Joe's bs, however intentional or not, and the loss of 3 weeks worth of work towards it, is kind of a kick in the jewels.

 

I don't support Joe's methods, and his lead was far under qualified or at least short sighted, but some of his words are not just rhetoric, but solid points that probably shouldn't be swept out with the rest of the old way of doing things.

 

Just saying, our Voice outside, even if in stagnated silence, is a strong position that should not be so easily dismissed as useless. 17th or any other day.

 

Those are MY opinions as a Member of any cannabis community, the political side of me being a Moderator, is as part of the Staff, the 3MA position is the Main Message and supporting that is going to be the game of the day.

 

Differentiating between the Member and the Moderator is the Political Paradox we can find our self in at times. And everyone does. it is part of the whole genie gig.

And as hard as it can be for us Staff, it can also be hard for other members and even staff to draw that distinction themselves.

[Timmahh]

The problem with this restaurant in the analogy is that it isn't feeding tainted food to everyone.....just us. Everyone else is feeling satisfied with their meal, and a lot of those customers don't want us in the restaurant when they're eating there.

You do realize that your tactic is the same as Nancy Reagan's tactic for the War on Drugs don't you? We all see how well that message is working to fix the illegal drug problem.

 

it's not just say no, it's just "say NOT THAT".

[Hayduke]

Trust me Heyduke, when I say Sharing a protest with Joe is not on my mind, nor what I am suggesting.

the fact is, the 17th was chosen about 6 weeks ago by Whitney Hickman (3MA member Cannamamma) and she posted about it on her Facebook Page. This was her call to walk on Lansing, and She put the initial work and time into it, I believe as a part of her Local Compassion Club, and her work locally in here district.

 

Joe heard about it (unfortunately likely inadvertently by me) and did what Joe does, and tried to take it over and make it the Joe Cain Show, just as he did with the Saginaw protest last fall, I initiated to bring attention not only the the MMM Act and its abuse by him (Bill Shcuette), but more importantly the fact these were closed door meetings being held by our state and local Government Employees.

 

So in all honesty, the 17th was never a thing Joe supported. ask the Mods that were around, he said for a a while it wasn't a good time to protest. I believe when he seen her FB Page, and the possibility there could of been more than a few thousand people, perhaps even more than last Sept. he tried to do what he does and capitalize on it, but just to trash it, which he basically succeeded in doing....

 

I dont believe for one second Joe was going to do anything but control the 17th for his own gain, as he did much of everything he was involved in. And his only goal was to maintain the fact Joe can put 7000 plus people on the states steps last September. I wasn't there for it, I was working, and still semi in the Cannacloset still.

 

But to see all the efforts that Ms Hickman put into it go down the drain due to Joe's bs, however intentional or not, and the loss of 3 weeks worth of work towards it, is kind of a kick in the jewels.

 

I don't support Joe's methods, and his lead was far under qualified or at least short sighted, but some of his words are not just rhetoric, but solid points that probably shouldn't be swept out with the rest of the old way of doing things.

 

Just saying, our Voice outside, even if in stagnated silence, is a strong position that should not be so easily dismissed as useless. 17th or any other day.

 

Those are MY opinions as a Member of any cannabis community, the political side of me being a Moderator, is as part of the Staff, the 3MA position is the Main Message and supporting that is going to be the game of the day.

 

Differentiating between the Member and the Moderator is the Political Paradox we can find our self in at times. And everyone does. it is part of the whole genie gig.

And as hard as it can be for us Staff, it can also be hard for other members and even staff to draw that distinction themselves.

 

 

I get ya... and I understand Ms Hickman has done a great job.... but sometimes plans are best changed to avoid uncomfortable things goin down. not sayin... just sayin... plus with 45 days and more groups coming aboard, we can make a better showing.

 

note: there was not 7000 there last fall. 2000 more likely... and a rally best beat those numbers this time around. But remember the unions had 10,000 and they still got their stuff handed to 'em...

 

Again, I will not criticize anyone wishing to exercise their rights in Lansing. That is absolutely cool. But for me it is just a bit too early. Yes I risk being too late. I also am aware of that fact. But until the last vote is taken, like Flowergirl, I will be up there asking the Dem Reps to vote these bills down, because I consider it time better spent than at a rally. If we don't ask them to vote no, and make a cogent case, well all might be lost. Yes they have the power to do as they see fit. But human touch is the last arrow in the quiver so to speak, and for me, I will try and get these bills voted down as my primary act of this drama...

[hofner67]

Its ok to talk to the legislature and speak truth to them. I just don't think we should panic and endorse " not as bad" bills. I would hate to think that a CPU endorsement resulted in making it possible to get the 75%. Somehow, I gotta think CPU wont endorse. That's my question.

[Timmahh]

we are together on that, We need ALL cross community help.

 

 

Together we stand, devided we're jailed.

[hofner67]

Got worried and talked to brandy of asa and of repeal it today. She doesn't think CPU will endorse and that 75% is unlikely. She's more in tune than I am.

[Celliach]

I don't believe that CPU is endorsing any of the bills in any form, but they are still trying to change them to be less detrimental to our community, I think.

[hofner67]

I don't believe that CPU is endorsing any of the bills in any form, but they are still trying to change them to be less detrimental to our community, I think.

Good. Thanks

[Hayduke]

Its ok to talk to the legislature and speak truth to them. I just don't think we should panic and endorse " not as bad" bills. I would hate to think that a CPU endorsement resulted in making it possible to get the 75%. Somehow, I gotta think CPU wont endorse. That's my question.

 

 

There has never been a real chance we would endorse one of the bills. That was just not so. We would potentially have been neutral if things were better language wise than they are. If you go back to testimony on March 1st, CPU clearly testified against 4834 and 4851. We made no comment on 4853, and would have been neutral on 4856 if they had not changed the language in the meeting at the end of March. Once those things occurred the die was cast. The CDAM atttorney's are also CPU members and they testified strongly against the bills (most specifically 4834 and 4851.

 

As it stands now, today, we are waiting for further discussions with Reps to see if we can still impact some language changes. Likely any such changes will not change our overall opposition to all the bills.

[+Malamute]

CPU does not support these bills.

 

CPU does not support these bills.

 

CPU does not support these bills.

 

:-)

 

Just to make it clear.

 

 

We recommend everyone phone, write, email and/or meet in person with their representatives and ask them to vote against these bills. I personally suggest focusing towards completely voting against HB 4834 and attempting to change language if possible elsewhere.

 

 

Heres a good example:

 

HB 4856. We all know the new language is absolutely messed up. So,... what do we do? Do we simply ignore it and oppose it, or do we try to fix it and oppose it?

 

This is a real time issue. What would you do?

 

We all know that bill is likely to pass, so do we try to fix it to at least make sense then ask people to oppose it, or do we just ignore it and hope for the best?