Some Stuff On Sec. 8 But Also Some Other Stuff And Some Bickering, Off Topic Stuff And Some Name Calling-sprinkled With A Pinch Of Tangential Opinions

[GanjaWarrior]

I'm wrong? Did I not say 'costs'? Is caregiver time not costs? That said, being a caregiver and 'costing' those services out must have a basis in similar occupations- greenhouse workers for example don't make $200 an hour, even if a caregiver feels they should be able to charge that. What I specifically said was costs vs street or market value. It is a hobby where you can recover your costs, not a commercial business. Medicine, which is what I do, is a commercial business. A legal commercial business, so ar hospital services, etc. Being a caregiver is not a commercial endvor.

 

So actually I am not wrong, and it is clearly listed in the Act as I stated it. I am not going down the road of the and a, that has been settled and I am not reopening it. What is NOT listed is ANY patient, which is what you seem to be trying to promote. That is NOT in the law.

 

Dr. Bob

 

 

when you compare the green house worker to a caregiver is that the same as me comparing your "dr" status to being a secretary....the care giver and the green house worker do both work with plants... the same you just sign papers and so does the secretary. if you think being a greenhouse worker, and a caregiver are the same we might have arrived back at that point where you don't know what your talking about and probably should just keep quiet.

with that said, reasonable compensation for labor and materials/cost is all anyone should ask...but some politicians seem to think its the cost of materials only.

[cristinew]

some green house workers are better than some caregvier s

[+Malamute]

What exactly is the difference between a medical marijuana caregiver in Michigan and a Medicinal herb greenhouse employee(i.e. ginseng, echinacea etc)?

 

 

*shrug*

[SFC]

I think we have gotten off track again. I personally do not care what a "greenhouse" worker does. Although if I could make what I do in my regular business running a greenhouse I think it would be a pretty neat job.

[bobandtorey]

I think the SC will see, again in the plain language of the law, that patients are permitted to transfer among each other, to include for a price, and that non-patient caregivers will be required to work only with those patients who have designated them.

I think the SC will see, again in the plain language of the law, that patients are permitted to transfer among each other

i don't think that will happen IMHO only if you are connected to that caregiver back in 08 -2009 we here at the MMMA talked about it on these forms if you are a patient you can get your meds any wear and be OK it's the person that you get them from that could get arrested

[bobandtorey]

When speaking about plant material and the money they might receive, I think the line is drawn between goods and services.

 

When a person exchange plant material for cash, and this cash is from a person with whom there IS a signed and registered connection, this is a permitted service for with compensation is allowed.

 

When a person exchange plant material for cash, and this cash is from a person with whom there NO signed and registered connection, this is the sale of a good, which NOT allowed.

 

In the beginning, I followed that small transfers between PATIENTS was allowed under Section 4, but this has been stuck down (no more puff, puff, pass). Still, I can see PATIENTS transfers under Section 8.

and i agree

[bobandtorey]

.you must get it from "A" caregiver..... na i will grow my own,,

 

2) for each registered qualifying patient who has specified that the primary caregiver will be allowed under state law to cultivate marihuana for the qualifying patient,

 

for the qualifying patient, ,,, that damm restrictive word " the " again hey?

the word( A and The) i think has been to the C,O,A and has not been ruled on as yet but will be soon imho

[bobandtorey]

It seems to me that what we are dealing with here are your expectations based on your ignorance.

am sorry WHO'S ? ignorance

[bobandtorey]

I do think you are in the ballpark on business planning for caregivers, though I really do believe there are far too many variables to make a generalization. Some deliver to their family members or neighbors, others across counties. Some patients require frequent deliveries and additional care or processing of their meds, some require special strains that yield far less than others.

 

All in all, the whole discussion is a red herring if you are trying to come up with a per gram rate that all caregivers should adhere to. The inability to even give guidelines to most of these items should be an indicator: there is no clear legal requirement in this area that can tell us whether or not any individual caregiver is in compliance with the law based on his price.

and i agree

[bobandtorey]

I tend to agree on this, and accept your acceptance. I have not seen a prosecutor anywhere question income or pricing like that, not even in the dispensary cases.

i also agree we have not seen it as yet because the prosecutor's have not used it yet i say yet they have the C.O.A on their side for now

[bobandtorey]

It should only have a role if selling into the black market is an option for that caregiver. It really should not be an option, but the similar treatment of selling to non-connected cardholders and non-cardholders by some rogue jurisdictions has muddied the waters immensely.

 

You must admit if it were clearly legal to sell to any cardholder it would largely disconnect us from black-market pricing.

WOW this is right-on

[+mayorherb]

i think its very important that we listen to the court...we must view the law with the plain language the voters did... remember "a" caregiver isnt the same restrictive word as "the" "his" hers"....you must get it from "A" caregiver.....

(g) A person shall not be subject to arrest, prosecution, or penalty in any manner, or denied any right or privilege, including but not limited to civil penalty or disciplinary action by a business or occupational or professional licensing board or bureau, for providing a registered qualifying patient or a registered primary caregiver with marihuana paraphernalia for purposes of a qualifying patient's medical use of marihuana. Then we have this one. :: (k) Any registered qualifying patient or registered primary caregiver who sells marihuana to someone who is not allowed to use marihuana for medical purposes under this act shall have his or her registry identification card revoked and is guilty of a felony punishable by imprisonment for not more than 2 years or a fine of not more than $2,000.00, or both, in addition to any other penalties for the distribution of marihuana. ( key words> who sells marihuana to someone who is not allowed to use marihuana for medical purposes under this act .With this being said..AS long as you are in the regisrty ,you can transfer..but ONCE you go outside of the registary, you are done.

[+mayorherb]

(g) A person shall not be subject to arrest, prosecution, or penalty in any manner, or denied any right or privilege, including but not limited to civil penalty or disciplinary action by a business or occupational or professional licensing board or bureau, for providing a registered qualifying patient or a registered primary caregiver with marihuana paraphernalia for purposes of a qualifying patient's medical use of marihuana. Then we have this one. :: (k) Any registered qualifying patient or registered primary caregiver who sells marihuana to someone who is not allowed to use marihuana for medical purposes under this act shall have his or her registry identification card revoked and is guilty of a felony punishable by imprisonment for not more than 2 years or a fine of not more than $2,000.00, or both, in addition to any other penalties for the distribution of marihuana. ( key words> who sells marihuana to someone who is not allowed to use marihuana for medical purposes under this act .With this being said..AS long as you are in the regisrty ,you can transfer..but ONCE you go outside of the registary, you are done.

(e) A registered primary caregiver may receive compensation for costs associated with assisting a registered qualifying patient in the medical use of marihuana. Any such compensation shall not constitute the sale of controlled substances.

[cristinew]

2) for each registered qualifying patient who has specified that the primary caregiver will be allowed under state law to cultivate marihuana for the qualifying patient,

 

for the qualifying patient, ,,,

 

not any patient

[+mayorherb]

I think you are being too absolute in your statement. Most courts are not seeing it that way yet, and this is probably the primary way patients and their caregivers are being dragged into the system. I would think we should be erring on the side of preventing arrest at this point when we advise people on how to behave legally, i.e. to enjoy the full protections of being a cardholder: immunity from arrest, prosecution, or any penalty.

(e) A registered primary caregiver may receive compensation for costs associated with assisting a registered qualifying patient in the medical use of marihuana. Any such compensation shall not constitute the sale of controlled substances.

here is where i found the rules..:: http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(coxegi2qq2ht3y55lmiv23nj))/mileg.aspx?page=getObject&objectName=mcl-333-26424 . The Supreme Court ruled that they need to see it as it is written. Read it in plain language .Its not oUR fault that MOST cops/Judges do not read the entire law/act.

[cristinew]

Read it in plain language

 

2) for each registered qualifying patient who has specified that the primary caregiver will be allowed under state law to cultivate marihuana for the qualifying patient,

 

for the qualifying patient, ,,,

 

not any patient

[Restorium2]

Yup. That's why the law says 5. It said 5 and it means 5. You don't even have to do fuzzy math on it.

[+mayorherb]

here is where i found the rules..:: http://www.legislatu...e=mcl-333-26424 . The Supreme Court ruled that they need to see it as it is written. Read it in plain language .Its not oUR fault that MOST cops/Judges do not read the entire law/act.

and medical use_ http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(coxegi2qq2ht3y55lmiv23nj))/mileg.aspx?page=getObject&objectName=mcl-333-26423

here is where i found the rules..:: http://www.legislatu...e=mcl-333-26424 . The Supreme Court ruled that they need to see it as it is written. Read it in plain language .Its not oUR fault that MOST cops/Judges do not read the entire law/act.

This is how i understand the law..and the S/C said to give it the plain language..This is just my Opinion..

[+mayorherb]

e) A registered primary caregiver may receive compensation for costs associated( with assisting ( a )registered qualifying patient in the medical use of marihuana. Any such compensation shall not constitute the sale of controlled substances. I understand when they say A qualifing patient.. They mean A patient, not mine , but( A) patient..

[cristinew]

(1) 2.5 ounces of usable marihuana for each qualifying patient to whom he or she is connected through the department's registration process;

 

(2) for each registered qualifying patient who has specified that the primary caregiver will be allowed under state law to cultivate marihuana for the qualifying patient

 

plain language the the supreme court will read ,,,,, not for any patient THE PATIENT clear and plain

[+mayorherb]

e) A registered primary caregiver may receive compensation for costs associated( with assisting ( a )registered qualifying patient in the medical use of marihuana. Any such compensation shall not constitute the sale of controlled substances. I understand when they say A qualifing patient.. They mean A patient, not mine , but( A) patient..

then there is K. (k) Any registered qualifying patient or registered primary caregiver who sells marihuana to someone who is not allowed to use marihuana for medical purposes under this act shall have his or her registry identification card revoked and is guilty of a felony punishable by imprisonment for not more than 2 years or a fine of not more than $2,000.00, or both, in addition to any other penalties for the distribution of marihuana...As this sounds to be..his WHO SELLS TO SOMEONE WHO IS NOT ALLOWED TO USE MARIJUANA FOR MEDICAL PURPOSES UNDEER THIS ACT SHALL HAVE HIS OR HER REGISTRY IDENIFACTION REVOKED..Plus what ever the cops charge the person with..so i understand it has as long as the person in in the reg. you cant be punished.

[+mayorherb]

then there is K. (k) Any registered qualifying patient or registered primary caregiver who sells marihuana to someone who is not allowed to use marihuana for medical purposes under this act shall have his or her registry identification card revoked and is guilty of a felony punishable by imprisonment for not more than 2 years or a fine of not more than $2,000.00, or both, in addition to any other penalties for the distribution of marihuana...As this sounds to be..his WHO SELLS TO SOMEONE WHO IS NOT ALLOWED TO USE MARIJUANA FOR MEDICAL PURPOSES UNDEER THIS ACT SHALL HAVE HIS OR HER REGISTRY IDENIFACTION REVOKED..Plus what ever the cops charge the person with..so i understand it has as long as the person in in the reg. you cant be punished.

sorry i forgot this part( where i found K .. http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(coxegi2qq2ht3y55lmiv23nj))/mileg.aspx?page=getObject&objectName=mcl-333-26424

[Mememe]

Read it in plain language

 

2) for each registered qualifying patient who has specified that the primary caregiver will be allowed under state law to cultivate marihuana for the qualifying patient,

 

for the qualifying patient, ,,,

 

not any patient

 

Cultivate is not the same as transfer. A CG can only cultivate for their 5 patients but may assist ( a )registered qualifying patient. IMO

 

(g) A person shall not be subject to arrest, prosecution, or penalty...for providing a registered qualifying patient or a registered primary caregiver with marihuana paraphernalia for purposes of a qualifying patient's medical use of marihuana.

Edited June 30, 2012 by Mememe

[bobandtorey]

here is where i found the rules..:: http://www.legislatu...e=mcl-333-26424 . The Supreme Court ruled that they need to see it as it is written. Read it in plain language .Its not oUR fault that MOST cops/Judges do not read the entire law/act.

and you are right it is not are fault but they are the one's that do matter IMHO

[bobandtorey]

then there is K. (k) Any registered qualifying patient or registered primary caregiver who sells marihuana to someone who is not allowed to use marihuana for medical purposes under this act shall have his or her registry identification card revoked and is guilty of a felony punishable by imprisonment for not more than 2 years or a fine of not more than $2,000.00, or both, in addition to any other penalties for the distribution of marihuana...As this sounds to be..his WHO SELLS TO SOMEONE WHO IS NOT ALLOWED TO USE MARIJUANA FOR MEDICAL PURPOSES UNDEER THIS ACT SHALL HAVE HIS OR HER REGISTRY IDENIFACTION REVOKED..Plus what ever the cops charge the person with..so i understand it has as long as the person in in the reg. you cant be punished.

i for one agree that is does say what you have posted but would add if you are going to do this and may end up in court it will cost you more then money it will cost you years of stress that no one will every get back even if your case gets dismissed you won't be happy the rest of someones life it changes' you in a way no one could imagine