Regulate Like Alcohol?

[kev]

I support regulate cannabis like alcohol but.... I can go to a liquor store and buy 15 cases of beer and 10 fifths of alcohol  if I want...enough to kill many people ...BUT I am limited to the amount of cannabis I can buy or have in my possession? I know the limits are to help legalize it just seems odd that we would be limited with the drug that is impossible to overdose on and NO limits on a drug that kills hundreds daily. 

[imiubu]

Cannabis is nothing like alcohol and I for one do not want it regulated 'like' alcohol.

So what then?  ATF controls cannabis?  I don't think that sounds like a good solution at all.

[imiubu]

The only sane solution is for the federal gov't to de-schedule cannabis completely.

[outsideinthecold]

What is wrong with the MMMA? or MMJ for that matter?

 

Although both LEO on one side and 'Free the Weed' folks on the other have both worked against it, the MMMA remains the most rational starting point for ending eighty-five years of demonization of an incredible plant.

 

Once-a-year visit to a doctor? Is that bad?

 

Twelve plants per patient and the 2.5 ounce limit won't make caregivers millionaires overnight but it does allow reasonably competent growers to build viable small home businesses for themselves to benefit their patients. Is that bad?

 

Problems arose not from the MMMA in my opinion but from zealots on both ends of the spectrum; greedy police and dispensary operations.

 

So my first concern is keeping the MMMA protections for caregivers and patients.

 

My second point is the MMMA doctor endorsement regime should be broadened to include alcohol. Why in the heck don't alcohol people get Doctor recs?

Edited February 13, 2016 by outsideinthecold

[Restorium2]

The MMMA seems to work good when you are very careful. When all it takes is throwing some leaves in your trash to result in a warrant. Then a task force kicks down the door of a house with a legal grow in it.... we have some ways to go. When you can't even smell like marijuana without a task force kicking down the door of a house with a legal grow in it we have some ways to go. 

There are so many legal grows right now in Michigan that kicking in a door because of some leaves in the trash, or a marijuana odor, is just plain wrong. Until we sue them raggity for doing these things, and they quit, the MMMA will not be a completely safe venture for anyone. We have some work to do and it's clear where the problem is; law enforcement. We don't need any new rules or regulation like alcohol. We should really be way past that. We opened the flood gates to find more unconstitutional gates put up by law enforcement behind the ones we tore down legally. We are on the right side of the law and they are not. 

[t-pain]

yes, the only thing that will stop the police are lawsuits winning damages for violating mmma patients/caregiver rights.

 

or the decrim/legalization of marijuana.

[t-pain]

My second point is the MMMA doctor endorsement regime should be broadened to include alcohol. Why in the heck don't alcohol people get Doctor recs?

prohibitions of alcohol never worked and caused many problems for a lot of people. the same way prohibition of cannabis is causing many problems today.

[Restorium2]

yes, the only thing that will stop the police are lawsuits winning damages for violating mmma patients/caregiver rights.

 

or the decrim/legalization of marijuana.

Really? I can't believe you posted that. It's total nonsense because we would just attempt to teach them again. For years and years. Decide they will never learn what they don't want to learn and then we will need to sue them. Merrily we roll around is not a game you want to play with law enforcement. They have tripped the circuit breaker and it's not real to think they will not blow it again. 

[Restorium2]

Unless you were talking real legalization? Not MiLegalize type of legalization.

[t-pain]

i'm talking both at this point.

 

just look at colorado, washington, DC and alaska. and oregon.

[Restorium2]

i'm talking both at this point.

 

just look at colorado, washington, DC and alaska. and oregon.

I know what our thugs(law enforcement) will do with MiLegalize. I'm not sure you have a decent comparo going on. Do you understand the ground game in those states like you do with Michigan? Do you understand their intent like you do here? I'm seeing more amendments and bad warrants here as a result of anything until we change players/motives.

[t-pain]

ok resto, whats the ground game like here in michigan wrt changing the players/motives ?

 

nothing?

 

districts are still gerrymandered. people still voting republican. republicans still having terrible choices for candidates.

 

not really seeing a way out here.

[Restorium2]

ok resto, whats the ground game like here in michigan wrt changing the players/motives ?

 

nothing?

 

districts are still gerrymandered. people still voting republican. republicans still having terrible choices for candidates.

 

not really seeing a way out here.

Gotta start with the cops and prosecutors. We need to make leaves and smell unqualified events for obtaining a warrant before we do anything else or it will keep happening regardless of what you put in front of the law makers. It has to be a grass roots thing starting with the dinosaurs in law enforcement. They have the wrong attitude to move forward as true partners in this adventure. Making new laws and rules are like making a law that's going to make your dog not crap in the house. Wouldn't work. 

[Restorium2]

not really seeing a way out here. 

 

People are doing it. Win in court with a jury then go after them for the damages. It's a tough row to hoe. Until you have hoed that row it's all just making things more complicated. 

[t-pain]

so you're in agreement we need to sue AND win (unlike people v brown coa case) AND get cannabis to be legal. and voting out the losers.

 

you argue a lot even when we agree

[Restorium2]

so you're in agreement we need to sue AND win (unlike people v brown coa case) AND get cannabis to be legal.

 

you argue a lot even when we agree

That's what they say. A lot of times I'm just using your words as spring board to make a point. You make a great spring board. 

[outsideinthecold]

Being retired and hanging out at a community health club and pool, I probably spend more time in a locker room with cops in various states of undress than most here. It is always an unpleasant experience but I can't afford the high dollar RAC favored by the political elite of both parties.

 

As individuals cops are tolerable and seem quite normal. But in a group or work environment they seem to sink to some lower level of consciousness. I attribute this paradox to several influences; the public sector police union, the FOP versus citizens divide, and the politicized police leadership, all of which has created the chasm that separates the average cop doing a difficult and thankless job from the citizens they supposed protect and serve.

 

This is a failure of leadership, first and foremost starting with the Arrest-and-Punishment Industry those leaders built to justify ever bigger budgets to allow more arrests requiring ever larger budgets. Given half a chance the police chiefs and their political allies like Rick Jones should build a world where half the people are in jail and the other half work to keep them there.

[Restorium2]

Being retired and hanging out at a community health club and pool, I probably spend more time in a locker room with cops in various states of undress than most here. It is always an unpleasant experience but I can't afford the high dollar RAC favored by the political elite of both parties.

 

As individuals cops are tolerable and seem quite normal. But in a group or work environment they seem to sink to some lower level of consciousness. I attribute this paradox to several influences; the public sector police union, the FOP versus citizens divide, and the politicized police leadership, all of which has created the chasm that separates the average cop doing a difficult and thankless job from the citizens they supposed protect and serve.

 

This is a failure of leadership, first and foremost starting with the Arrest-and-Punishment Industry those leaders built to justify ever bigger budgets to allow more arrests requiring ever larger budgets. Given half a chance the police chiefs and their political allies like Rick Jones should build a world where half the people are in jail and the other half work to keep them there.

They just hire the wrong people to do a difficult job. Their training is lacking. Most cops are scared to death in just about any situation because they are terribly under trained for the task at hand. A cop should be able to dis arm anyone with a knife because of their training. We have cops shooting people because they can't do their job. They are weak. They can't handle the situation mentally or physically. When you have a decent cop that is well trained they do their job like it is supposed to be done and there is no problem. 

[Restorium2]

[beourbud]

If it weren't for the republican Kesto Cartel trying to cash in on our meds/rec we would be a lot closer to some of the more civilized , compassionate countries. Greed = Michigan Republican Representation. Greed Sucks.

 

The Solution = Abrogate.

 

It's not to late to Save the State!

 

Bernie Sanders / Abrogate. 2016

[beourbud]

Outsideinthecold

 

I hope you get paid by the word.

 

Who do you support for potus?

 

The problem with your perspective is that it is the minority, and shrinking every day.

[Norby]

Actually it's not.  Both parties are at all time low's and independents are at an all time high.  Lot's of people are realizing that it's not that party that corrupts.  Don't worry, you'll see it eventually BB. 

 

http://www.gallup.com/poll/180440/new-record-political-independents.aspx

[beourbud]

Actually it's not. Both parties are at all time low's and independents are at an all time high. Lot's of people are realizing that it's not that party that corrupts. Don't worry, you'll see it eventually BB.

 

http://www.gallup.com/poll/180440/new-record-political-independents.aspx

That is correct, Everyone is sick of the establishment party's

 

There are the Democrats and there are fknrepublicans , But tthen there is Bernie Sanders an Independent From Vermont

 

People are looking for someone outside of establishment politics.

They are looking for an Independent Leader who will take on the Establishment Status Quo.

They are looking for a leader that understands that representing and serving the public is not just a job description , it's a privilege.

They are looking for an Leader who has been a consistent advocate for the middle class.

They are looking for real solutions to real problems

 

As the polls show and will continue to show...Bernie is the Man!

Edited February 19, 2016 by beourbud

[Wild Bill]

A cop should be able to dis arm anyone with a knife because of their training.

 

I used to teach martial arts. The minimum safe distance away from a person with a knife is generally considered to be twenty five feet. Any closer than that and I would shoot them if I had a gun.

 

Here's an old police training video for your amusement.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-lDtCHFmvg

[Restorium2]

Why not just think of an easy solution? A large net shot out of a gun seems like a no brainer;

Edited February 19, 2016 by Restorium2