Guns And Mmm Patients

[phaquetoo]

I don't expect anything, I have aspergers.  I am very smart but unless social rules are spelled out for me I don't know how to act. I don't get the simple things in social interaction. Make fun of it, my wife does.  I'm just trying to find my group and get along in the world, I see things from lots of different perspectives and it's confusing, tell me when I'm getting a little aspy. 

This new info kinda makes me have to look at things in a new way.  I'm not going to recluse from the world again but I need help in figuring out this new situation.  I just don't get it when people don't want me around, my interaction is basically thru exchange of information, I call it a blind spot and I have lots of them.  I don't know how better to explain it.  This is me?  I see a view and I try and present a different view, it makes things confusing but I do that to make decisions and I can't not be me.  I've had to bow to how others see things my whole life but few try and look at things from a different perspective than their own.  I need to feel safe to be able to present my view.  I'm sorry I can't follow a template and suppress my questions I have for myself to figure how to act.  It's my nature to try and have people see things from the other side, I feel sometimes there is no answer and I explore that.  If I rock the boat too much from the programmed template of interaction here let me know.  I don't know what else to say. If I don't fit, let me know I'm quite fine moving from group to group, I've done it my whole life.  I don;t have "friends" I have activities partners.  It's  different way of living caused by neanderthal DNA which was inbred for 100,000 years before they interbred with Homo Sapiens, it's a much deeper, non social programming. I feel better with animals than humans and I just lost my dog this week and need distraction, that's why I'm here and have my panties in a bunch.  So that's me.  Neanderthals lived in small groups and they had to stick together no matter what happened, they had to rely on themselves a lot.  I'm programmed to want to keep teh group together.  If it falls apart I leave it's just how I'm programmed.  I don't know how else to explain it.

 

Adn I'm completely fine with who I am now that I understand why I am like I am.  Just trying to get thru with this new info and get better at being out in the world. 

And i should add I have lifelong friends who love to be around me, I don't want anyone feeling sorry for me.  I'd rather get the ques and be around people who enjoy who I am.  I have friends all over the country that are muslim, gay/lesbian, redneck, hippie, gun nuts, anti gun nuts, christian conservative, cops, liberal, corporate, drs. scientists, etc.etc.   But I don't keep in touch but could go there tomorrow and not miss a beat because they know me and I've been around them long enough to know how to take things.  I'd help any one of you on the street whether I knew who you were or not, or whether we argued or see eye to eye or fought day in and out. I don't "fit in" in this world because I was meant to change it and I take that seriously.  I'd rather not waste my time if I'm not getting it and don't fit in.  but no one answers my questions, they just pick one and try to tear that apart to take focus away from teh hard questions I ask, which is not good for eaither of us since there is another way.  But if you say I shouldn't do something I'm going to ask why and continue questioning until i fully understand it.  that's why my wife won't let me take free classes with any of her collegues.  Cause I'm a pain in the donkey if i don't get it.

I have met you in person!  You came way out of your way to support some one you dont know, the person dont even post here no longer!  Thank You for your support!

Someone would have to assure me that he was incapable of violence. But he has already tried his best to assure me he is capable of violence. Not sure why you'd hope to have him back, do you know him personally?

Did any one assure you I wasnt going to follow thru with any of my personal threats?  seems my threats usualy just get deleted!  I beleive he had a bad day and deserves another chance!

I don't agree with what dro man said either, but I can't believe you would kick someone outta here for saying something you don't agree with, you say we don't give up our rights to be patients which I agree with but do we give up our rights, such as freedom of speech, when we come here on your great forum? Why can't you let people disagree, it brings conversation, which is what it's all about. I've seen this site get dragged way down when it was micromanaged before, took a while to come back, hope that doesn't happen again, that really sucked!

 

you think this site has come back?  I wish!

That won't happen again, and that is not what is happening here.

It will happen again,  I have no problems with resto or bb (beourbud) or mal, but I have argued with them so many times I couldnt even begin to count!  a coupld of real good button pushers lol!

 

Hmm,  I just read the thread.

 

 First off, the Abominable douchebag was way out of line.  It is one thing to call people names and something completely different to advocate serious violence directly towards a person.  Not just a "I wanna kick your donkey", but repeated direct threats. I would have banned him in a heartbeat from any forum.

 

Next, I assume Abominable was an NRA member. The NRA refuses to support medical cannabis patients rights to guns; EVEN if completely not under the influence. They believe anyone who uses cannabis ever should not have a gun.  The NRA also believes anyone ever convicted of a felony for marijuana possession should never have a gun again(that is as low as 10 grams in some states). As in EVER again.

 

I simply disagree.  I guarantee if you allowed all marijuana users to own and use guns, and banned anyone with any domestic abuse history, assault, bar fights etc. from owning or using a gun,  a lot of gun problems would disappear.

 

 

Now to Norby,  why is it you believe that a post on this forum means nothing?  You are insanely wrong on that.

 

First off, every single post ever made on this site is kept and recorded at Michigan law enforcement facilities.  EVERY, SINGLE, ONE.  I remember back in like late 2009 the board of MMMA had a law enforcement meeting and they showed up with the entire record of the website printed out. Heh.

 

Also, ask Bob if a single post made a difference in his life and many others since.

 

Also,  many times topics discussed here are picked up by LEO, Legislative staff or others,  and used against us to effect change against us.  Rarely for us, almost always against us.

 

Also, many topics are picked up in searches and referenced for a point of literary views.

 

Also, many posts on this forum have been used as justification for activities of pt/cg's that fall outside of the MMMAct, in which those people were arrested for listening to BAD information spewed by ill informed people on this forum.  Bad advice from dumb people has led to criminal convictions  directly attributed to single topics on this forum previously.

 

I could keep going, but, yes, one stupid post or topic can cause great harm.  Rarely does one post cause great good though.  That takes work and effort as a community to create great threads filled with invaluable information that people can use irrefutably to support patients and caregivers from the lies about cannabis and its users.

 

This topic is not one of those great efforts to say the least.

 

Firearms and cannabis patients is the 3rd most popular question I have ever received about medical marijuana.  By no comparison really.

 

1) How  do I get my card?

2) Where do I get marijuana from?

3) Can I keep my guns?

 

4+) doctors? laws? costs? etc after that.

 

A nice viral thread explaining Guns, patients rights, fallacies about cannabis impairment etc would have been what I wanted to see.

 

Not this pile of crap of cannabis patients throwing themselves and  their rights under the bus.

I totaly threatened celliach in your site, I didnt get banned!

 

all of you ganged up on imi, All of you, I was the only one that came to her side and stuck up for her, so no you wouldnt and didnt bann some one, I beleive I was worse than abom when I threatened celliach in your site!

 

Nubs.

 

Are you trying to say newbies?  just wondering, if so, just becuase you have been here reading or popping in since 09 dont make you a vetran,,,,,,,,,where have you been the first 6 or 7 yr nubs?

Someone would have to assure me that he was incapable of violence. But he has already tried his best to assure me he is capable of violence. Not sure why you'd hope to have him back, do you know him personally?

 

he made a mistake, lets all get banned that has made mistakes and just shut this site down!

if you can help just a person or two with your presence then its worth it Norby.

I've paid close attention to your cannabis pairings and results. I trust your cannabis

reviews and look forward to your project fruits.

 

To better understand the forum I've accepted that some things cant be discussed in the open.

Its not always the way it is that matters, but the way its portrayed that matters. What is and

what should be are causes of disruption issues. Speaking opinions concerning what is may seem to readers

as written in stone, when it might not be. Talking about what should be seems to be,  or the way it could be, or the way you want it to be--.. thats the rah rah,-- not posting about what is. 

 

One issue I find with this type of direction is the groups doing the direction must be totally trusted to follow. While ideals may be sound and agreeable the messengers can ruin the chance of acceptance of a particular ideal. If a handful of posters decide what is and what should be, squash any other opinion with zeal, to the point of calling out others as anti's, dea, cops, dispensary owners, leo etc, only keeps other valuable posters from expressing, in an attempt to avoid being attacked by a poster for a differing view.  That gets you here.

 

what we end up with is the ideals of a few posters, jogged back and forth, with no room for outsider opinion, speak louder and more often to get the point cemented,  works better in a living room than  a world accessible public website imo. When others  disagree with the groups' opinions, and  fear  being called a LEO in a cannabis forum, they likely wont post much, as we see. The few that wish to participate, possibly for higher learning and understanding, or just arguments' sake are holed up until they go with the herd,....you remember your sophomoric years right.?.... 

 

Luckily there are new posters often. Unaware of the politics they feel free to offer their take without fears.  During those times others get a moment to regroup.  Hang in there, your moment is approaching again soon!  Its easy maybe, if you agree with the mission of the forum/thread continue to support it, if not, dont.

 

have a great day Norby!

 

wtf is up with the new name,  Who are you?

If anyone really thinks AbominableDro-Man was banned for his opinion, go back and read the thread again. You are being willfully ignorant.

 

His post was far beyond describing a deserved donkey-kicking for somebody caught in the middle of a violent crime. It was a violent beating to death for somebody with a contrary opinion, followed up with his well-articulated assurances that it was backed up by real-life experience. I don't know what more to say; if it had fallen short of that, we'd still be talking about the thread subject.

 

again a bad day, no I dont think we should threaten people on here, but we also shouldnt gang up on people and continuiously push others buttons because we know where they are.

So, this is a thread about guns and cannabis?  Hmmm

 

 

It seems a distinction should be made between strictly rec users looking for a head buzz versus medical use to treat a condition.  Personally, if I needed to hunt, I would need to take medicine to treat pain and muscle spasms or my groans alone would be enough to scare off any game...lol 

 

Is it OK today to take vicodins/norcos and flexerils and then go hunting?  If so, then I would think I should be able to take cannabis based medicine to treat these conditions.  If not, then probably cannabis medicine should not be used either.  (Note: not legal advice, just my opinion)

 

Anyone know whether those prescription drugs would be allowed while hunting?

most of us were rec users when we grew up hunting and bought or were willed our guns!

 

Yes you can use your so called life saving meds while hunting as long as you are not impaired!

 

Peace

 

I look forward to seeing aboms post's very soon!

[Norby]

Are you purposely ignoring that washtenaut is speaking of NOT being visibly impaired just to make your point?

No just presenting another view, are you purposefully no answering my questions to pisss me off or because you have no answer?

[beourbud]

Like I said, it's a complex topic that shouldn't be discussed by people who get emotional on the topic.  Anyone can buy a gun and anyone over 21 can buy beer, but you can't do both at the same time, as far as i know in any state(an open beer while shooting a gun, or be under the influence) and alcohol isn't even comparable to MJ.  But it's allowed to do both.  All droman was saying, because I'm level headed and agree, was not to go to ranges after cutting down a plant and blazing a whole blunt, or not hunt on public land and smoke a joint in your stand.  I took it the right way and agree and he didn't have to dig in.  If you want to discuss all the intracacies of public land, private gun ranges and your own private land, well, they are all different according to that broad statement.  Now someone who is defensive and angry would automatically think he meant you can't smoke on your own private property and use a gun or if you are always medicated you should never use a gun to protect  yourself.    So if people don't chill the fuk out and be specific without judgement( I mean we ARE ALL patients here who the MMMA mission statement says they want to protect. 

I won't leave and I was joking about the cannabis cup and attending the booth, but my time here is directly proportional to how the group gets along, I just don't need or want this divisive habitat.  I don't want to think everytime I come on here how we can't even support the same legalization effort even though the STATE was able to band together for us, it's embarassing. 

So thats my take on it.

Starting to think New York asked you to leave.

[Norby]

That was not Dro-Man's position. You are misrepresenting it. People can go back and read this thread for themselves.

People dig in their heels when their personal opinion gets attacked and both go to the extremes, do I HAVE to read the thread, it's the same situation over and over.  I understand the template the actual words don't matter.

[+Malamute]

This statute uses the same language as the zero tolerance driving statute, which has already been answered by the Michigan Supreme Court in People v Koon. A patient with THC in their bloodstream is allowed to use a firearm.

 

Yea. I dont know the caselaw history on the statute.

[phaquetoo]

Starting to think New York asked you to leave.

You learn a new button and make sure you use it imediatly eh?

 

Not cool dude!

 

Norby is a good guy, I have met him have you, Im pleased he lives in MI,  We need more people like him around us and helping us with our mission of making mm the norm not the reefer madness!

 

Peace

[+Malamute]

 

 

I totaly threatened celliach in your site, I didnt get banned!

 

all of you ganged up on imi, All of you, I was the only one that came to her side and stuck up for her, so no you wouldnt and didnt bann some one, I beleive I was worse than abom when I threatened celliach in your site!

 

 

Aren't you just as cute as a button. Bless your soul.

 

It was up to Celliach whether to send you to your room without dinner.  He is much nicer than me. Which is kinda funny because he always came off as worse on forums. I always told him it was because he used too many guttural letters in his typing. Too many G's and K's and T's and such.  Heh.

 

You are kinda like a little gremlin bantering in your ear; pesky but mostly harmless.

 

As far as imiubu, I don't even remember what it was about or if i was involved. I will just assume I was right if I was involved.

 

[Restorium2]

Everyone knows how I feel about this from my posts earlier in the thread: I'm a hunter and a medical marijuana patient that would have a tad bit of thc in my blood at all times. This issue is the same as the driving issue. Most all patients (and their caregivers that pay attention) know that there are a lot of us that are not impaired while we have thc in our blood when tested. 

 

Now I would like to touch on the broader issue here; Medical Cannabis Patient Rights

 

Medical cannabis patients go through life with thc in their bloodstream. The people who wrote our law knew this. That's why they said that we couldn't be denied a right or privilege because we have thc in our bloodstream constantly. 

 

If you are an advocate for medical cannabis patient rights then you need to understand that there will be a lot of attacks on our rights. Our way of life. Unfair attacks that throw wet blankets on our lives. Attacking our right to drive and hunt just because we have thc in our bloodstream. This thread is an example of how hard people will try to shush us up when we are defending our rights. 

 

One would think this topic on a web site that should be full of full fledged cannabis patient advocates would be dominated by advocates advocating for a real impairment test, not a life long ticket to sit there on the couch because you have thc in your bloodstream. 

 

I'll keep banging the drum for fairness where ever I can, when ever I can. Zero tolerance isn't fair. A real impairment test is the only way to go for driving, hunting, anything that requires judgement and motor skills can be done safely with thc in your bloodstream. 

[phaquetoo]

Aren't you just as cute as a button. Bless your soul.

 

It was up to Celliach whether to send you to your room without dinner.  He is much nicer than me. Which is kinda funny because he always came off as worse on forums. I always told him it was because he used too many guttural letters in his typing. Too many G's and K's and T's and such.  Heh.

 

You are kinda like a little gremlin bantering in your ear; pesky but mostly harmless.

 

As far as imiubu, I don't even remember what it was about or if i was involved. I will just assume I was right if I was involved.

 

You realy think Im cute?    even after I sent you a pic?

 

You are'nt so bad your self,  some times I wish I wasnt bald, I wouldnt mind growing long hair on my head instead of my beard,ears and nose once in a while lol!

 

 

edited to add ears and nose lol

Edited August 9, 2016 by phaquetoo

[+Malamute]

Every single thing I have done in my life since i was like 14, has been done while "impaired" on marijuana.  Everything.

 

I seem to manage just fine. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Restorium2]

People dig in their heels when their personal opinion gets attacked and both go to the extremes, do I HAVE to read the thread, it's the same situation over and over.  I understand the template the actual words don't matter.

I recommend that anyone commenting here on this issue should first read the thread. How else are you going to make any sense? You can't just defend any idea you haven't even read because you have formed a team and are sticking to your team agenda/template.

[Norby]

Every single thing I have done in my life since i was like 14, has been done while "impaired" on marijuana.  Everything.

 

I seem to manage just fine. 

 

 

 

 

fly2.gif

Good for you(me too) but you do know there is a patient new to MJ everyday and hearing that they may get the wrong impression.  Maybe you just got used to it better than a few or better than most and weren't really impaired.

[Norby]

I recommend that anyone commenting here on this issue should first read the thread. How else are you going to make any sense? You can't just defend any idea you haven't even read because you have formed a team and are sticking to your team agenda/template.

I didn't form a team, you did.  You just can't see from any view except your own, which is always right.

Edited August 9, 2016 by Norby

[Norby]

So you want teams when it comes to milegalize and abrogate but......

 

Part of the problem is that I say things as I see them without judgement a lot of the times and it comes across as arrongant or like I'm asking the question to be a prick, which is not what I'm trying to do, I'm trying to get to the root of a problem (as I see it).  typing is definitely not my medium, too many words to describe a picture and things get taken too much the wrong way.  See you people in person, I'm done with this. at least for the day, it's too draining.

Edited August 9, 2016 by Norby

[Restorium2]

Slow on down there Norb. We were getting back on topic. Lets get more about the topic and less about personalities. 

[Restorium2]

Norby,

Do you think there are medical cannabis patients that can shoot a gun safely?

[+Malamute]

The quote of "impairment" is to say since marijuana metabolites stay in your system so long, under many laws I would  be considered "impaired" always.

 

It says you cannot even possess a gun while impaired. That would include constructive possession as well i will assume.

 

Anyhow, I don't think it is an issue.  You would have to be SERIOUSLY impaired, as in like you ate 10 grams of oil, for me to even slightly care you were using a gun. Not sure what people even think could happen.  It is  nothing like alcohol. Not even kinda sorta.  Nor is it anything like opioids. Heck, even caffeine would likely make you more trigger happy.  It isn't like marijuana will make you shoot all crooked. It might make you forget to shoot?...Bwahahahahaha....

 

Anyhow.  I support no restrictions on cannabis patients for guns.

[Restorium2]

I do support impairment restrictions for people with guns. I've seen some folks shooting while drunk and I wanted to hide behind a tree. They would have to be fair restrictions though. Like a field sobriety test. Same for everyone, not any one group singled out. 

[Restorium2]

The question for Norby is really for everyone. If you believe there are patients that can shoot a gun safely, even if you believe there are some that couldn't, then you have to see gun restrictions based on thc in your bloodstream is unfair. 

[+Malamute]

Well, I will fight for no restrictions and see what happens.

 

:-)

[Restorium2]

Well, I will fight for no restrictions and see what happens.

 

:-)

No restrictions based solely on your choice of medication. If the gun control advocates can make a real field sobriety test I would have to stand with them and their right to have people with guns have proper judgement and motor skills. Bullets travel far and people have a right to not be shot. 

[+Malamute]

Let me quote my original post in this thread:

 

 

 

 

 

Next, I assume Abominable was an NRA member. The NRA refuses to support medical cannabis patients rights to guns; EVEN if completely not under the influence. They believe anyone who uses cannabis ever should not have a gun.  The NRA also believes anyone ever convicted of a felony for marijuana possession should never have a gun again(that is as low as 10 grams in some states). As in EVER again.

 

I simply disagree.  I guarantee if you allowed all marijuana users to own and use guns, and banned anyone with any domestic abuse history, assault, bar fights etc. from owning or using a gun,  a lot of gun problems would disappear.

 

 

Ain't nobody gonna stand up for you but me and yourself.

 

So , i will stand for no restrictions. :-)

 

If you are truly impaired on marijuana, truly, then it should fall under a reckless endangerment type of law.  But 'they' will never be reasonable about impairment and marijuana. 

 

 It is nothing like alcohol or opioids etc where impairment is almost guaranteed. 

 

Cannabis is different.

[Norby]

Slow on down there Norb. We were getting back on topic. Lets get more about the topic and less about personalities. 

Why is that taboo?  I'm trying to solve an ongoing problem, why do we have to focus on what you want?  No one is debating whether he threatened you or not it's about what it meant and how others have been treated and a template of something that happens over and over to divide us.  Talk about what you want.

[Norby]

Norby,

Do you think there are medical cannabis patients that can shoot a gun safely?

I do because I do.  Do you think there are patients who can't?

Edited August 9, 2016 by Norby

[phaquetoo]

I would have no problem being tested as long as the test's were fair, 

 

Wtf they let people who drive motor cycles not wear helmets, but make people in automobiles wear a seat belt!

 

I am all for people being able to make their own choices, but dont others think it is pretty nutts that I can ride my bike w/o a helmet but cant drive my car w/o a seat belt!   That is retarded!

 

I truly am suprised people in cars dont have to wear helmets and bikers have to wear seat belts!  some laws are just so flawed it isnt funny!

 

I can drive and shoot my guns while I have thc in my system, I can burn one and go about my biz like I just popped a few oxci's, oops no I can do it better than when I pop oxci's, with oxci's if I let my guard down I wind up with keyboard forhead or in a vehicle I guess I would wind up with windsheild forhead and be dead!

 

I can drive down the street get pulled over for speeding and have my pill bottle in the open, as long as my name is on it and I dont act like drug addict im ok,  but god forbid you find a roach in my ash tray,  now im a hazzard to society,,,,,wtf!

 

ramble over!

 

Peace